sara
New member
Anyone got thoughts/info. on steel sailing yachts please?
steel yachts
- Thread starter sara
- Start date
ccscott49
Active member
Good strong boats! A little cold, and a little too much condensation in warm/cold climates, but wonderful material and easy/cheap to repair. Easy to make deck fittings, any competent welder can do it, or yourself. I like it. But still like wood decks, which are often a nightmare on steel plates. Now with the advent of special epoxy coatings, rust is no longer the problem it was.
chippie
New member
They can be a bit heavy/slow in the smaller boat sizes.
ean_p
Well-known member
and foam on the hull inside sorts out most of the condensation issues......all round about the best material if your above 36ft
Lynette
Member
My steel yacht has 2-3inches of insulation throughout, it keeps beautifully warm and no condensation except on the portlights, even in the depth of winter.
Strength is a big asset. I can sail into places GRP boats my size won't follow because they fear damaging their keels should they run aground or hit an obstacle. I've hit a submerged object (container?) at full speed, and suffered no more than scratches. What with that, the warmth, and no need to spend several months drying out each year, I get far more use from my yacht than do most other people.
The original epoxy coating lasted 12 years. It has not been replaced - too expensive - and still lasts well on smooth surfaces like the outside hull that don't get knocked or trap water. But on deck and in the bilges there is a lot of regular patching up now.
Steel's weight has disadvantages. Performance is lower than equivalent GRP yachts, though I have won club races. Stability is an issue, and good designs are often deep, with limited headroom.
Strength is a big asset. I can sail into places GRP boats my size won't follow because they fear damaging their keels should they run aground or hit an obstacle. I've hit a submerged object (container?) at full speed, and suffered no more than scratches. What with that, the warmth, and no need to spend several months drying out each year, I get far more use from my yacht than do most other people.
The original epoxy coating lasted 12 years. It has not been replaced - too expensive - and still lasts well on smooth surfaces like the outside hull that don't get knocked or trap water. But on deck and in the bilges there is a lot of regular patching up now.
Steel's weight has disadvantages. Performance is lower than equivalent GRP yachts, though I have won club races. Stability is an issue, and good designs are often deep, with limited headroom.
BrianJ
New member
Love them... provided you are building or buying a yacht over say 36' My last was a van de stadt "seal", sure a little slower than the plastic boats , yet the security I wanted cruising the Pacific.
BrianJ
BrianJ
G
Guest
Guest
My boat is steel. It is a Dudley Dix design. There is a lot of info on his website - http://dixdesign.com/, including articles on construction materials. My boat is a Dix 38 and is "radius chine" construction.
I was nervous of steel to begin with, having had only grp boats before, but have grown in confidence with regard to maintenance and fixing things to the deck etc. One strange thing I miss about my previous grp boat is the smell of resin that greets you when you go below (after a short absense - like returning to your house after a holiday), and to me that smell is boaty!. Obviousy it is totally absent on a steel boat.
I was nervous of steel to begin with, having had only grp boats before, but have grown in confidence with regard to maintenance and fixing things to the deck etc. One strange thing I miss about my previous grp boat is the smell of resin that greets you when you go below (after a short absense - like returning to your house after a holiday), and to me that smell is boaty!. Obviousy it is totally absent on a steel boat.
PaulJ
Member
Mine's not finished yet so I can't tell you much from personal experience but I am told that though steel boats are heavy and possibly not as fast as their plastic counterparts, they make good passage times because their weight means that they carry their way well in a sea and don't slow up everytime they hit a wave.
There is an informative book called "Steel Away" by Le Cain W. Smith and Sheila Moir - ISBN 0-9615508-0-5
Also Metal Boat Society website..... www.metalboatsociety.com
and the Boatbuilding Community...... www.boatbuilding.com .... click on "discussions" and then click on "Metal Boats"
There is an informative book called "Steel Away" by Le Cain W. Smith and Sheila Moir - ISBN 0-9615508-0-5
Also Metal Boat Society website..... www.metalboatsociety.com
and the Boatbuilding Community...... www.boatbuilding.com .... click on "discussions" and then click on "Metal Boats"
G
Guest
Guest
Katoema is a 40' Suncoast, Dutch built centre cockpit steel ketch whose keel was laid down in 1979, launched in 1983. It is insulated throughout with 2cm thick natural cork. No condensation, except on stainless steel portlight surrounds.
Webasto central heating using hot water, allows the interior to keep very warm in artic conditions, whilst being cool and fresh in the tropics. With 13,5 tonnes of actual weight, the double V hull with deep keel, along with a very rakish bow, gives excellent performance even in the most confused seas. When it heels on to one of the V's it will stay there for days.
40' is about the minimum length for steel to have the benefits of weight/performance. With twin for'stays, the two trade wind sails alone give her 7-9 knots. A very safe vessel, she was bulit for a person of 2m tall and one leg, with his partner (quite petite) as crew doing all the deck work.
Katoema is a workhorse for my kind of sailing from the West coast of France all year round. Never to be sold, she has been bequeathed to RYA Sailability for the benefit of disabled sailers that want to do ocean sailing.
