Starting area collision. Who to blame?

Triassic said:
I guess we could have protested the third boat for forcing the eventual outcome, but I took the view that it is after all just a race and instead settled on accepting the RO's appreciation that I hadn't fed two trimarans going at full chat straight into his transom.......
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Only problem with that way of dealing with it is that you've just marked yourself out as someone who can be bullied into accepting a barger.

Protests are a pain, no doubt about it, but barging is against the rules mainly because it's very dangerous! If we all start just letting bargers off, then everyone barges and chaos rules. I have found in 7 years of racing in largely one fleet that you generally only have to protest someone once. I can't think of a boat that I've taken to the room more than once, for any reason. Once it is known that you a) know the rules and b) apply the rules, you generally don't get any problems with bargers, people throwing it up the inside with no rights etc. And as a result you get hit less, and spend less time in the room. In fact I haven't been in a protest room yet this season, and I'm not sure I was in one at all last year either.
 
Triassic said:
Technically they haven't "paid" for it, their insurer has taken it on and they may well act in a less gentlemanly manner......

With regard to the sportsmanship point of view I personally feel their are never winners in a protest hearing, only losers. We were involved in a start line incident last weekend when we had a windward boat trying to roll over us at the committee boat end of the line. We could easily have shut him out however he had another boat trying to do the same to him so we eased and gave him room as he clearly couldn't go up until the other boat responded to his call, however he took everything we gave him plus a bit more and in the end the boat above him made it through as well, leaving us well stuffed! I guess we could have protested the third boat for forcing the eventual outcome, but I took the view that it is after all just a race and instead settled on accepting the RO's appreciation that I hadn't fed two trimarans going at full chat straight into his transom.......
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Yes, it is sometimes hard to remember, in the heat of the moment, that we are doing it all for fun! If you are close enough to speak then a cry of "I'll let you in but it will cost you a beer" is a fair response in most club situations.
Peter
 
Resolution said:
Yes, it is sometimes hard to remember, in the heat of the moment, that we are doing it all for fun! If you are close enough to speak then a cry of "I'll let you in but it will cost you a beer" is a fair response in most club situations.
Peter
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No that is absolutely not acceptable if there are other boats in the race.
 
lw395 said:
No that is absolutely not acceptable if there are other boats in the race.
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Exactly. How would you feel if I let the one chap you have to beat in the series barge me at the start, allowing him to sail off and control the race, then you see him thanking me and buying me a beer at the club?

That's not sport, that's a stitch up.

The only situation where I have done anything similar is when I was fouled at the start by a persistent back marker who was barging but wasn't aware it wasn't allowed. No damage, and we won the race, so I didn't bother filing the protest but went over to him with a beer in the club to have a chat about the situation, and the rules as I saw them. All done in a friendly manner, and hopefully less off-putting than a back marker being protested by the winner, whilst also helping a new racer with the rules.
 
This discussion about protest/no protest reminds me of the regular disagreements about what to do as a stand-on vessel when faced with an enormous ship - when people propose the better thing to do is to alter course to (hopefully) avoid any encounter. If skippers are sometimes allowing others to break the rules, sometimes not, then chaos will be the norm and collisions become more likely? The rules are meant to help us all avoid collisions in a fair and understood manner and I reckon they should be enforced by all in the fleet. If no-one is ever doing turns, it's probably not a real race?
 
flaming said:
Only problem with that way of dealing with it is that you've just marked yourself out as someone who can be bullied into accepting a barger.
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Not necessarily so. They were left in no doubt as to what my options could have been and what is likely to happen should they try it again. A protest does not undo what has been done, it can only help prevent re-occurances and if you are racing in a regular circuit a word at the bar afterwards can be just as effective. We're not talking about racing at international professional level here where millions are at stake, we're talking about having some fun and once people are aware that you know the rules they don't, in my experience, take to many liberties. It was the first time I had raced against these individuals and the fact that neither came anywhere near me again for the remaining starts in the regatta rather proves the point.
 
Triassic said:
Not necessarily so. They were left in no doubt as to what my options could have been and what is likely to happen should they try it again. A protest does not undo what has been done, it can only help prevent re-occurances and if you are racing in a regular circuit a word at the bar afterwards can be just as effective. We're not talking about racing at international professional level here where millions are at stake, we're talking about having some fun and once people are aware that you know the rules they don't, in my experience, take to many liberties. It was the first time I had raced against these individuals and the fact that neither came anywhere near me again for the remaining starts in the regatta rather proves the point.
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Nicely put. Obviously it depends on what level of racing you are in. Professionalism, costs, prizes are all factors. Also the value (to you) of your boat. Mine represents a large part of my pension fund and I am less inclined to get into aggressive situations than when I raced a tough old Sigma 33. Horses for courses.
 
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