Sunsail in the Solent

[ProMariner]

Flaming, spot on. As a sunsail skipper, it's like sailing around with a target on your back, you just seem to attract these 'disgusted of tunbridge wells' types. Have seen bad behaviour from (in no particular order) charterers, private owners, moboers, even from people not native to the uk, but also experienced courtesy and kindness from all these people, far more often. I blame yachties, everyone should have to pass a 'sailor' exam, a more holistic approach.

 

[dom]

Why have I missed the point, when it's what I have seen with my own eyes ?

Look we've all witnessed the fleet's sometimes chaotic behaviour, which is why most people give the Sunsail mob a healthy berth! But I'm not sure one can diss Sunsail's entire clientele because of a few bad eggs.

However speaking of chips, I personally think that the stick you are getting for sailing a smaller slower boat than the Sunsails is totally pathetic. Come to think of it, Sunsail skippers are hardly the cream of the racing fraternity and perhaps some are a bit angry about that. I doubt many at the top of the fleet would never display such bad manners to a fellow yachtie.

So it would seem you're somehow winning this debate ...apart from the clientele bit as these are typically just normal folk in search of a good day out and a few beers afterwards.

 

[flaming]

However speaking of chips, I personally think that the stick you are getting for sailing a smaller slower boat than the Sunsails is totally pathetic.

Eh? Certainly the only stick I'm giving him is about his desire to categorize all Sunsail skippers as incompetent, when that is a very, very long way from the truth, and as a former Sunsail skipper (and good friend to a number of current skippers) that misrepresentation understandably annoys me.

I have nothing but good things to say about his own choice of boat.

 

[Twister_Ken]

I have nothing but good things to say about his own choice of boat.

Not so much of a boat, more of a religion.

Me, I thank God I'm an atheist.

 

[dom]

I have nothing but good things to say about his own choice of boat.

No I was referring to the personal insults. As for Sunsail I understand that the wages are not that great, which almost certainly means that skippers are a mixture of motivated post-university/between-jobbers and less motivated folk who simply can't find a better job. I would therefore to expect to see a broad spectrum of skippers on the payroll: good, bad and ugly.

But whatever the reason, Sunsail has a bit of a scuzzy reputation in the corporate world and is quite obviously failing to monetise its significant capital investment. Sunsail is owned by Tui, a pretty slick German travel firm, so I would guess that it simply hasn't the management time or inclination to sort it. It is well known that the business has been touted around a bit, but as far as I know it hasn't found a buyer ....I certainly wouldn't be top of the list!

 

[PhillM]

I've used sunsail a few times.

I used skippered charter twice for corporate entertaining Skipper was ex RN officer called Clive (pretty high up but I cannot recall how high or which ship) and he was excellent.

I did comp crew, which mutated into day skipper. Instructor Terry was at best mediocre. But in his defence he did have a heavy cold, so I didn't see him at his best. When I complained after the first weekend, the chief instructor who was a lady called Jinks (sorry but I've forgotten her first name) gave me a one-one training day in which we covered the whole DS theory course. She was excellent.

I'd say that like any business staff quality can vary. I'd go with the idea that SS are more visible than most so get more stick.

 

[Seajet]

There are several points going on here, if I can get serious and not be distracted !

Speaking as an outsider but used to large/er companies;

If I found myself in charge of such a business as Sunsail, I'd be very very p'd off if the people didn't tell me of image problems, and I might think my own image might be deterring people from telling me, so check that first and if necessary be friendly with the workforce, hopefully in a genuine way.

Have mass audiences with skippers, then pontoon crews, then all combined.

Make the effort to speak to them all separately - NOT hauled in ' Mr Burns and his hounds require your presence '

Have a stiff talking to what is very probably called ' Human Resources ' ( I always thought why not just say ' meat based assets ' ) and weed out a few, leaving or hiring anyone who treats people as humans, as they'll probably treat customers that way too.

Give the strong message that everyone under that corporate flag is a representative to the world and should be accordingly polite, professional and helpful.