A very well proven design and much seen around the globe. Not sure about the UK though.
The Complete Guide to Metal Boats, including building, maintenance and repair for steel, aluminum, copper-nickel. Written by Bruch Roberts-Goodson and published by Mc Graw Hill (ISBN 0-07-136444-7)
Webasto central heating using hot water, allows the interior to keep very warm in artic conditions, whilst being cool and fresh in the tropics. With 13,5 tonnes of actual weight, the double V hull with deep keel, along with a very rakish bow, gives excellent performance even in the most confused seas. When it heels on to one of the V's it will stay there for days.
40' is about the minimum length for steel to have the benefits of weight/performance. With twin for'stays, the two trade wind sails alone give her 7-9 knots. A very safe vessel, she was bulit for a person of 2m tall and one leg, with his partner (quite petite) as crew doing all the deck work.
Katoema is a workhorse for my kind of sailing from the West coast of France all year round. Never to be sold, she has been bequeathed to RYA Sailability for the benefit of disabled sailers that want to do ocean sailing.
A very well proven design and much seen around the globe. Not sure about the UK though.
The Complete Guide to Metal Boats, including building, maintenance and repair for steel, aluminum, copper-nickel. Written by Bruch Roberts-Goodson and published by Mc Graw Hill (ISBN 0-07-136444-7)
jeanette
Member
I bought one last year and agree with all comments so far.
Insulation is a must, but with good heating and ventilation system you can avoid too many problems. I have got a diesel burning stove to keep me warm in the winter and being in the marina all winter I could use a dehumidifier from time to time too - but it wasn't really necessary.
You can keep the boat in the water all year round; why lift and dry when there is fine weather in December? You can do any work in the yard ni the Summer when they are not so busy or full with GRP.
Toughness. I hit something good and hard at Easter and had no worries about the boat or our safety (just a few about the paintwork).
The paints scheme on my boat is a simple epoxy and has been intact for over 15 years. It impressed the surveyor - all I have to do is maintain it. There are those who say a steel boat has to be blasted and re-primed every few years - I don't see any need for that if the paint system has been applied properly in the first place.
Steel boats are rarely the fastest vessels afloat but the compensation is a comfortable ride, even when it's blowing hard. I subscribe to the view that joy of sailing is in the journey, not in crossing the line first.
I received some good advice from this forum regarding selection and survey of steel boats. It will be more than 12 months old now but look for 'Buying Steel Boats' - if it's not around drop me a note and I will dig out my own copy for you.
Jeanette
Insulation is a must, but with good heating and ventilation system you can avoid too many problems. I have got a diesel burning stove to keep me warm in the winter and being in the marina all winter I could use a dehumidifier from time to time too - but it wasn't really necessary.
You can keep the boat in the water all year round; why lift and dry when there is fine weather in December? You can do any work in the yard ni the Summer when they are not so busy or full with GRP.
Toughness. I hit something good and hard at Easter and had no worries about the boat or our safety (just a few about the paintwork).
The paints scheme on my boat is a simple epoxy and has been intact for over 15 years. It impressed the surveyor - all I have to do is maintain it. There are those who say a steel boat has to be blasted and re-primed every few years - I don't see any need for that if the paint system has been applied properly in the first place.
Steel boats are rarely the fastest vessels afloat but the compensation is a comfortable ride, even when it's blowing hard. I subscribe to the view that joy of sailing is in the journey, not in crossing the line first.
I received some good advice from this forum regarding selection and survey of steel boats. It will be more than 12 months old now but look for 'Buying Steel Boats' - if it's not around drop me a note and I will dig out my own copy for you.
Jeanette
oldsaltoz
New member
G’day sara.
I tend to agree with the other posts however, no one has mentioned that replacing a structural member can be very expensive; great care is required when purchasing a second hand steel vessel to ensure all structural members are not damaged or corroded. Modern coatings will reduce maintenance frequency.
Avagoodweekend Old Salt Oz
I tend to agree with the other posts however, no one has mentioned that replacing a structural member can be very expensive; great care is required when purchasing a second hand steel vessel to ensure all structural members are not damaged or corroded. Modern coatings will reduce maintenance frequency.
Avagoodweekend Old Salt Oz
ccscott49
Active member
You mention twin forestays and tradewind sails, opinions, please, on twin forestays and twin sails or twin sails on single forestay (roller reefing) I dont have twin forestays and am trying to decide whether it's worthwhile fitting another or just using twin yankees on my roller. Thanks.
G
Guest
Guest
The original owner, as I mentioned was disabled and his wife carried out all the deck work. It was easier for their situation. With twin for'stays I have greater flexibility with hanking on other sails when not in a trade wind situation. Having never had furling sails, and brought up in the 50's with gaff and gunter rigs, it is my preferance for manual hauling up and down sails.
Having read a few of your postings, it would be interesting to know what you eventually intend to do when you finish with the "Rigs" and carry out some real global cruising, if that's your goal. You certainly can hold an audience and I, for one, would be pleased to follow your exploits.
