The Radio Licence Penalties

[BarryH]

Re: yeah but

Bit like putting road tax on the price of petrol you mean. Nah! the fishermen would be up in arms about increased cost etc etc. I mean they babble away on it for hours.

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[sailorman]

Re: yeah but

yeh but they dont do radio checks do they.
theirs like mine ( fingers x ) always works.

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[steverow]

Operators Certificate...questions.

Mike,

With regard to the Certificate of Competence, (on which I'm sure you know my views by now) could I please ask you to clarify the following points.

1. How much of the course/exam fee is paid back to Ofcom by the RYA?(if anything)

2. Is there a SLA between Ofcom and the RYA, is it in the public domain, and who monitors it?

3. To what level of Radio Theory competence are the RYA Instructors trained
and who tests/monitors this?

4. Why is the installation and servicing of maritime radio uncontrolled.
Surely it is useless having a certificate of competence for operating when any Tom Dick and Harry can effect a maritime installation which may or may not work sufficiently well to operate in an emergency situation. I know of no other SOL service where this is the case.

5. To what type approval(s) are maritime radio equipments presently
manufactured and who controls, tests and carries out regulation on manufacturers and importers.


Steve.


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[chris66]

Mike et al,

1) Does a VHF on a British flagged vessel need to have a British licence or is any European licence OK.

2) Is an operators licence from another European country (ie france or italy) sufficient to use a licensed VHF on a Brittish flagged boat ?

Thanks


<hr width=100% size=1>Chris

 

[Mike_Martin]

Re: yeah but

Yep Kev, it is the latter.

Mike

<hr width=100% size=1>Team Executive,
Maritime & Aeronautical Team, Ofcom

 

[Mike_Martin]

Moral dilemma???? How do you work that out?

I'm sorry but we are talking about a licence which costs £20 per year for a ship station or £15 per year for a transportable. My own thinking in that situation would be what the hell am I doing on this boat, if they are short cutting on such an easy bit of admin as a SRL how do they maintain the tanks and gear.

The radio can be carried on board with a Radio licence alone. It can then be monitored and used for DISTRESS only without an Operators Certificate.

Mike

<hr width=100% size=1>Team Executive,
Maritime & Aeronautical Team, Ofcom

 

[Mike_Martin]

Re: Operators Certificate...questions.

1&2) RYA works for the MCA not Ofcom, Radio Operator Certificates became part of Sea Farer standards back in 1995.

3) If they worked for me things would be different!

4) SOLAS (ie compusory fit) vessels have installation standards, Voluntary fit avoid most of the rules including yearly Safety radio survey. Again though this is the province of the MCA.

5) The R&TTE Directive applies for Voluntary Fit kit whereas SOLAS vessels meet the Marine Equipment Directive. Once again though MCA territory.

Mike


<hr width=100% size=1>Team Executive,
Maritime & Aeronautical Team, Ofcom

 

[Mike_Martin]

The radio licence must come from the "Flag State" as callsigns and MMSI numbers are country specific.

Operator Certificate is an international syllabus the only hitch may be with the Authority to Operate element of the document.

Do me a favour and PM the question as I may forget to look it out for you.

Mike

<hr width=100% size=1>Team Executive,
Maritime & Aeronautical Team, Ofcom

 

[moodycruiser]

What happened to a crewmember being able to operate the vhf under the JURISDICTION of someone holding an operators licence then - this appears to have been missed in the discussion.

<hr width=100% size=1>Tony

 

[jfm]

question about application of penalties

Mike:
Something is unclear to me. You say "if we come across you using a radio without it" and mention on-t-spot fines. What if I am fully licenced, get stopped by one of your boys, but cannot produce a licence because it's at home or otherwise not available there and then? Does the law or your discretion allow the accused to produce the paperwork within say 30days? Or what? Are you contemplating on spot fines for people who merely dont have papers with them at the time?



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[Mike_Martin]

Sorry there's no such thing as a "jurisdiction" for an Authority to Operate, the wording is "supervision" usually preceded by direct and personal.

Mike

<hr width=100% size=1>Team Executive,
Maritime & Aeronautical Team, Ofcom

 

[Mike_Martin]

Re: question about application of penalties

As I stated this is something that Ofcom is discussing with the DTI.

