Swan 46 against a Bene 473 for blue water cruising

[RupertW]

I would suggest you double reef the main when hard on the wind because you have to. Lack of ballast in a modern wide beam boat that relies on form stabilty rather than keel weight stops you carrying any more canvas. When the conditions are bumpy you have little drive to push through the waves. Hence rounding up when you carry more canvas and you get a gust.
In typical F6 conditions we can set main with one reef and staysail and punch into seas will little fuss at 35deg apparent. In a gust not much changes. Lean a little more but track on course usually on autopilot or Windpilot.
Off the wind the weight of the keel is less of an issue except we are currently anchored in Portsmouth, Dominica and the winds are light and we are getting West winds that blow in to the anchorage. Swell is coming in at odd angles and setting boats rolling. The heavy boats roll a lot less than the light boats. Also the speed of the roll on the light boats is about twice as fast as the heavy boats when it happens. Comfort at anchor is important and comes in many forms. It not just about huge cockpits and four double cabins.
For me the OP has made a wise choice.

I don't know why you keeping going on about being hard on the wind or me double reefing the main then. Hard on the wind is easy in most boats and the main can be kept up far longer in a fatter sterned boat than it can when off the wind. The only "problems" are if you try to hold a lot of main when reaching, especially broad reaching in a very variable wind - so when the wind is aft of the beam I use less or no main. Hard on the wind - not a problem, that and surfing downwind are the two ways the boat is easiest and happiest.

 

[geem]

I don't know why you keeping going on about being hard on the wind or me double reefing the main then. Hard on the wind is easy in most boats and the main can be kept up far longer in a fatter sterned boat than it can when off the wind. The only "problems" are if you try to hold a lot of main when reaching, especially broad reaching in a very variable wind - so when the wind is aft of the beam I use less or no main. Hard on the wind - not a problem, that and surfing downwind are the two ways the boat is easiest and happiest.

Glad it works for you

 

[gertha]

I started this post, as at the time I had a keen interest in buying a Bene 46, this would have been a natural if slightly under canvases upgrade from my Hanse 370.
The Hanse 461 or First 46 would have been closer in performance but nothing in budget.

My original idea of a bigger boat was 43 foot , a bit more sea kindly than the 370 and probably a similar speed with less motion.
Problem was Bowmans , Rustlers and that sort were smaller in side and very expensive; hence I ended looking at bigger older boats ,to have the accommodation and newer boats which were closer to my experience.

I found I was up to 46 odd feet to get what I think I want, the boat will be used for a long drawn out round the world, 3 or 6 months sailing then a year working , boat laid up somewhere. I do not have funds to stop work nor do I want to. With the experience of last 10 years , I think I have an idea where I am going. I could stop work buy a contessa 32 and anchor every night and never work again, but I am a tart and that is not me.

I welcome all input , and as I have secured a deal on a Swan , am happy to admit that is the way I am going.

Someone mentioned a before and after photo , that could be fun; and a post of costs could be another bit of fun.
New standing rig about 12 k ,sails are all new 2 sets so no cost for a long time, tronics about 5k, engine may or may not be a big bill. Teak deck 70k to Foxes probably do it my self for about half but who knows.

My old Hanse I had from new lost 50k in 10 years probably same again in upgrades and replacements, moring and all Probably used her 1000 days or 100 per year so about £100 per day for me and others to enjoy, often 4 up so 25 pp.
I guess the new toy will be about twice the cost.


There are times that I am frustrated how forums work and apologies if I have offended any one,,; but some people just do not know when to stop.

P.S.
I have no experience of a Jenau 42 into wind ; but a Hanse you reef the main to 3 reefs before you reef the jib into wind or down wind.
I guess someone will now start talking about anchors

Why do people hide their identity?

Simon

 

[geem]

I started this post, as at the time I had a keen interest in buying a Bene 46, this would have been a natural if slightly under canvases upgrade from my Hanse 370.
The Hanse 461 or First 46 would have been closer in performance but nothing in budget.

My original idea of a bigger boat was 43 foot , a bit more sea kindly than the 370 and probably a similar speed with less motion.
Problem was Bowmans , Rustlers and that sort were smaller in side and very expensive; hence I ended looking at bigger older boats ,to have the accommodation and newer boats which were closer to my experience.

I found I was up to 46 odd feet to get what I think I want, the boat will be used for a long drawn out round the world, 3 or 6 months sailing then a year working , boat laid up somewhere. I do not have funds to stop work nor do I want to. With the experience of last 10 years , I think I have an idea where I am going. I could stop work buy a contessa 32 and anchor every night and never work again, but I am a tart and that is not me.

I welcome all input , and as I have secured a deal on a Swan , am happy to admit that is the way I am going.

Someone mentioned a before and after photo , that could be fun; and a post of costs could be another bit of fun.
New standing rig about 12 k ,sails are all new 2 sets so no cost for a long time, tronics about 5k, engine may or may not be a big bill. Teak deck 70k to Foxes probably do it my self for about half but who knows.

My old Hanse I had from new lost 50k in 10 years probably same again in upgrades and replacements, moring and all Probably used her 1000 days or 100 per year so about £100 per day for me and others to enjoy, often 4 up so 25 pp.
I guess the new toy will be about twice the cost.


There are times that I am frustrated how forums work and apologies if I have offended any one,,; but some people just do not know when to stop.

P.S.
I have no experience of a Jenau 42 into wind ; but a Hanse you reef the main to 3 reefs before you reef the jib into wind or down wind.
I guess someone will now start talking about anchors

Why do people hide their identity?

Simon

We have gone through the old boat refurb a couple of times. If you want to go replacement teak route there is a good yard in Conway, North Wales that gave us a very competitive quote. We are 44ft but had a huge amount of teak with our flush decks. We were quoted less than half what you are talking about. tom Cunliffe had his decks done there. We opted to get ourd done in the Caribbean as they could fit us in before we were due to leave. We also paid less than half what you have been quoted for 12mm rigging in North Wales. Good luck with the project.

 

[doug748]

........I welcome all input , and as I have secured a deal on a Swan , am happy to admit that is the way I am going....
Simon

Well done.

The best quote I saw in ages was posted recently, it said something like (but more elegantly) :

If you buy a boat it will cost you plenty
If you buy a new boat it will be very expensive
If you buy an old boat it will be very expensive
If you worry about spending money don't buy a boat.

If you could bear to take some snaps of the restoration it would be great to see them. Good luck with it.