That includes students and charterers, they should be made to feel like representatives of a great outfit.

In a small way when I did a 1 week refresher then 1 week YM offshore course with Solent School of Yachting that is exactly how I felt, one of a close knit team and by the end of week 1 we would have had a good team for a Fastnet - my thoughts, not a suggestion then.

Great skippers I was lucky to meet, but anyone can try to instill an ethos which is ' we are the best, we do not go across cockpits, we know how to belay, we know not to leave lines heaped on a pontoon,

We do not shout and stomp across boats and we ask nicely, we treat other people's treasured boats as we would treat our --- whatever it is they treasure...

Here endeth

Para 1

 

[doris]

Having just ground all the way through this thread I find it extraordinary how much a few curmudgeonly forum members love to slag off a company that has introduced thousands to sailing/yachting over the years. This thread demonstrates perfectly how there are a few 'Agrieved of Tunbridge Wells ' in every group the same as there are a few incompetent charterers out there. If everyone had a huge Scuttle sticker on their boat I'm sure we would all be quickly branded as something terrible simply because of our newfound visibility. I hate to think what cock ups I will make over the next few months but mine will be less noticeable, praise be to the Lord!

FFS loosen up you curmudgeons and be grateful that SS brings new blood into our pastime. Everyone has to learn somehow, often the hard way.

 

[lpdsn]

I propose a Sunsail boat handling competition.

In the red corner: typical Sunsail skippers.

In the blue corner: owners of boats <30 feet LOA who are confident in their boat handling but have never skippered anything bigger.

Weapon of choice: Sunsail Farr 40.

Should be interesting. We could maybe get Dylan to film it.

By the way, before anyone accuses me of having a vested interest, I've never skippered a Sunsail boat (tagged along on a couple of corporate charters but had to be discrete as I didn't actually work for the relevant corporation). I always found the Solent charter companies who were fussiest about who chartered their boats gave the best value for money, so always ended up going elsewhere.

 

[Seajet]

doris,

you have no idea what's involved or mentioned, do you ?!

Taking a group of aspirational sailors and literally ' showing them the ropes ' is quite the most uplifting thing one can do, I have done it since I was an instructor at 14, rather ' Swallows And Amazons '.

Sunsail's message is more like " Here, Ya, we can storm in and shove all the peasants aside Ya, get pissed and stomp across the peasant's decks, hey they were stupid enough to pay for their boats Ya, more fool them, tomorrow I'll be back at my office and forget about sailing, god I'd never want to own a boat, what hassle, I might even have to use a screwdriver; no next week it'll be a track day with a Halford's window lickers meet...

 

[jac]

Isn't that more the charterers / guests, not Sunsail the company.

How many other charter boats would you even recognise as a charter boat. I know of several boats that are chartered and also used by owners. How would you tell who was using it. Society has groups of knobs that come out of hiding from time to time. Some are in private boats, some are in chartered boats, some are on this thread.

 

[doris]

The

doris,

you have no idea what's involved or mentioned, do you ?!

Taking a group of aspirational sailors and literally ' showing them the ropes ' is quite the most uplifting thing one can do, I have done it since I was an instructor at 14, rather ' Swallows And Amazons '.

Sunsail's message is more like " Here, Ya, we can storm in and shove all the peasants aside Ya, get pissed and stomp across the peasant's decks, hey they were stupid enough to pay for their boats Ya, more fool them, tomorrow I'll be back at my office and forget about sailing, god I'd never want to own a boat, what hassle, I might even have to use a screwdriver; no next week it'll be a track day with a Halford's window lickers meet...

Matey boy, I have instructed at an array of sports( including sailing), managed several large companies and been an elected representative of the Great British public. I suspect I have more than a clue as to what is going on.

I have also skippered for SS a few times, albeit a while back, and IMHO, you are way off the mark with your generalised condemnation. Of course there are a few prats but there are plenty of nonSS prats too.
Life too short for permanent indignation.

Pip pip old boy.