I will ensure that I feed that into the discussions. My own feeling is that of course we will retain discretion in these circumstances, it would be a letter of contravention at that point which means action hasn't been taken yet due to some pending action.

Mike

<hr width=100% size=1>Team Executive,
Maritime & Aeronautical Team, Ofcom

 

[itsonlymoney]

I never new I would be opening such a can of worms with my original post on this subject !!!!!

I agree with "seaspray" better to have an unlicenced set than none at all.
As for the guy that would not use his vhf during a diving accident well what can I say.
Tcm's question relating to the number of succesfull prosecutions appears to have avoided.
Finally what a load of nonsence the whole thing is and is it not just another money making scam like speed cameras ?
Ian

<hr width=100% size=1>Play the best game you can with the cards you've been dealt ! ! !

 

[Dave_Snelson]

So I can smash an old lady over the head...

...and steal her pension - and not be treated in a court any where near as severely as using an unlicensed radio, which harms no one.

Yet another reason why Britain stinks!!! Our sense of legal, moral and community priorities needs a radical overhaul.

Bunch of dicks

Rant over.

<hr width=100% size=1>Madoc Yacht Club
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.madocyachtclub.co.uk>http://www.madocyachtclub.co.uk</A>

 

[BrendanS]

Re: So I can smash an old lady over the head...

How did you draw this conclusion? Magistrates have guidelines for severity of sentence, and I'm pretty sure they'd rank mugging an old age pensioner as deserving of a more punitive sentence, unless they are making a deterent sentence to warn other non licensed users

<hr width=100% size=1>Me transmitte sursum, caledoni

 

[Dave_Snelson]

Re: So I can smash an old lady over the head...

I draw this conclusion from what I read in the local & national newspapers, see on national news, see going on around me (direct evidence being an attack on my eldest daughter that the police did not want to get involved with - until I made them) and hear from various politicians.

e.g. - who gives a shit about fox hunting?? If I had more time I could list you out a thousand priorities in moral and community behaviour that need far more urgent attention than this load of clap-trap!!

Its a fact that "crimes" such as this license issue have far more focus on them than real crimes that affect the way we live in our respective communities. Its a fact that happens because various authorities, from local to national are not empowered to correct anti-social behaviour, so they turn their attention to other criminal activities in order to demonstrate that they are doing something about crime. Its all about figures and political bullshit.

Second rant over...

<hr width=100% size=1>Madoc Yacht Club
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.madocyachtclub.co.uk>http://www.madocyachtclub.co.uk</A>

 

[BrendanS]

Re: So I can smash an old lady over the head...

But the facts and figures don't back up that perspective. Hardly anyone has ever been taken to court for lack of licence, and more normally given a warning. Also if you read Mikes posts, you'll see that spot fines are to be introduced.

However, that's all beside the point. It's not Ofcoms job to protect old age pensioners from mugging, but it is their job to regulate airway usaged (not just marine). If they don't do it, they get moaned at for not doing their job.

<hr width=100% size=1>Me transmitte sursum, caledoni

 

[steverow]

Yes the whole thing is a scam as far as I can see.
Imagine my position...a qualified radio communications engineer, radio amateur for over 20 years, former signals instructor....and yet I have to pay the RYA £50 for the priveledge of being bored out of my skull for an entire day by some jumped up yottie who knows as much about radio comms theory and practice as I do about bacteriology.
Although thats probably being a bit unfair on my tenuous grasp of bacteriology...!

I didnt....I sent the wife to do it to keep us legal. But that isnt going to stop me operating on the occasions that she's not on the boat.
And if anyone wants to have a pop at prosecuting me for it...be my guest. Im happy to be a test case.
As I have said before, a certificate of competence is only there if one is deemed
to be incompetent before taking the course, and I can bring several bits of paper
to bear on the situation that prove I am much more than competent.


Rant Over

Steve.

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[Ships_Cat]

Oh my goodness, is having to do the course before sitting the exam mandatory in UK (I am elsewhere, so is a genuine question)?

John


<hr width=100% size=1>I am the cat but I am only 6.

 

[BrendanS]

As a seasoned VHF exam taker, and signals engineer, surely it wouldn't take more than a few minutes to take the exam and be legal. You got the price wrong as well.
If you were really of that bent, you'd be so pro exams that nothing else would matter. Or am I talkinig complete cobblers?

<hr width=100% size=1>Me transmitte sursum, caledoni