Storm sails - how large and what type ?

[RupertW]

On a removable inner forestay. I'm not convinced by the real-world practicality of the storm jib arrangements that aim to wrap round the rolled up genoa.

I suspect you are right. Given that the only real purpose of a storm jib is to make progress to windward I can't see a baggy luff really working but I'd love to see real world experience of the opposite as a wraparound would be so much easier to use.

 

[capnsensible]

On a removable inner forestay. I'm not convinced by the real-world practicality of the storm jib arrangements that aim to wrap round the rolled up genoa.

I reckon thats the only way a storm jib will ever work. But nearly every one ever made has probably not been out of its bag more than twice.

Personally I drop the main, stick the wind in the quarter with a bit of rolled out headsail and run away. :encouragement:

 

[Tranona]

I reckon thats the only way a storm jib will ever work. But nearly every one ever made has probably not been out of its bag more than twice.

Personally I drop the main, stick the wind in the quarter with a bit of rolled out headsail and run away. :encouragement:

The storm jib on my boat, built in 1963 and owned by me since 1980 has indeed been out twice. Once when I bought the boat and the second time when i checked it before putting it in the loft! Being a wimp has something to do with it.

 

[sarabande]

Cap'n, I am sensible to the possible imperative to make to windward. Running or reaching requires different tactics, but if one were caught out in the wrong quadrant and wanted to head to the safer one or out of the system altogether, the ability to creep upwind might be very useful.

Would one go for a blade shape or a fat triangle ?

 

[PetiteFleur]

When I got my boat, Moody 33 a few years ago, there an inner forestay fitted about 12" below the masthead but never fitted at the deck end. I fitted a Wichard pad eye on deck, another back to back then a turnbuckle to a reinforced chain locker bulkhead. The deck end of the inner forestay was fitted with a lever operated 'tightener'. The storm jib that came with the boat had a rusted luff wire which was cut off and a new rope luff fitted by a local sailmaker with new hanks. The tack had an additional wire added with a snap shackle to clip to the pad eye. Worked well when tested but never used in anger - yet!

 

[webcraft]

Do wire luffs work? Would it ever be feasible to hoist a wire luffed storm jib on eg the spinnaker halliard?

- W

 

[Seajet]

Sarabande,

I suggest our mutual chum could give the best answer.


Personally I like storm sails to be mostly flat with the main clew outhaul ( reefed or not ) pulled taught- with attention to keeping the mainsheet traveller loose - but enough curve and shape to still give the sails driving power.

 

[Heckler]

Trying to sort out some heavy weather preparations and I am coming across varied views on size of storm jib and whether a (main) storm trysail is a good sail to have on board.

Roughly what % of a normal genoa (or area for OA length) do people think a storm jib should be, and what shape ? Suggestions vary between a tall thin 'blade' and a fat triangle well off the deck.

Offshore racing regs mention that no main trysail is needed if the main can be reefed to <40% of full, but the top 10 feet of so of a normal main may not be of the right material or cut (or colour) to deal with heavy winds. A point has been made that using a 'fourth reef' for gales will be a lot easier to set up than having a purpose made trysail to prepare and hoist (perhaps in a separate track ?), though I would rather have a loose footed trysail than having a boom to control with 4 bulky reefs tied down.

Hey Tim, whats the plan? Coming down south to play with us?

 

[jwilson]

Do wire luffs work? Would it ever be feasible to hoist a wire luffed storm jib on eg the spinnaker halliard?
- W

Not in the sort of wind where you'd need a storm jib. Try it when moored in 25 knots wind and you'll be horrified at the snatch loads on halliard and sheet. At 50 knots wind it will be many times worse. It's not a straight line increase in force as wind speed goes up. You could however use one halliard to hoist a wire or bit of dyneema as a temporay stay, and hank the sail to that and then hoist sail with a separate halliard. Controlling the luff tames the snatch loading.

 

[Seajet]

Well my wire luffed storm jib - specified from dinghy racing experience - worked in 55knot head winds, as recorded by TS Royalists' instruments as they observed ' the little blue boat '

 

[capnsensible]

Do wire luffs work? Would it ever be feasible to hoist a wire luffed storm jib on eg the spinnaker halliard?

- W

Im fairly sure that the only thing that will work is that inner forestay that can be rigged and a storm jib hanked on to it. Thanks to the job Ive been fortunate to sail a lot of yachts with all sorts of 'good ideas club' ways of cheating the coding.

