stand alone or integrated radar and plotter?

[chubby]

I have a new raymarine 7 inch MFD and existing standalone Furuno 1623 radar. I was thinking of a raymarine radar overlain on the plotter. I am sure the new raymarine radars have many advantages over the old Furuno but thinking of how I would actually use them, the radar has a 7 inch portrait mode screen run ships head up and the plotter is landscape and north up.


To have the radar head up makes sense as you are looking towards things to avoid whereas north up on the plotter is similar to a chart.

Do folk use the radar overlay in practice or does splitting a 7 inch display give two screens that are too small?

I know the well rehearsed debate about radar vs AIS but in actual practice the radar is only used in fog a few times a year unless for practice, so is the benefit of the new radar worth the effort and expense and is the radar overlay worthwhile on a small display or is a separate screen better?

 

[pvb]

I find the radar/chart overlay is much easier to interpret than separate screens. Assuming your plotter is at the helm, it also puts the radar image next to the helmsman (if we're allowed to use that term any more) whereas your existing Furuno radar might not be as convenient to view.

There's no reason why you shouldn't set your plotter to course up when using the overlay, if you find that easier to view.

Splitting a 7" display does give very small images - my eyesight isn't good enough for that.

 

[Martin_J]

As pvb says, the overlay function is great..

If however you're used to a north up chart display, you'd need a heading sensor of some sort to allow the radar to overlay as north up.

(but the heading sensor would also be needed if you wanted heading up on the charts to match a head up radar display)..

Any heading sensor will do for this .. although 10Hz updates really needed if you want the displays to match enough for marpa.

What new Raymarine MFD do you have and whereabouts are you in Hampshire? PM me if you'd like to see the Raymarine Quantum radome displayed on a 7" MFD in Southsea, or if you want to see what it looks like on your MFD sometime! Then you'd be able to compare side by side...

 

[prv]

I often use the radar in overlay mode. It instantly makes clear what echoes are charted objects such as buoys, and which are uncharted and hence probably vessels. Also, in near-coastal waters, as long as the land echoes are lining up with the charted features, I’m getting an automatic cross-check of the GPS position in the plotter and don’t need to worry that I’m navigating by a single source of position which of course is very naughty

Putting AIS targets on the same screen as well allows me to deprioritise returns from transmitting vessels - which the Vesper will help me keep track of - and concentrate especially on those visible only by radar which require manual monitoring (or did, on my old radar with ludicrously unreliable MARPA. The automatic radar target monitoring on the new Raymarine kit seems far better but I haven’t yet used it enough to have solid experience.)

I use charts, radar, and AIS all in north-up mode, and seem to be able to rotate my mental model as required when switching from screen to binos

Pete

 

[jwilson]

I have never actually owned a boat with radar, but have used quite a few over the years. "Raw" radar needs a lot of skill to interpret - those professionals who have that skill often seem to regard radar as their main data input for coastal navigation as well as for collision avoidance. Few occasional users are that good - I certainly am not. Radar overlaid on a chart plotter is MUCH easier to work with.

 

[Bobc]

With your MFD, you can also use an iPad as a remote screen using the MFD's in-built wifi, which will give you a 10" screen for when you need it (also useful to have at the chart table).

 

[Solent Sailor]

A 7inch MFD isn't big enough for split screen to be really useful - I agree.

The overlay function is very good though. I use it a lot, but in bad vis I would have prefer to see both an overlaid image side by side (whether on a separate or split screen) because the clutter of the overlaid chart could cause you to miss something small. It's not a major concern, but it gives me more confidence.

 

[pvb]

The overlay function is very good though. I use it a lot, but in bad vis I would have prefer to see both an overlaid image side by side (whether on a separate or split screen) because the clutter of the overlaid chart could cause you to miss something small. It's not a major concern, but it gives me more confidence.

It's usually possible on most plotters to de-clutter the chart data, to make it clearer.

 

[chubby]

With your MFD, you can also use an iPad as a remote screen using the MFD's in-built wifi, which will give you a 10" screen for when you need it (also useful to have at the chart table).

Good idea: I have a 10 inch tablet that can act as a second screen when needed!

 

[chubby]

I have never actually owned a boat with radar, but have used quite a few over the years. "Raw" radar needs a lot of skill to interpret - those professionals who have that skill often seem to regard radar as their main data input for coastal navigation as well as for collision avoidance. Few occasional users are that good - I certainly am not. Radar overlaid on a chart plotter is MUCH easier to work with.

I think that accounts for the professional view that radar is the primary aid but the leisure users view that AIS and plotter are easier, granted that not all fishing boats and Norwegian frigates display AIS!

 

[chubby]

As pvb says, the overlay function is great..

If however you're used to a north up chart display, you'd need a heading sensor of some sort to allow the radar to overlay as north up.

(but the heading sensor would also be needed if you wanted heading up on the charts to match a head up radar display)..

Any heading sensor will do for this .. although 10Hz updates really needed if you want the displays to match enough for marpa.

What new Raymarine MFD do you have and whereabouts are you in Hampshire? PM me if you'd like to see the Raymarine Quantum radome displayed on a 7" MFD in Southsea, or if you want to see what it looks like on your MFD sometime! Then you'd be able to compare side by side...

