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suziekatie27

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hello everyone i am interested in knowing about your experences of buying a secondhand boat from a broker in the uk and what you have learned from it.i have just spoken to a broker who tells me if i want to see the documents on her which are A ORIGINAL VAT receipt which i am told are paid ,who owns her,previous bills of sale but not one from her 1st owner as the owner does not have it, then i will have to make a offer on her 1st and if he excepts then i can see them he also told me there is no such thing as a verbal contract so untill i sign papers i can walk away any time is this true,he says he is there to help me. this brokerage also does not belong to ABYA but does belong to the BMF IS THAT A GOOD THING will i have a come back should something be wrong in the title or ownership or do i have no come back from suzie
 
Okay, here goes. Total boating/yachting 'virgin' i.e. never owned a boat, not even a canoe. Recently had heart attack (October 2000) and now my other half has come to the conclusion that my middle name is 'Martini' (any time any place any where any whore . . .)
So I have two daughters at home now wife and a house that was too small five years ago. So what did I do I decided that I was going to buy a boat to live on. . Yes thats rights its sh*t or bust time. A I said I knew nothing so i start looking and find a beautiful 'ship' on the Isle of Wight, on sale through a broker. So phone him and he is of course very charming a sort of Leslie Phillips on water. He was however totally honest with me, th boat had basically been a floating weekend cottage and looked as pretty as a picture (see my sig) but as they say beauty is only skin deep or in this case a coat of paint or two deep. But as I say the broker was as helpful as could be, he picked me up on numerous occasions from the ferry and took me down to the marina took me out (weather permitting) and was generally an all round good guy. When I organised a surveyor my broker seemed a little rankled by the one i selected, nothing too much but from the sounds of it, it must have been a bit like a 2nd hand car salesman and a vicar on an outing ...
Any way the surveyor was worth every penny I spent the boat was unseaworthy, unlivable unlovable - but not to me I bougth her and work is now in progress to rebuild her. But as to buying from a broker, if they are all like the guy I did business with you should have no worries, But I think it is probable that I was just lucky..
Good luck and if you want more info on the who what why pm me

Mal /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
I find it strange that a broker says "Make me a (verbal) offer - it's not binding though, and if I accept then I'll show you the papers.

You have a right to satisfy yourself of the legality of the purchase without any incumbrance or commitment at that time.
[ QUOTE ]
he says he is there to help me

[/ QUOTE ]
No; he is there to help himself.

Are you able to talk to the current owner re this situation?

My suggestion: walk away and look for another boat
 
It's quite likely that he's not going to waste time getting the documents for you unless you put an offer in. Brokers don't want to waste a lot of effort on "time wasters" (not that you are one, but he doesn't know that). What he is saying is fair enough.

In practice you can walk away from a boat purchase at any time before you sign on the dotted line. You can also withdraw after the signature in some circumstances, but you are a long way from the point of no return at at this stage.

His membership of any organisation is all but irrelevant. It's best to work on the basis that you will have no come back on the broker. As others have said , never trust a broker, any more than you would trust an estate agent.

I wouldn't necessarily worry about the receipt from the first owner. If the purchase was some years ago there's probably no need to worry. If it was six months ago then alarm bells should be ringing.

It sounds as if you need to get hold of a copy of the RYA booklet on buying a boat.
 
i did ask the broker if i can speak to the owner and he says he can not give me his phone number or address only if i work out a price with the seller will he show me everything i want to know.i have the RYA book buying your first sailing cruiser and it says get a original bill of sale or previous ones,VAT receipt showing vat was paid,registered 1 if possible if not ssr,and builders certificate .out of these it has previous bill of sale but not the original ,not registered ssr or registered 1 ,no builders certificate, it does have a VAT receipt saying vat was payed, well that is what the broker has told me i have not seen any proof of this as yet.really i know nothing about this boat as to its history,or who owns her, what condition she is in .she is 17 yrs old
 
[ QUOTE ]
if i work out a price with the seller will he show me everything i want to know.

[/ QUOTE ]
Still seems strange. It should be "show me everything I want to know, eg: bills of sale, builders cert, etc. and then we might consider a price."

Still can't see why the broker is so keen to get you to a price negotiation.

What is the boat type, and her name, and any other information you may have? - What price is the broker asking? Forumites might be able to specify what might be a reasonable price range for this 17 year old vessel.
 
ON.714843

This is the Official Number (ON) which means that she is, or was, on Part 1 of the official registry. Part 1 registration is renewable every 5 years, but owners may have let this lapse.

The belt thing on the wheel is likely to be a component of the auto-pilot mechanism.

There is a Westerly owners website. You should find additional help there.

Can't help any more, sorry.

Steve
 
It seems to me that you don't really have a problem.

If you like the boat, make an offer, just as you would with a house. Once a sale is agreed you then have to make the checks and if any of them come up wrong you can walk away. If you leave the survey until after you have checked the paperwork you will not have lost any money, only a bit of time.

Ask yourself - if you were buying a house would you demand to see the deeds before putting in an offer?
 
no i would not but its different with this boat because they have already lied to me saying it is registered 1 then said it was ssr then said no registry,so i do not trust what they say and if i can know if it has vat paid and past bills of sale i will come and see them again but if no, i am not interested in buying boat so it would save me and the broker time, also i will not be able to sell it if i should need to without these papers you see, i have to make another offer go through all that ,then travel up there stay at a hotel only to then maybe find out they dont have these papers and its not the only thing they lied about . sue
 
You are going round in circles with this. Brokers, like estate agents and drug dealers, never tell the truth. They are genetically incapable of it.

If you don't want to make an offer until you have seen the documents, just tell them that; and walk away if necessary. Alternatively, make an offer, subject to you having sight of the documents within, say, 5days. Tell the broker exactly what he is to do if he wants your cash and be prepared to walk!

You may well never get every document; you'll just have to make your decisions on what is available; some are more important than others.
 
hi joe ok i just got a message that has made me wiser to the brokers i am dealing with from someone who has delt with the brokers i am dealing with im not definetly not going round in circles sorry if that sounds rude i dont mean to be,i dont want every document i just want 2 of the most important ones but just like to say thanks for your replys , i guess also i like the boat a little too much
 
I go with those who say 'walk away'. If you do make an offer make it in writing and subject to contract and survey. Do not make a verbal offer. It could be a contract on anything but a house. If after getting a value from someone with knowledge of the type of boat in question make an offer as stated above but about two thirds of the maximum value and make the offer time limited. [Boats sometimes go for a quarter or half their book value. ] Say at least two weeks as it is hoiday time. You can reduce your offer after the survey.

Don't get bullied into anything. You are a very valuable customer and ahead of those with boats and houses to sell. Play it very cool.
 
Hello everyone

Just spoken to brokers ,they said the seller will agree to sell subject to brought as seen,and he is not willing to fix the boat,or bring the price down for what ever reason.
I said no way, sounds dodgy to me,anyway i am not buying her now,All your advice has been very helpful and i thank you all ,I think i will go to the southampton used boat show
 
Hi Suzie!

That's a very sensible response to an 'ultimatum' like that! Joe's absolutely right, it'll still be for sale in a years time and I'll bet the chap will still be sticking out for 'his' price!! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

As others have said, there are loads of other boats out there.

Cheer Jerry
 
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