Steer port steer starboard

[pandos]

There is a commercially available product which features leds that indicate to the helmsman which way to turn the wheel.

It strikes me that this is similar to an auto pilot except an auto pilot actually tells a motor which way to turn the wheel.

I have a spare auto pilot which I intend to connect up and if needs be I could connect it to my wheel pilot, or even switch the entire system if I had an auto pilot failure.

But I was thinking I could use it to illuminate a series of leds which would illuminate depending on the commands from the auto pilot... Perhaps white in the centre and red and green as appropriate.

I think some diodes and some leds would do the job.. Is this too simple.

It would be nice to get a graduated response rather than binary...on off...

I know this is what a compass is for and I have a brand new one to fit and the existing to refurbish but as I need glasses to read the compass, in rain a series of lights could be a very useful.

Anyone got ideas along these lines..

 

[Adios]

It would help to see the product do you have a link

So it has a compass and you set the course? or how does it get the desired heading? Sound like a nice idea for something bold to steer by but yes it needs to be a graduated signal for hand steering or you'd be constantly over steering and correcting.

Rather than a spare if you had an old autopilot with duff gearbox or motor could you make one from the commands happening inside it? The obvious place to tap into is the wires going to the motor. If it alters the amount of power applied depending on how big the course change needed there could be your graduated signal but from the sound of the tiller pilots I've had it just applies the same power for more or less time. But still I imagine a disconnected autopilot would be trying to make small alterations to counter boat movements not just course changes the same as one connected to the tiller so your red and green would be constantly alternating.

 

[rogerthebodger]

Its a simple off course indicator and can be made from a comparator op amp

The 2 analogue inputs one from a off course compass and the other a course setting pot

The output voltage con then be fed to a LM3914 circuit as below



You may be able to use an Arduino to do the job

I use the LM3914 with a pot connected to my rudder as a rudder position indicator at my inside helm position

 

[john_morris_uk]

But...
Steering a boat is a lot more complicated than just keeping it on course.
Think quartering seas, wind gusts, judging weather helm etc

 

[rotrax]

We took a really serious sailor on a trip with a simple and well underpowered narrowboat down the South Stratford Canal. He had sailed most Oceans and was a pro delivery skipper.

It was Springtime after a wettish winter and the cut was full. A feature of this canal is that the pound overspill weirs from the pound above a lock exit immediatly in front of the bottom gates.

When going up, the bow is taken off by a huge stream of water, usually causing the steerer to miss the lock.

When going down, the bow is taken off when leaving.

One can, of course, by experience, mitigate this to some extent.

First Mate was the best, I was second best, our Yachtmaster Ocean guest could not cook it at all and was relagated to lock wheeling.

Despite showing him and explaining why it happened.

He was also unable to negotiate the skewed bridgeholes near Stratford.

Mind you, they really are the canal designers idea of a joke!

I fear he had an inbuilt worry about clanging the lockgates, bank or lockwall. With a GRP or wooden vessel one would agree.

Our crudely shaped and welded - it was built around a scaffold tube as a keelson - mattered not.

A brushful of bitumastic soon had it right

 

[rogerthebodger]

When Going up a flight of locks I would nudge the bow of the boat into the lower lock gate with the engine in forward on tick over to keep it there.

Emptying the lock the boat would open the gate itself and drive into the lock.

The real trick was to get onto the boat to stop it before it hit the sill of the upper gate.

Would really help when you had a staircase of licks like the Stourbridge 16 or the Tardebigge

Stourbridge Canal - Wikipedia

Tardebigge Locks - Wikipedia

Stratford-upon-Avon Canal - Wikipedia

 

[rotrax]

We used the same method, but on the South Stratford with a good flow from these overspill weirs the bow was pushed right off before it reached the gates.

The boat had to be positioned going up, to the right, where the stream was less. Then a hard turn with full throttle made to position the bow above the stream, the right amount to allow the stream to straighten it up when the throttle was released. Momentum was important, as it only had a 12HP Yanmar single cylinder engine.

Fortunately the locks were designed to assist this with a good well angled lead on the towpath side to guide the boats in.

Whether as a consequence of the overspill weirs or an understanding of the hydraulic flow I dont know.

Single handing a narrowboat on a narrow canal is a bit tricky, on a wide canal a bloody nightmare!

Respect!

 

[Rappey]

There is a commercially available product which features leds that indicate to the helmsman which way to turn the wheel.

I thought some chart plotters have a similar feature ?

 

[rogerthebodger]

We used the same method, but on the South Stratford with a good flow from these overspill weirs the bow was pushed right off before it reached the gates.

The boat had to be positioned going up, to the right, where the stream was less. Then a hard turn with full throttle made to position the bow above the stream, the right amount to allow the stream to straighten it up when the throttle was released. Momentum was important, as it only had a 12HP Yanmar single cylinder engine.

Fortunately the locks were designed to assist this with a good well angled lead on the towpath side to guide the boats in.

Whether as a consequence of the overspill weirs or an understanding of the hydraulic flow I dont know.

