sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Would anyone have tidal flow charts for the Elbe handy ?
tidal flow charts elbe
- Thread starter sailaboutvic
- Start date
johnalison
Well-known member
Sorry, not to hand. I usually relied on the tidal diamonds on Admiralty charts which were ancient but useful. For most of the river the current does what you would expect but at up to four knots or so. It gets a bit complicated at the mouth, where you can find slack water or even a counter current when you are expecting a knot or two under you, especially as you pass the island whose name I forget where they take people to gawp at seals. None of this really matters since once you are on your way there is no turning back. Brunsbuttel-Cuxhaven is only a couple of hours but from Cuxhaven onwards is is trickier because you only just get to the mouth if you set off at slack water before the tide turns against you. Our usual destination from there was Norderney, about sixty miles in all.
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
I'm getting quite a lot of conflicting info from people we meeting which is why I'm posted here as I know some have done this trip .
We been told the tide turned and ebb at HW Brunsbuttel others have said HW+1 and other HW+2 .
The weather is playing merry hell with strong Westerly and south Westerly, there a very small window coming up with wind dropping that evening for a bit
HW at Brunsbuttel around 1800 which won't give us much time to get to cuxhaven in day light especially if the current don't turn till HW+2 .
Which is why I'm like to get as close as I can with the info ,
If we don't that that one they nothing for the near future.
We been told the tide turned and ebb at HW Brunsbuttel others have said HW+1 and other HW+2 .
The weather is playing merry hell with strong Westerly and south Westerly, there a very small window coming up with wind dropping that evening for a bit
HW at Brunsbuttel around 1800 which won't give us much time to get to cuxhaven in day light especially if the current don't turn till HW+2 .
Which is why I'm like to get as close as I can with the info ,
If we don't that that one they nothing for the near future.
johnalison
Well-known member
Sorry I can’t be more exact just now. The passage isn’t too hard in the dark. There is mostly plenty of room outside the shipping channel, though you are allowed to sail in the Channel if tacking takes you there, but if motoring or free you are required to cross at a right angle. The Cuxhaven entrance looks easy enough but the tide will be running at three knots past it, so it needs a little care. It is likely that boats will have left spaces if going west as they will be leaving just before you, so it’s worth looking for a comfortable berth. The tally card machine is in the office corridor and accessible 24 hrs. You can pay by card and it will even return unused amounts when you leave.
If the weather is dodgy it is worth going to Cuxhaven early to wait for a window. It is a pleasant place to stay, with quite a lot of interest to see. I once saw a terrible forecast and got there early before fleets of Dutchmen returning home, staying there for the best part of a week, by which time it was chock-a-block. Shopping is not wonderful but there’s a Lidls not far away.
MontyMariner
Well-known member
As far as I can make out, the flow changes in line with the H & L as per the Ports as listed on this site
eg:
Tide Times and Tide Chart for Cuxhaven
Tide Times and Tide Chart for Brunsbuttel
so there is about 1hr 20min difference (give or take 10mins) on the start of the Flood between Cuxhaven and Brunsbuttel
eg:
Tide Times and Tide Chart for Cuxhaven
Tide Times and Tide Chart for Brunsbuttel
so there is about 1hr 20min difference (give or take 10mins) on the start of the Flood between Cuxhaven and Brunsbuttel
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Which is roughly what I worked them out to be .
although several people insisted it turns on HW a Brunsbuttel .
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
normally it wouldn’t matter but there only a small window ( not looked this morning so it may no longer be there) to get to Cuxhaven .
it’s a waiting game again once there ,
weather just not playing , we had NE all the way here , so it took almost twice as long tacking now it’s been W/SW ,
that we want to make our way back with long periods of strong 6 and 7 and in between with short times of lightly winds .
only the odd anchorage / harbour to shelter in within the 145 miles to Vlieland , where we plain to enter the Netherlands for a bit .
other option is Delfzijl and enter there but I understand there one bridge they working on and only open once on a Friday unless we happen to be lucky and there a ship passing and we can follow it through .
time will tell .
johnalison
Well-known member
Been there and done that! It is a shame that Delfzijl isn’t an option at the moment as it is the obvious one. The eastern part of the canal is a bit dull, with high banks but Groningen is pleasant. We never got as far as Vlieland in all the years we tried, and often returned via Lauersoog. Although it involves a few miles in the wrong direction this takes no time at all with the tide. The way in from the sea changes a lot and up to date charts are necessary. The Frisian way through Dokkum is very pleasant and you have the option of going down to Lemmer or perhaps out to sea via Harlingen, itself one of our favourite Dutch towns. Vlieland is lovely if you get there, but like all the islands gets very busy at weekends.
dunedin
Well-known member
Don’t know the waters, but you looked at the tidal flows shown on Navionics, do they help?
Generally if it is an issue with insufficient time, our approach is just start earlier. Unless the Pentland Firth or Corryvreckan, there is generally some way to make 2-3 knots against the tide if use the shore contours to used flows or back eddies..
Generally if it is an issue with insufficient time, our approach is just start earlier. Unless the Pentland Firth or Corryvreckan, there is generally some way to make 2-3 knots against the tide if use the shore contours to used flows or back eddies..
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
I found a lot of the time Navionics tide direction and timing isn’t right ,
it give current change 3 hours after HW Cuxhaven , that not right at all .
we probably start a bit earlier if we have to punch the current a bit its not going to be too bad as by then it be weak anyway .
johnalison
Well-known member
I'm fairly sure about my 1.5 hrs for Cuxhaven but less sure about Brunsbuttel, though it won't be much different, and there may be some difference between springs & neaps.
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Hi
well we arrived in Brunsbuttel and it’s HW+1 slack for anyone else who may be interested .
this is from a local sailor
thanks everyone for the input.
funnyi couldn’t find anything on the net ,
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
johnalison
Well-known member
I heard when we were last there that they were planning to build a bigger marina at Brunsbuttel but, looking at Google Earth it appears that it hasn't changed. I wonder if the showers are as basic as ever and that water hoses are still not given. This was us in 2010.
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Same marina John we on the other side by the locks , it pretty packet €10 night , no water pipe or power , cheap and cheerful. Just how we like it .
which marina did you use in Cuxhaven ,
it look like there two ,one just as you arrive. Look small possibly a club marina and then one further down look like a big marina in between look like a town marina .
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johnalison
Well-known member
Everyone uses the one in the middle of your chart, just before the ferry haven. I once cycled round to look at the ‘Americahaven’ but it looked very uninviting. The main one is a sort of YC with usually a good restaurant. The HM once laughed openly when he saw my wife looking bedraggled, and we saw another one gently stroking the rail of our then brand new boat. Funny people the Germans.
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
johnalison
Well-known member
You should have seen the state of a Westerly we once saw in Cuxhaven that had hit a buoy at a mere ten knots.
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
That was the easiest part we now got to head to the Netherlands tomorrow with a W SW blowing , that’s going to be fun .
if we can make Norderney and find some where to anchor and shelter from the blow that’s coming in the evening ,
that be a start .
just hoping for a little swing in the wind .
if we can make Norderney and find some where to anchor and shelter from the blow that’s coming in the evening ,
that be a start .
just hoping for a little swing in the wind .
johnalison
Well-known member
Norderney is one of my favourite places to waste a few days. The YC marina is fine but I don’t remember seeing anyone anchored in the area. Give Shifta’s regards to Willem if you see him, or better still Jurg, but I think he has retired.