I have the eS one, runs lighthouse 2 but I liked the backup of controls as well as touch screen, linked to the new raymarine 700 AIS, just thinking whether to go the whole hog and replace the 12 year old monochrome Furuno with the quantum: does yours link by wireless? the eS wont run the very latest doppler radar according to the dealer, Hudson marine, but thinking of the original quantum, should be very good.

 

[prv]

I think that accounts for the professional view that radar is the primary aid but the leisure users view that AIS and plotter are easier

Also the fact that the 10' scanner on the merchant ship or ferry will have a narrower beamwidth and hence much clearer picture than an 18" leisure radome and its collection of blobs on screen.

Pete

 

[Martin_J]

I have the eS one, runs lighthouse 2 but I liked the backup of controls as well as touch screen, linked to the new raymarine 700 AIS, just thinking whether to go the whole hog and replace the 12 year old monochrome Furuno with the quantum: does yours link by wireless? the eS wont run the very latest doppler radar according to the dealer, Hudson marine, but thinking of the original quantum, should be very good.

I actually use a mast mounted Simrad 3G radome with B&Z Zeus MFDs on board, and the OpenCPN radar plugin (for fun)..

I've a spare es78 on board that I was considering upgrading to Lighthouse 3 and a Quantum radome that will work with it either wired or wireless.. They run happily from the spare motorbike battery if I want them mobile..

I'll post a video if I can shortly showing AIS and Radar overlay whilst in Braye harbour this summer.. Sadly I didn't record the video when the radar showed a rowing boat going past..

 

[johnalison]

I have a Raymarine e7 with radar. I don't find the overlay particularly useful because it only shows the echos in purple. Although it is adjustable, I don't find that it gives as much information as switching to radar alone, when the multi-colours allow me to adjust the gain, clutter and other controls and judge the 'quality' of an echo. I also find wakes useful, and like to scroll between various ranges. My plotter already shows AIS and I find that switching back and forth with radar more helpful, though I do prefer to have a single box and the ability to show north-up on radar. As for rowing boats, birds make more interesting targets and cormorants show up particularly well.

 

[dom]

I have a Raymarine e7 with radar. I don't find the overlay particularly useful because it only shows the echos in purple. Although it is adjustable, I don't find that it gives as much information as switching to radar alone, when the multi-colours allow me to adjust the gain, clutter and other controls and judge the 'quality' of an echo. I also find wakes useful, and like to scroll between various ranges. My plotter already shows AIS and I find that switching back and forth with radar more helpful, though I do prefer to have a single box and the ability to show north-up on radar. As for rowing boats, birds make more interesting targets and cormorants show up particularly well.

+1 On a 24' ship's screen with a 10' antenna overlays are great. Like you I have 2x e-displays and old dedicated screen for the radar.

For the reasons you describe I prefer to keep the radar separate, and for the purposes of redundancy like to keep a separate radar circuit independent of the main nav network

 

[Martin_J]

A few photos here showing the 3G radar overlay. Next time on board I'll take a better screen capture rather than a photo..
Marina view
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AIaL0Fl7hXvVrGE

Zoomed out a little
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AIaL0Fl7hXvVrGI

Zoomed out a little more
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AIaL0Fl7hXvVrGM

As PRV mentioned earlier - Overlay is nice to give a double check that the images are aligned by comparing local coastline..

Video showing overlay.. I guess you can see this anywhere.. but was just nice to look at whilst sipping a drink on the visitor moorings in summer.

https://youtu.be/kM74pLzBadM

It's also nice that the newer radomes are instant on (no waiting 90 seconds) and use very little power when compared with the old.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

It's usually possible on most plotters to de-clutter the chart data, to make it clearer.

Only if you are using vector charts, which is the defaiult option for most plotters. But a number of people on here profess to prefer raster...

 

[Martin_J]

I have a Raymarine e7 with radar. I don't find the overlay particularly useful because it only shows the echos in purple. Although it is adjustable, I don't find that it gives as much information as switching to radar alone, when the multi-colours allow me to adjust the gain, clutter and other controls and judge the 'quality' of an echo. I also find wakes useful, and like to scroll between various ranges.

I agree.. The Raymarine default purple overlay for Radar doesn't look as bright..

Settings for the photo below I seem to think were either in default or 'harbour' mode...
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AIaL0Fl7hXvVrGQ

As to zooming in and out... I'm sure by default the radar overlay will zoom in and out as the chart is zoomed.. On the B&G, the gain, clutter and other controls are still available for the radar. I thought they were for the Raymarine.

 

[Solent Sailor]

It's usually possible on most plotters to de-clutter the chart data, to make it clearer.

Certainly - but I quite like my clutter and having a very simple radar plot next to what I'm accustomed to seeing works well for me.

 

[dunedin]

We have a Raymarine Quantum radar connected (wirelessly) to an e7 at the chart table. (RaymarIne fail to provide software to support it on the older E Series wide at the helm).
Works well. Depending on the situation we use either full screen overlay, or split screen with dedicated chart window. Plenty big enough for at the chart table and when in fog we also have it showing on the iPad held by the skipper / navigator in the cockpit. Works well having main chartplotter on navigation and radar on iPad.

With your MFD, you can also use an iPad as a remote screen using the MFD's in-built wifi, which will give you a 10" screen for when you need it (also useful to have at the chart table).