Stern Boarding Ladders - Attachment

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Ink

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I want to ask forumites their views on how they make their boarding ladders secure when not in use.

I'm thinking specifically about the drop-down type that sit in a sugar scoop and are use as boarding ladders from the sugar scoop step and also as recovery ladders when deployed.
My ladders, when stored, lay against the stern and when crew are climbing aboard from the dinghy tend to grab the ladders as a hand hold. I usually have the ladders tied in place to stop them falling down.

My conundrum is when there is an emergency occasion when the ladders have to be deployed - possibly by someone not familiar - does anyone have any better way of securing the ladders?

Regards

Ink
 
Ink said:
I want to ask forumites their views on how they make their boarding ladders secure when not in use.

I'm thinking specifically about the drop-down type that sit in a sugar scoop and are use as boarding ladders from the sugar scoop step and also as recovery ladders when deployed.
My ladders, when stored, lay against the stern and when crew are climbing aboard from the dinghy tend to grab the ladders as a hand hold. I usually have the ladders tied in place to stop them falling down.

My conundrum is when there is an emergency occasion when the ladders have to be deployed - possibly by someone not familiar - does anyone have any better way of securing the ladders?

Regards

Ink
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Soft shakles are pretty good.
 
My Dehler 22 has exactly this set up and there is a rudimentary clip that is not very secure. I replaced it as I thought the old one just had UV damage. The replacement is no better and has stretched. I run the transom guard wire across it as makeshift security. The next thing I might try is a plastic 22mm plumbing pipe clip that you can pop the ladder rail in and out. I haven't measured or tried it yet, but you need something that is both secure, but also allows use of the ladder when you need it. You could try one of those rubber clips/straps they put round young trees. There are ones that release with a twist of the wrist, but are otherwise locked and secure.
Just a few thoughts, with no particular conclusion.
 
................a slight fred drift.
The drop down section of the ladders are woefully short to help folks get out of the water in an emergency.
Recently a gentleman, not in the first flush of lithe youth and not me, took an unexpected dip while attempting to clamber into a kayak for the very first time.
He was wearing a bouyancy aid.
It took him many attempts to get his feet up high enough to get on to the lowest step of my swim platform ladder, before with great difficulty he managed to clamber out.
This was on warm summer day in a non tidal location in perfect conditions and a decent water temperature.

Last winter a lady took tumble into cold tidal water in the middle of the night on our moorings. It proved impossible for her companion to pull her out and only by shouting for help was assistance summoned from nearbye boats. His boarding ladder proved less than useless.
The three people present were still unable to get her out of the water and it was only with the arrival of the fire brigade that the lady was retrieved from the water via a pontoon ladder.
 
I had my ladder folded up and tied out of the way when I had a Tom & Jerry moment between the boat and the dinghy. It was impossible to get the ladder down without a knife and my knife was in a trouser pocket under my oilies. It could have been very nasty if the water had been colder or I had been alone. Since then, I've been very careful to ensure the ladder can be deployed from in the water.

In Ink's situation, I'd be inclined to tie the ladder up using a highwayman's hitch or similar, with the release line long enough to be reached from the water. An alternative, if the ladder only needs to be tied because it gets used as a hand hold, would be to fit a handle near it. If the ladder's free to move, people will soon stop using it, especially when there's an alternative. You'll still want a lanyard to pull it down from in the water, though.
 
At the moment I don't have a boarding ladder, just an emergency ladder. I'm in the throws of designing and fitting one and was thinking of securing it in the up position with a cable tie or two.
Should be pretty secure and a tug from the water on a lanyard should break the ties.
They will need changing periodically due to UV but could be a simple solution.
 
I'll join @oldgit and @Stemar in saying that ladders are generally too short from first hand experience - and add a further thought.

Your boarding ladder could save a stranger's life, even when you're not on the boat - but it's no good to anyone if it's tied up at deck level. If you can, leave it free to drop. And if it looks like a handhold, just tell people that it isn't.
 
anoccasionalyachtsman said:
I'll join @oldgit and @Stemar in saying that ladders are generally too short from first hand experience - and add a further thought.

Your boarding ladder could save a stranger's life, even when you're not on the boat - but it's no good to anyone if it's tied up at deck level. If you can, leave it free to drop. And if it looks like a handhold, just tell people that it isn't.
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That is my policy too. We have a long ladder that seems to sit happily in place through all weathers. I have thought about tying it up with a slip-knot, leaving a monkey’s paw reachable from the water but the comic effect of one unwanted immersion has deterred me from making the effort.
 