 

[dom]

There are several points going on here, if I can get serious and not be distracted !

Speaking as an outsider but used to large/er companies;

If I found myself in charge of such a business as Sunsail, I'd be very very p'd off if the people didn't tell me of image problems, and I might think my own image might be deterring people from telling me, so check that first and if necessary be friendly with the workforce, hopefully in a genuine way.

Have mass audiences with skippers, then pontoon crews, then all combined.

Make the effort to speak to them all separately - NOT hauled in ' Mr Burns and his hounds require your presence '

Have a stiff talking to what is very probably called ' Human Resources ' ( I always thought why not just say ' meat based assets ' ) and weed out a few, leaving or hiring anyone who treats people as humans, as they'll probably treat customers that way too.

Give the strong message that everyone under that corporate flag is a representative to the world and should be accordingly polite, professional and helpful.

That includes students and charterers, they should be made to feel like representatives of a great outfit.

In a small way when I did a 1 week refresher then 1 week YM offshore course with Solent School of Yachting that is exactly how I felt, one of a close knit team and by the end of week 1 we would have had a good team for a Fastnet - my thoughts, not a suggestion then.

Great skippers I was lucky to meet, but anyone can try to instill an ethos which is ' we are the best, we do not go across cockpits, we know how to belay, we know not to leave lines heaped on a pontoon,

We do not shout and stomp across boats and we ask nicely, we treat other people's treasured boats as we would treat our --- whatever it is they treasure...

Here endeth

Para 1

Gosh, a manual on how to run a successful modern company! I have no idea why this inclusive, caring and responsible approach winds people up so much. Not that it matters much because it works

 

[Seajet]

The

Matey boy, I have instructed at an array of sports( including sailing), managed several large companies and been an elected representative of the Great British public. I suspect I have more than a clue as to what is going on.

I have also skippered for SS a few times, albeit a while back, and IMHO, you are way off the mark with your generalised condemnation. Of course there are a few prats but there are plenty of nonSS prats too.
Life too short for permanent indignation.

Pip pip old boy.

Matey pipsqueak,

you obviously haven't seen as much of the SPSS - Standard Prat Sun Sail - as I and regular sailors on the Solent for decades have been inflicted with.

You clearly haven't a clue what sailing is all about.

I think it relevant that you've been involved in ' an array of sports ', so sailing is just as I say some sort of ' track day experience and sod the locals '...

What are your other interests, ' how to put a bigger spoiler on a Subaru ', licking windows at Halfords ' or putting oversize tyres on 4x4's...

 

[dom]

The

Matey boy, I have instructed at an array of sports( including sailing), managed several large companies and been an elected representative of the Great British public. I suspect I have more than a clue as to what is going on.

I have also skippered for SS a few times, albeit a while back ...

Shouldn't this be on LinkedIn?

 

[Seajet]

Better, more useful response from Mumsnet ?

 

[crewman]

I have chartered/raced Sunsail boat as skipper and never been required to show any bits of paper. That being said we have never won anything (or hit anything...)

I too have chartered the Sunsail boats. I had to confirm in writing that I had Coastal skipper cert and the nominated mate had a DS cert. We were told that the insurance was invalid without this. The excess on the insurance is £3000! Guess how I know.

 

[sailorman]

So you have to pay the excess & lose your deposit too ??

 

[lpdsn]

So you have to pay the excess & lose your deposit too ??

No idea about Sunsail, but at other places I've chartered the deposit and excess have matched up. Presumably if you do any damage, the deposit pays the excess.

 

[lpdsn]

I propose a Sunsail boat handling competition.

In the red corner: typical Sunsail skippers.

In the blue corner: owners of boats <30 feet LOA who are confident in their boat handling but have never skippered anything bigger.

Weapon of choice: Sunsail Farr 40.

Should be interesting. We could maybe get Dylan to film it.

By the way, before anyone accuses me of having a vested interest, I've never skippered a Sunsail boat.

Maybe it could just be Doris against Seajet. I'll put my money on Doris.