The World's Mad

[Thistle]

The World\'s Mad

I see in today's news that a gentleman who has carried on the family tradition of using a rowing boat to save folk from the Clyde in Glasgow, and who is credited with saving about 1500 lives, is likely to be forced to give up because of health and safety concerns. Already Strathclyde Police can no longer call on his services.

Who's "health and safety" should take priority: one dedicated, highly experienced volunteer or all the people - on average about 1 per week - whose lives he will be prevented from saving?

Will they be closing down the RNLI next?

 

[KREW2]

Re: The World\'s Mad

Hi
I agree, along with many others that the western world has gone mad, it just needs certifying now.
KW

 

[Becky]

Re: The World\'s Mad

I heard him talking on Radio 4 this evening. He seemed such a nice man, and very philosophical about the passing of his work. It is daft that he is being stopped, presumably on the grounds of age, when he is the most experienced person around. I just hope he gets the respect and appreciation he deserves.

 

[graham]

Re: The World\'s Mad

It makes me despair.What happened to common sense?

 

[Superstrath]

Re: The World\'s Mad

They have almost shut down the Fire Service already. I know of one brigade where they are no longer allowing the use of the "Hooligan Tool" - a sort of elaborate crow-bar in world-wide use- in case the girls and boys hurt themselves.
And another where you need to have read and signed the risk assesment before you are allowed to use the kettle.

 

[Lakesailor]

Re: The World\'s Mad

I once was collared by a H&S officer for taking photographs from a rough terrain forklift truck. I was on a platform and had a safety harness on. It was in a pedestrian area next to new building. I was taking pics of the builders on the third floor at a large window apperture.
We hadn't known there was an H&S office opposite the building.
He complained that the harness was not good enough and that had I slipped I would not have been able to recover myself to the platform. Of course the forklift driver could have merely lowered me to the ground.
He also complained that the builders were stood too close to the (unglazed) window apperture and were not wearing safety helmets. It was true, as it was one of those "wave your hats in celebration" shots.
No one was hurt, Nothing happened.
The company I was doing it for was fined £1000.

I later realised that the previous development I had done progress shots on was still in view of the H&S office. Each month I would go up a 10 storey office block and walk around a parapet to take a shot of the work 8 stories below. Now that was a bit risky.
Of course I have no memory of this and no evidence exists.

 

[Dougie_the_Mate]

Re: The World\'s Mad

George Parsonage's father Ben was his predecessor as Glasgow Humane Society Officer. He had a wee boat yard on Glasgow Green and we used to hire rowing boats there during the summer months.

George was an art teacher and a talented artist in his own right who rowed for Britain in the Olympic Games. When his Dad retired he took over his duties and has been responsible for saving innumerable lives as well with fetching bodies from the river for many years - a job that not many people would fancy.

 

[billcowan]

Re: The World\'s Mad

The FRENCH dont even have a H&S department.
They dont go to war just to please Bush
They dont have a 'terrorism threat'
They dont bother with PC
They dont need 'accessability' ramps everywhere
They dont ruin salami by refrigerating it
They can park almost anywhere

Mind you - they are French.

 

[Parsonsheath]

Re: The World\'s Mad

Yes, I suppose there had to be a catch somewhere, mark you on balance if they were not French they would have all the other disadvantages

 

[flaming]

Re: The World\'s Mad

I think the reason given was that his assistant left, and the job was "too dangerous" for one man.

 

[TheBoatman]

Here\'s a thought!

I was just thinking that various Maritime legislation requires you to render assistance to those "in peril". So what if our man just happens to be paddling around when a call comes in, he's then duty bound to offer assistance and to hell with H & SE.

Just a thought? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Cornishman]

Re: The World\'s Mad

[ QUOTE ]
it just needs certifying now.



[/ QUOTE ] It just has been, but with a reduced majority!

 

[DeeGee]

No, not France

[ QUOTE ]
The FRENCH dont even have a H&S department.
...

[/ QUOTE ] I wondered about that; I have, right now, a major tree-felling exercise going on. The enormous cypress is down, and in pieces on my (ex-)lawn. They take the final lumps away on Monday.

When these three guys arrived on day 1, I was amazed when one of them climbed up in to the tree to saw the first lower branches off. He had two ropes. One was for hauling up his chainsaw, the other to attach to the branch so his mates below could guide its fall. He had no hard hat, no harness and was operating the chainsaw at times one-handed. I have used a chainsaw, and one-handed is very very dodgy. He went on like that for two days, getting higher and higher in the tree.