Single handing a narrowboat on a narrow canal is a bit tricky, on a wide canal a bloody nightmare!

Respect!

It was really having a single narrow boat in a wide lock. In a narrow lock the boat is kept under control.

Its also about planning as you found with the side inflow on the Stratford canal.

Canals are a different world with different skills

 

[pandos]

I thought some chart plotters have a similar feature ?

Yes mine do but hard to see without glasses..

 

[pandos]

But...
Steering a boat is a lot more complicated than just keeping it on course.
Think quartering seas, wind gusts, judging weather helm etc

I am aware of that, so are autopilot manufacturers, thus my thoughts that the brains and compass etc of an autopilot could be used, I am thinking of an St4001 which I keep as a spare.

What is then needed is a way to communicate the instructions to the helmsman, rather than to the 12v motor...this would ideally a device that is easy to see it in the dark and or rain.

 

[Adios]

Yes mine do but hard to see without glasses..

made in uk
£300 that seems excessive for a third of the parts of an autopilot and some LEDs

 

[pandos]

Its a simple off course indicator and can be made from a comparator op amp

The 2 analogue inputs one from a off course compass and the other a course setting pot

The output voltage con then be fed to a LM3914 circuit as below

View attachment 112664

You may be able to use an Arduino to do the job

I use the LM3914 with a pot connected to my rudder as a rudder position indicator at my inside helm position

Thanks for this info...looks like I'd need to do some studying and possibly need hypnosis to remember my electronics skills from 40years ago....?

Just to show how much of an neanderthal I am, whilst out walking I got the idea of using a 12v linear actuator which would move an indicator in the same way as the motor would move the wheel...

 

[Sandy]

Anyone got ideas along these lines..

I'm still trying to figure out if this is a late April Fool joke.

 

[Ink]

It would help to see the product do you have a link

So it has a compass and you set the course? or how does it get the desired heading? Sound like a nice idea for something bold to steer by but yes it needs to be a graduated signal for hand steering or you'd be constantly over steering and correcting.

Rather than a spare if you had an old autopilot with duff gearbox or motor could you make one from the commands happening inside it? The obvious place to tap into is the wires going to the motor. If it alters the amount of power applied depending on how big the course change needed there could be your graduated signal but from the sound of the tiller pilots I've had it just applies the same power for more or less time. But still I imagine a disconnected autopilot would be trying to make small alterations to counter boat movements not just course changes the same as one connected to the tiller so your red and green would be constantly alternating.

I assume the Op is referring to Autonnic Starlight.

Ink

 

[pandos]

I'm still trying to figure out if this is a late April Fool joke.

No it's not. Thanks to Ink for posting the link. For some reason my attempt went wrong

 

[Deleted member 36384]

I am not sure where the need is, even looking at the reasons given for the device in the link in post 15. Staring at an LED, even at horizon level is no different from staring at a compass, especially with regards to keeping a look out as the focus is on the device, not the wider area. A helm should be able to steer with occasional looks at the compass to course correct, not looking continually. Even on the darkest nights it is possible to see the forestay on the sea ahead and sense the course straightness or turn. Of course, some folks find this very hard and it is a skill that needs practise to become competent in. Having said that, as an aid to steering, it could be a useful tool and the point about the reference being further way from the helm is relevant.

 

[Adios]

I am not sure where the need is, even looking at the reasons given for the device in the link in post 15. Staring at an LED, even at horizon level is no different from staring at a compass, especially with regards to keeping a look out as the focus is on the device, not the wider area.

Other way around isn't it? I can imagine having LEDs visible in the peripheral vision when looking ahead will aid keeping a look out, needing to focus closer in on a compass less so.

But its not how i would spend £300. I only helm if the autopilot breaks or can't cope which is rare. And its only in pitch black conditions where there is nothing to steer by which is also rare. Chances of really benefiting from this practically zero so I'll manage without in those rare cases.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

No, not the other way around. I was meaning when keeping a lookout. When I steer by compass, in front of the helm, about belly button level, I still have peripheral vision when I look down at the compass, not peripheral vision to steer the boat by compass. Also I rarely steer sitting behind the compass but usually use the lubber lines that are 45 or 90 degrees to ships head. The point is, maintaining a look out when steering to a compass at night, is not that awkward a thing to do. I am not dismissing the tech, it could actually be a good way of steering. I am not the smoothest helm when steering a compass course as I get distracted by looking about!

 

[penfold]

I am not sure where the need is, even looking at the reasons given for the device in the link in post 15. Staring at an LED, even at horizon level is no different from staring at a compass, especially with regards to keeping a look out as the focus is on the device, not the wider area. A helm should be able to steer with occasional looks at the compass to course correct, not looking continually. Even on the darkest nights it is possible to see the forestay on the sea ahead and sense the course straightness or turn. Of course, some folks find this very hard and it is a skill that needs practise to become competent in. Having said that, as an aid to steering, it could be a useful tool and the point about the reference being further way from the helm is relevant.

+1 It's difficult to see what this is offering that a lit helm compass doesn't, if you need a lead use a drywipe marker to create an aide-memoire.