Having read a few of your postings, it would be interesting to know what you eventually intend to do when you finish with the "Rigs" and carry out some real global cruising, if that's your goal. You certainly can hold an audience and I, for one, would be pleased to follow your exploits.
ccscott49
Active member
Right now, I'm going to cruise round the meddy, until I can finally finish with the rigs, another two years or so from now. I can cruise whilst not working. After which, I will head across the pond to the carib, west coast of USA, great lakes, then I hope up to British Columbia and further north. I'm not sure about the pacific, It might be just too much for the way Englander is configured as a motor sailer, I would have to fit giant fuel tanks, or maybe extend her rig even more! I am single handed a lot of the time, no wifey or "bidey in" as we say in Scotland, so I'm limited at present with what I can do. I have to leave the boat in marinas when I'm working, which proves expensive. My plans are always flexible, they have to be, I'm having trouble right now, finding somebody to come with me from Lagos, to Gib and costa del sol, before I pick up three of my friends, then on to the Ballearics! and thats in a 57' motor sailer, with all the bells and whistles! Funny old life innit'.
PaulJ
Member
Colin, as I said in my posting above, my boat isn't finished yet but the rig and sails are ready and for what it's worth....... The boat is cutter rigged and the foresail is a high cut Yankee. For downwind sailing I have a second slightly larger and lighter weight sail, smaller than a Genoa, that has a Dyneema luff and can be used "flying", ie without an extra forestay. This sail also has a small cord in the luff just forward of the Dyneema so that it can be slid into the second track of the roller furler foil and used either on it's own in lighter weather upwind making use of it's greater area or it could be used in with the yankee in the other track for downwind sailing as an alternative to flying it free.
I can't claim any credit for the idea but it seemed like a very versatile sail that could be used in a variety of different circumstances.......
I can't claim any credit for the idea but it seemed like a very versatile sail that could be used in a variety of different circumstances.......
ccscott49
Active member
Paul,
What a bloody good idea! I have a spare halyard up for'd which would be ideal, the versitility of this sail sounds great, like a yankee cut, cruisingshute/duster/genoa almost kind of thingy, Oh! you know what I mean!!! I will definitely consider this, as it solves my dilema, My boat is also cutter rigged with high cut yankee, almost equilateral, I can use my twin poles for that aswell, even if I get it trhe same as my present yankee, it will work! excellent thankyou!
Colin.
What a bloody good idea! I have a spare halyard up for'd which would be ideal, the versitility of this sail sounds great, like a yankee cut, cruisingshute/duster/genoa almost kind of thingy, Oh! you know what I mean!!! I will definitely consider this, as it solves my dilema, My boat is also cutter rigged with high cut yankee, almost equilateral, I can use my twin poles for that aswell, even if I get it trhe same as my present yankee, it will work! excellent thankyou!
Colin.
summerwind
New member
Re: Twin head sails on single foil:
I saw a thread on this a short time ago. Someone said that if you put the two sails on the single furling rig, then you will suffer from rolling when running down the trades.
Someone then suggested not having the poles fixed to the mast, but somehow fixed to each other by a spring arrangement?
Any idea how this would work? If the inner ends of the poles are not fixed to the mast, what brand of sky hook fixes the inner ends?
Any answer would be greatly appreciated.
I saw a thread on this a short time ago. Someone said that if you put the two sails on the single furling rig, then you will suffer from rolling when running down the trades.
Someone then suggested not having the poles fixed to the mast, but somehow fixed to each other by a spring arrangement?
Any idea how this would work? If the inner ends of the poles are not fixed to the mast, what brand of sky hook fixes the inner ends?
Any answer would be greatly appreciated.
ccscott49
Active member
The rig is called a "twissle" the two ends of the poles are connected together and a down haul and topping lift are there to support them and allow them to swing with the sails, the sheets keeping the outboard ends under control, it works that much I know, but it was me who asked about the twin sails and never got much by the way of consensus. But I now know how to do it both ways, with the same sail and notneed two forestays, so I'm happy and will test it myself.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: steel yacht length
My steel, cutter-rigged boat is 33ft O.D. which is 8ft longer than the smallest I know of. With her long & deep keel she sails well and carries her way in short, steep seas. In a force 7/8 wind on the quarter, blowing free over a short fetch, she skated along at 9 to 10 knots. 30ft to 32 ft gives adequate room for two or three crew, is not too demanding of maintenance and allows for more choice of tight anchorages. Steel hulls, well made and epoxy coated from new, give long and reliable service. This boat has rockwool fibre insulation, warm in cold weather, but the beer in the bilges is always cool!
My steel, cutter-rigged boat is 33ft O.D. which is 8ft longer than the smallest I know of. With her long & deep keel she sails well and carries her way in short, steep seas. In a force 7/8 wind on the quarter, blowing free over a short fetch, she skated along at 9 to 10 knots. 30ft to 32 ft gives adequate room for two or three crew, is not too demanding of maintenance and allows for more choice of tight anchorages. Steel hulls, well made and epoxy coated from new, give long and reliable service. This boat has rockwool fibre insulation, warm in cold weather, but the beer in the bilges is always cool!