These were not cowboys, like you can find in UK, but 'Paysagistes' recommended by the Mairie (town-hall).

If this had been UK, they would have had to wear hard-hats, harnesses, ropes from harness to higher point, and the bill would have been doubled. But these guys know the risks, have been doing it since they were kids (one on the ground was about 17) and dont make mistakes. The other two were about 45 (in the tree) and 50.

Oh, sorry, forgot to confirm - this is North Brittany, France. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

They have an attitude where they say, these are the rules folks - now get on, ignore them at your own risks. A bit like the signs at motor racing venues IN UK!!

 

[AlexL]

Re: The World\'s Mad

Unfortunately this is what happens when the government throw billions of pounds around - all the agencies justify their existance by inventing more and more rubbish to do and thus generating more work, justifying more employees, bigger budgets, doing more work etc etc.
The HSE is the primary reason why I have stopped teaching scuba diving, as I cannot afford the money or time to get a commercial divers medical (aparently my pilots medical doesn't count), liability insurance, and write a detailed risk assesment for every dive (a bit difficicult when doing 6-8 training dives in a single day!)
Never mind at least I'm safer now - not allowed to have fun, but safer.

 

[lockwood]

Re: The World\'s Mad

This seems to be happening more and more. If people are prepared to puit themselves in a situation without hurting anybody else, why should they be stopped?

Laws are being made to protect the stupid from doing the obvious. If this continues, the country will be full of non risk taking thickos. Darwins theory of evolution suggests that we may evolve into a far LESS intelligent beings.

 

[Sans Bateau]

Re: No, not France

This is why we will never be closer to Europe. The secret agenda has too much to lose, too many 'jobs for the boys' are at risk.

You cannot turn the clock back, all these goverment departments have grown over the years. When one pointless PC or H & S project is complete, they have to find another to protect their own well being. If all the wasted money was directed into schools and hospitals we would have a social system as good as any in Europe.

And another thing, (a pet soap box for me). Why is everything so much cheaper in, say France, than the Uk? Someone tell me that!

Take your pick, cloud cookoo land or treasure island, we live there!

We always have a go at the French, is it envy?

 

[AlexL]

Re: No, not France

err the reason things are so expensive in this country is in this thread. Its the regulatory overhead (plus high property prices) that businesses have to deal with.
All this HSE etc stuff doesn't come free, a business needs to devote people and time to dealing with it, which costs money -which ultimately gets passed on to the customer.

 

[Sans Bateau]

Re: No, not France

Thanks for confirming my suspicions, that is my point, jobs for the boys (read government dept)

 

[Sgeir]

Re: The World\'s Mad

Interesting thread, and hope you don't mind if I take a slightly contrary view on this.

Despite the hype, this does not appear to be the result of some interference by a petty bureaucratic jobsworth, but "following a meeting with representatives from the police, the fire brigade and Glasgow Humane Society" (according to the Scotsman. The police and other parties, rightly or wrongly, have reconsidered the risk assessment following the departure of Mr Parsonage's assistant.

That's not as barmy as it may appear - the job incumbant prior to Mr Parsonage's father drowned in an accident on the river while carrying out his duties.

If Forumites and the good people of Glasgow feel sufficiently strongly about it then they may wish to consider putting some cash in the direction of the Glasgow Humane Society who could then fill the assistant post. The parties have said the matter would be reviewed if the assistant post is filled.

Mr Parsonage is dedicated to his work and disappointed about the police position, but has said he will still respond to requests from the public.

Thistle asks a really interesting question: "Who's "health and safety" should take priority: one dedicated, highly experienced volunteer or all the people - on average about 1 per week - whose lives he will be prevented from saving?".

I do not wish to make a "smart" point about a grisly business, but given that many of his clients (not all by any means) are people trying to terminate their own lives, or people spaced out on heavy drugs, I would unhesitatingly say Mr Parsonage's health and safety should be the Society's first priority.

 

[AlexL]

Re: The World\'s Mad

I'm not going to comment on this case as I don't know the details
[ QUOTE ]
have reconsidered the risk assessment

[/ QUOTE ]
However I have been at the recieving end of some of these so called risk assesments, and they are frankly rediculous. The HSE now look at 'theoretical' risks rather than actual stats of real risks that have actually happened.
This case may well be justified - I don't know, but I do know that in general the HSE and many other regulatory departments are completely out of control and doing some serious 'empire building'