Standing Rigging 'swollen swage fittings'

geem said:
What would constitute doubt? Age? A detailed visual inspection could suggest the rigging is in perfect condition. How far do you go? Take all the tangs off the mast to check for corrosion under them? In my experience there is lots of hidden corrosion under stainless steel on a mast that would be more of a concern on an older boat than rigging that is in good visual condition, but it their are other factors. Is the particular boat conservatively rigged? A friend has a boat of overall same length as mine. He did an Atlantic circuit on her. Had a bad storm on the way home. Cockpit filled up multiple times. Storm sails and lying on the saloon floor. That boat is rigged in 8mm wire. Mine is rigged in 12mm wire. Which one would be more of a concern assuming both the same age?
I might be tempted to change the rig at 10 years if mine was lightly rigged but it's not. The rig is strong and was designed like that from new. The mast is all welded. No structural rivets
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What constitutes doubt ?

It why we stopped NDT work ... I was invited by a Metal Fabrication Works to take on NDT for them .... despite having excellent skilled people for the work - we withdrew later ... and guys left - started up their own Company.

I do not miss the work at all !!
 
geem said:
. . . How far do you go? Take all the tangs off the mast to check for corrosion under them?
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Yes! At least some of them and have a look! The condition of masts (and booms) with age is largely dependent on the care that was taken in their construction. I've seen masts of all ages including 50 year old ones that were put together with lavish quantities of Duralac, be in perfect condition where as removing fittings from others as young as 20 years old has revealed massive holes.

The same is true of chainplates that pass through decks or one side is hard against a fibreglass service. You know nothing until you've extracted them and inspected them in their entirety.

The further you plan to sail, the more vigilant (some) owners tend to be. But no one should think that an automatic insurance mandated replacement of your rigging wire every ten years is the way to guarentee your rig's integrity. It's a 'system' - completely dependent on its weakest link.
 
A few years ago I decided to sail the Atlantic (for the first time) and my son came with me. My 34 foot sloop was in well used but sound condition and the standing rigging had no apparent defects but was 8 years old. However, having a son on board concentrates the mind in odd ways and I decided to get all the standing rigging replaced professionally.

In mid Atlantic, in strong winds and heavy rolling, I went forward to do something and something sharp stuck in my hand. The 8 mm aft shroud (two months old at this point) was stranded with 3 or 4 broken strands just above the swage. I checked on the other side and the corresponding shroud was similarly damaged. Gulp!

Lots of improvisation with tensioned Prusik knots followed and we tried to sail in as gentle manner as conditions allowed. When we arrived safely in Martinique one of the excellent French riggers there took one look at the two shrouds, immediately pronounced "Overswaged", and produced replacements inside two hours.

I find it hard not to think that leaving well enough alone with sound and well-tested rigging would have saved a great deal of the stress that occurred with its well-well-inentioned replacement...
 
kalanka said:
A few years ago I decided to sail the Atlantic (for the first time) and my son came with me. My 34 foot sloop was in well used but sound condition and the standing rigging had no apparent defects but was 8 years old. However, having a son on board concentrates the mind in odd ways and I decided to get all the standing rigging replaced professionally.

In mid Atlantic, in strong winds and heavy rolling, I went forward to do something and something sharp stuck in my hand. The 8 mm aft shroud (two months old at this point) was stranded with 3 or 4 broken strands just above the swage. I checked on the other side and the corresponding shroud was similarly damaged. Gulp!

Lots of improvisation with tensioned Prusik knots followed and we tried to sail in as gentle manner as conditions allowed. When we arrived safely in Martinique one of the excellent French riggers there took one look at the two shrouds, immediately pronounced "Overswaged", and produced replacements inside two hours.

I find it hard not to think that leaving well enough alone with sound and well-tested rigging would have saved a great deal of the stress that occurred with its well-well-inentioned replacement...
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I watched a well known Chandlers rigger go for lunch and leave his assistant to form a new stay for me ... this was Talurit not full Swage - but same applies. I refused the stay he made :

He compressed it TWICE in the machine.

I waited for the Rigger to return and we had a polite chat about it. He agreed it was not correct and made up a new stay. I asked him to at least cut the ends of the refused stay to stop it being passed to anyone else. He agreed and it was cut.

It may have been similar action for your new rigging ?
 
Daydream believer said:
So that is some unqualified geezer with no knowledge of rigging, other than " Well I have got some" looking at it & saying " Yup. Looks Ok to me" - is it?

Not knowing the process involved, from what I have read on this forum, some years ago, I would suggest that "the best inspection techniques available" might cost as much as just buying new rigging in the first place.
But to each his own & I have changed mine.
If you & others, want to use older rigging, that is your choice & you are entitled to make it.
Many do with no issues.
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There are considerable stages between an unqualified geezer having a look and a full electronic survey, which in my experience is barely better anyway. It is perfectly possible to carry out a detailed survey yourself using only a magnifying glass and your fingers.
 
I have often found on rig checks that the original terminal staging was pulled by offset dies resulting in banana terminals.
Some different manufacturers of swaged terminal fittings have a great thickness of stainless to squeeze, which results in variations in terminal diameters.
 
Daydream believer said:
Seeing it & acting on it are 2 different things
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Do you put yourself in this category? I certainly dont. Vyv is correct. It really isn't hard to survey your own rig. I take a good quality glass lense magnifying glass, reading glasses and a camera phone. You can inspect for cracks extremely well with the magnifying glass and a finger nail can also detect cracks. Photo everything you are not happy about for a second opinion if in doubt. The camera also gets in to spaces you can't as easily.
I have taught others how to inspect their rig. It's a good skill to have.
I have worked with riggers who have missed stuff I have picked up. I think I put more time and effort in since I have the time and I want to be certain there are no issues. I don't believe a rigger would do a better job than me. When we first got my boat I had it re- rigged. They used the wrong size clevis pins in several fittings. So much for proffessional riggers. Are I am sure there are good riggers but far safer in my mind to do your own inspection especially if you are from an engineering background
 
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When inspecting a rig consider doing a dye test. I pulled and disassembled most of the rig a few years ago and dye tested all the key areas. It revealed an otherwise invisible crack in a stemball end on one of the diagonals. The part was replaced and a potential drama was averted. It’s not expensive to buy the test chemicals and they worked well and were easy to use.
 
The good thing for us is that most stainless fittings are polished, making it fairly easy to see any cracks that develop. Many years ago I rebuilt a Velocette Venom, including a complete engine rebuild. I was about to put the forged steel valve rockers back as they were, when I decided to polish them. I'm glad I did, because once polished I could just see a crack developing where the inlet valve arm joined the body of the rocker.
 
Zing said:
When inspecting a rig consider doing a dye test. I pulled and disassembled most of the rig a few years ago and dye tested all the key areas. It revealed an otherwise invisible crack in a stemball end on one of the diagonals. The part was replaced and a potential drama was averted. It’s not expensive to buy the test chemicals and they worked well and were easy to use.
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Agreed. The dye kits are surprisingly effective.
 
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