Overandunder
Member
I would worry that as I was removing material around the weakened area that I might make this worse....
Stem head forestay attachment issue
- Thread starter Overandunder
- Start date
rogerthebodger
Well-known member
Is your boat all aluminum which is why the bow fitting is also aluminum
srm
Well-known member
Its a toggle, essential as it allows for the sideways movement of the forestay.
Overandunder
Member
Yes - toggle that's the word I was looking for !
Overandunder
Member
No - standard Jeanneau construction in GRP - only the stem head is made of alloy.
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dunedin
Well-known member
I happened to be berthed on the furthest away pontoon at our marina today. I walked back looking at all the boats, conveniently all bows in. Saw a LOT of different boats, including various Jeanneau. EVERY boat I saw had the forestay connected to a stainless steel bracket, NONE were alloy. I thought two were but on closer inspection they were just bow rollers and an S/S tang went through behind it.
Does seem very unusual to have an alloy bow fitting.
PS An exception was a performance cruiser with below deck furler - couldn't see how this was connected.
Overandunder
Member
Interesting point. I can't comment on all the different models Jeanneau have produced of course - but for the SO 29.2 the alloy stem is standard fit from the factory as far as I can tell.
They made around 800 of this model so it must be up to the job.
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Overandunder
Member
Thanks for the replies all - I was hoping that someone here knew of a Rigger / boatbuilder and could comment either way vis the drilling option.
I'm probably being overly cautious - but no forestay, no rig !
I'm probably being overly cautious - but no forestay, no rig !
greeny
Well-known member
I currrently have a SUN 2000 with exactly the same problem. Its a very common issue on the 2000's and probably on other Jenny's with similar stem head fittings. The hardest part of replacement or welding would be the removal of the original to allow the welding to take place. Maybe they could do it in situ? Mine is not as badly worn as yours is but is heading that way. Others in the Sun 2K club have added "temporary" short lengths of ss chain connected elsewhere on the stem fitting to the fore stay roller assembly as a backup in case the hole fails. Not sure how effective that would be but better than nothing I suppose and may save the rig should the worst happen.
greeny
Well-known member
Looking at your photos again, you still have a lot of meat left on that fitting. Nowhere near as bad as some I've seen. You have some deformation at the top of the hole as you might expect but it is local to the hole and not in the metal at the top edge. Viv might like to comment on what the risks are of failure in this situation? Please.
Overandunder
Member
That's interesting to hear. I guess because of the way a foresail 'works' on the forestay the fixing points are always being loaded / unloaded when under way and subject to wear as a result.
Putting in a measure to prevent the forestay letting go completely if the worse was to happen is probably a sensible precaution. Most likely I will remove and replace this with stainless in the long term - but would like to get on and sail it for at least a season or 2 (only owned it for 2 months).
To be honest I've never heard of the alloy giving way completely due to wear like this and someone losing the rig as a result - but I stand to be corrected !
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Overandunder
Member
Thanks - that's my impression. I don't really want to open out the existing point and fit a bushing as that would be removing more material.
Possibly it could be welded - but finding someone to take this on as a very minor job might not be easy - it would probably need to come off the boat to do that in any case.
srm
Well-known member
As a total failure does not look imminent start with the easiest possible solution. I would repeat my suggestion of filling the worn space with "metal epoxy" and seeing how it stands up to the compression loads. It should spread the load evenly over the remaining surface and may give a season or more sailing. If it does not work then go for whatever the next easiest fix is.
Way back in the 70's I came across a steel open boat that had been repeatedly repaired with an epoxy metal filler as small holes occurred below the waterline.
rogerthebodger
Well-known member
Having a steel I do keep onboard metal epoxy as a get me home emergency fix. I do think metal epoxy would be too brittle to take the load on a forestay when sailing.
IMHO the epoxy filled hole would soon break up and you would be back to the same position.
Bushing it out with a stronger material of even consider replacing the stem head fitting with stainless steel
This is mine
RunAgroundHard
Well-known member
It is a simple calculation to establish if a hole can withstand a shear force. Various online calculators for Padeyes. Therefore easy to establish how much metal you can remove. In my opinion, just from the visual, there is significant metal remaining, massively in excess for what you need. As others have stated, inserting a bush would be an easy, low cost, in situ repair, that very likely has been done before on other boats.
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Or ask the builder if such repairs have been done, or ask any engineering design consultant to perform the calculation. That’s got to be a lower cost than removal or even in situ welding and boring.
It is such a critical area, worth being sure about the repair.
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Or ask the builder if such repairs have been done, or ask any engineering design consultant to perform the calculation. That’s got to be a lower cost than removal or even in situ welding and boring.
It is such a critical area, worth being sure about the repair.
vyv_cox
Well-known member
It seems to me on studying the photos that the aluminium at the top of the hole has extruded to each side of the fitting. This suggests the mechanism not to be wear, but at least to some extent is plastic deformation. The result will be some work hardening, i.e. local strengthening, a far less worrying situation. As has been pointed out there is a lot of metal remaining. I would not be too worried at the moment.
I am a little concerned about the indentation on the top of the fitting. If this is caused by hard contact with the toggle or the bottle screw above it may be indicative of a loss in articulation that might lead to fatigue of the forestay or bottle screw. Check that no contact exists and if necessary lengthen the toggle.
Those with long memories will recall that the failed forestays on the British Steel round the world yachts were caused by an almost identical situation.
Nigel_Ward
Member
Unfortunately, I have first hand experience of this fitting as I have a SO 29.2. When I bought it 4 years ago I had new rigging fitted as the mast was down. The rigger tensioned (quite hard) the rig and left the forestay in the forward hole as it always had been.
At the end of that year the yard owner noticed my forestay/ anchor roller fitting was lifting off the deck.
If you look at the photos the forward hole is well forward of the 3 mounting bolts so the forestay tension is trying to lever the fitting off the deck which is what happened in my case.
Anyway an amount of glassfibre work and a new fitting were done and the forestay is now in the aft hole.
The fitting cost about £1300 from Jeanneau!
Apparently the dealer has sold a number of these fittings.
At the end of that year the yard owner noticed my forestay/ anchor roller fitting was lifting off the deck.
If you look at the photos the forward hole is well forward of the 3 mounting bolts so the forestay tension is trying to lever the fitting off the deck which is what happened in my case.
Anyway an amount of glassfibre work and a new fitting were done and the forestay is now in the aft hole.
The fitting cost about £1300 from Jeanneau!
Apparently the dealer has sold a number of these fittings.
MontyMariner
Well-known member
Yes you can!
Splay it open wide enough to include two reinforcing plates and use a shanked bolt and locking nut in place of the clevis pin.
William_H
Well-known member
I would get some aluminium angle like 40mm per side and cut to about 40 mm long 2off. Drill and or tap into the base of the fitting and mount them each side of the spine. Mount them a distance apart so that the toggle end can attach in the normal way but then use a long clevis pin or bolt to go through the ali angle then through the fork on the toggle through the original fitting then through the toggle finally through the second ali bracket. If you get the location of the holes in the ali angle correct then there will be no load on the original fitting or at least much less and you have back up. You could use SS angle but then need to insulate it from the base. Of course you will need ss bolts to screw angles down to base any way so need lots of duralac. ol'will
Overandunder
Member
Possibly - but it would be tricky to bend - one end would need to remain parallel (this being the slotted loop which wraps around a 10mm bolt that the forestay attaches to). The other open end would then need to be widened - but remain parallel to take a lengthened clevis pin.