I have thought long and hard about this exact problem, and not found a neat, safe, foolproof answer, without manufacturing a special fitting with a release cord, that would duplicate the function of a highwaymans hitch without the vagaries of how other people might re-tie it.
 
OK .. there are various ways to have a release system that a person in water could if needed release a 'locked' ladder :

Short lanyard loop round the two 'pipe' sections, pass one end through other and pass a pin through to lock. Have the pin with short tether hangiong low enough for swimmer to grab, but end secured so its not lost. To release just pull pin and pull ladder down.

Or something that I have started using for all sorts of jobs .... double sided velcro. You can get it in narrow to ultra wide format. Basically wrap it round and it sticks to itself.
I buy it in reels so I can cut what I need for the job. Its not affected by being wet ...

Double Sided Velcro for sale | eBay

It can be made to look neat and in colour of choice.
 
On a coded
oldgit said:
................a slight fred drift.
The drop down section of the ladders are woefully short to help folks get out of the water in an emergency.
Recently a gentleman, not in the first flush of lithe youth and not me, took an unexpected dip while attempting to clamber into a kayak for the very first time.
He was wearing a bouyancy aid.
It took him many attempts to get his feet up high enough to get on to the lowest step of my swim platform ladder, before with great difficulty he managed to clamber out.
This was on warm summer day in a non tidal location in perfect conditions and a decent water temperature.

Last winter a lady took tumble into cold tidal water in the middle of the night on our moorings. It proved impossible for her companion to pull her out and only by shouting for help was assistance summoned from nearbye boats. His boarding ladder proved less than useless.
The three people present were still unable to get her out of the water and it was only with the arrival of the fire brigade that the lady was retrieved from the water via a pontoon ladder.
Click to expand...
on a coded boat it’s supposed to go a metre underwater. Try buying a compliant ladder.
 
Refueler said:
I can tell you that 2 is not enough from personal experience ... once you start going cold - you cannot get onto that bottom rung. I have a 5 rung Lazilas ladder and that puts 3 in the water - even that can be a struggle.
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Enough for me - wearing full diving kit and in the depths of winter. Mind you, I am incredibly fit (and an old git)!:)
 
Refueler said:
OK .. there are various ways to have a release system that a person in water could if needed release a 'locked' ladder :

Short lanyard loop round the two 'pipe' sections, pass one end through other and pass a pin through to lock. Have the pin with short tether hangiong low enough for swimmer to grab, but end secured so its not lost. To release just pull pin and pull ladder down.

Or something that I have started using for all sorts of jobs .... double sided velcro. You can get it in narrow to ultra wide format. Basically wrap it round and it sticks to itself.
I buy it in reels so I can cut what I need for the job. Its not affected by being wet ...

Double Sided Velcro for sale | eBay

It can be made to look neat and in colour of choice.
Click to expand...
Far too easy for someone to mis-locate your loop and pin. The problem is that on most modern boats the stern ladder is perfectly placed as a convenient handhold for someone boarding from the stern - someone who may very well never have been on that boat before. And if they do grab it and pull against it they will probably fall backwards unless it is almost rigidly fixed. So it needs to be reliably and foolproofly held up - UNTIL you are swimming in the water and want it down.
 
jwilson said:
Far too easy for someone to mis-locate your loop and pin. The problem is that on most modern boats the stern ladder is perfectly placed as a convenient handhold for someone boarding from the stern - someone who may very well never have been on that boat before. And if they do grab it and pull against it they will probably fall backwards unless it is almost rigidly fixed. So it needs to be reliably and foolproofly held up - UNTIL you are swimming in the water and want it down.
Click to expand...


Don't see why my suggestions are not workable ... they are only suggestions to join all others ...

I can tell you that the double velcro - can hold your weight with enough length put together .. but as its round the two ladders sections - that will be strong enough to hold.
 
Refueler said:
Don't see why my suggestions are not workable ... they are only suggestions to join all others ...

I can tell your that the double velcro - can hold your weight with enough length put together .. but as its round the two ladders sections - that will be strong enough to hold.
Click to expand...
I think you lanyard loop/pin with the dangling end would be ok - it's easy enough for the average person to work out how to use it. (As I drifted down the river I was checking the transom of every boat within swimming distance working out whether their ladders were long enough and if 'locked' and could have twigged what you'd done).

Not sure about the velcro though. Easy enough to rip apart if you're pulling the top of the ladder, but the leverage you have down at water level isn't great.
 
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