Whenever I sail a new to me boat I always set the storm canvas if there is any. Thats shown me personally that most of it is crap....

Trysail.... yeah, whatever. Drop the mainsail and run away.

Storm jibs trying all other inventions... well I grew up in sailing terms having to go on the flippin foredeck and change sails. how many people these days have ever done that let alone get up there in a storm and fanny around with rubbish?

I had a coded boat for years. The storm jib was hanked on to a length of dyneema and hoisted with similar made spinnaker halyard. Acceptable to the code but really??? Now I rigged that sail probably 30 times a year for 10 years. Go upwind in a gale.....
Dont think the AWB is gonna get any beter than 70 or 80 off true anyway under those circumstances.

I always took the view that storm sails are just there if you knacker your furling sail. And run away!

Hey presto, last year on a trans Pacific, the headsail blew itself to bits despite me sewing the flippin seams up for many hours. Soo, poled out storm jib and full main for, er, three weeks.

Once, ever, in a few miles of sailing, I struggled a bit with a lee shore. Which happened to be Spain. No way to make to windward under sail, no way gonna rig a storm jib. Which, of course, is when the engine goes pete tong. Anyway, reach, tack, reach until it blows over was my tactic. Uncomfortable but not deadly!

So thats my thoughts on heavy airs, we are now a bit beyond the Hiscocks and knitted lentils.

 

[geem]

Having just finished a 6 day trip from the Bahamas to Bocas del Torro in Panama, just short of 1000nm, I will throw my two peneth in.
We had no more than 30kts. We needed to spend a couple of days pushing to windward but no more than 50deg apparent to get our Southing in early. So only really F6. We are a 44ft ketch. Most of the trip was spent with 3reefs in the main with inner blade jib (285sq ft) and mizzen. When the wind was up a bit and over night, we dropped the main and just sailed on the jib and full mizzen(150sq ft). We averaged 6.8 kts and really werent pushing the boat with husband and wife and two dogs. We even rolled a little of the jib away when the wind blew a little harder in a squall for a while.
The blade jib works very well. Far better than our 130% genoa rolled up. The boat settles down, lifts the bow, it more upright and feels nicer. It points far better to windward once we see 20 kts over the deck than the furled genoa will ever do. Our big genoa is 700 sq ft so the jib on the inner furler at 285 sq ft feels about right. We often go straight from full genoa to full jib when the wind picks up. Hope this helps a little

 

[tillergirl]

TG's original Jeckell suit of sails 1964: Storm Jib is 87 sq ft, Genoa 281 sq ft, No 1 212 sq ft, No 2 Sq ft 153 sq ft. Storm Jib in 9 oz cotton, wire luff - but I guess that isn't particularly relevant these days.

Out for drying - a not so nice day earlier in 1992:

DSC01379 by Roger Gaspar, on Flickr

 

[sarabande]

Hey Tim, whats the plan? Coming down south to play with us?

I am certain I could not keep with the social roundabout. The aim is make a foray out towards Coruna or Mull or Baltimore. Certainly, perhaps. Hence the concern to be able to make to windward.

 

[laika]

Offshore racing regs mention that no main trysail is needed if the main can be reefed to <40% of full, but the top 10 feet of so of a normal main may not be of the right material or cut (or colour) to deal with heavy winds.

An option Kemp (and presumably others) offer is to make the top portion of the sail above a "4th reef" point (not normally rigged with reefing lines) in heavy material to serve as a storm sail in extreme conditions. It's white rather than orange though...

We had an inner forestay fitted last year and I only just got round to playing with my storm jib this week (in very light airs). One thing that slightly concerns me: Ideally you'd want to hank on the sail before you really need it and tie it to the guardrail ready, but the highfield lever sticks up a metre above the deck below the wire of the stay so if you do hank on before you need it, the hanks are bunched up well above the guard rail. Some further experimentation is needed...

 

[ghostlymoron]

Most modern skippers would start the engine rather than 'clawing off a lee shore sail.

If given suffiicient advance warning it would be a very good idea to get the usual genoa off the roller and stashed below to save windage and give the boat a chance of making progress to windward, especially if trying to claw off a lee shore.

 

[ghostlymoron]

When I had my first boat I read somewhere that "no sailing boat should put to sea without a storm jib". So I promptly contacted Quay Sails for a suitable one. It duly arrived and was a lovely thing - bright orange and stiff as anything. We carried it around for years but never used it probably like most crews. The boat was a 17' Leisure.