Stanchions.

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doug748

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Following the previous "old gits" post..... I was looking through Yachting World and saw that all the really neat, new sailing boats were pictured without stanchions and guardwires. If I did not have them I would do without ( forward of the cockpit that is). What does the team think?
 
As a kid I grew up on little 'Old Gaffers' that didn't have have any kind of guard rail or stanchions and just accepted that you don't go near the edge. I never fell in nor did any of my family, which suggests we did hold on when necessary.
Since the early 70's when we got a boat with guard rails I have got used to them and now feel nervous on deck when replacing them!

However I don't have any qualms about carrying out sail work at the mast in any weather - just clip on and get on with it!

Cheers

Andy
 
You don't see folkboats with guardrails. You don't see my boat with them now either. I took the stanchion bases off to refurbish them, which I did, but couldn't be bothered to refit them.
I used to sail on a gaffer without any guardrails on the Humber, and a Humber One Design which was an 18 ft clinker dinghy. You don't see guard rails on dinghies, do you?
It's like 'roo bars on urban jeeps. No point, a mere affectation pinched from the people who need them. Like, in the case of guard rails, ocean voyagers.
 
Accept what you say, although moving forward from the mast to the forestay on my boat when the cabin top has blended into the deck and there is 10' from baby stay to the forestay is scary even when clipped on.

The wooden grab rails are very low so it's a case of crawling along the deck to get forward at which time the guard rails give a nice comforting feeling.

Falling off dinghies isn't so much of a bad thing as they usually stop when you are out. Falling off the windward rail at 8 knots with a 4' drop is a different thought.
 
I wasn't advocating being reckless. Just that a lot of smaller boats are more difficult to move around with guard rails fitted. In reality they are often below knee level and whilst giving a sense of security may be a liability.
 
I'm tempted to agree with you [now there's a first!]. The ones on my boat are 21" high, as far as I can remember not being near it at the moment. This is a good height for tripping over. If you do fall in, they make getting on board more difficult. The sense of security they give is probably false. They are in the way when handling mooring lines, anchors etc. They are weak and easily damaged by other boats. They look horrible. They get in the way when fishing or bathing or hauling up buckets of water.

Pilot boats don't have them because they would get smashed going alongside ships, yet they are out in all weathers and seem to have a good safety record.
Instead they have a very sturdy inboard grabrail.

Personally I think I would rather rely on good grabrails and safety harness. Why don't I? Because SWMBO feels safer with them and as cook she is the most important person on board and has to be looked after.
 
I think they are a pain in the butt. (crutch if you are trying to get off !).
The leverage they have on their bases is very high - hence the damage they cause to decks is enormous; they offer a false sense of security as the sort of wave which would put you over is the one which throws you over them (BTDT).
But - I am very careful with harness and line to a central jackstay.
They also look dreadful - and one reason for building my boat is because it is beautiful. (so no radar arch, windmill etc. etc.)
Yeah - I know I am boring !
Ken
 
Yep ! I have no cleats on deck - keep them along the edge. No tracks either !
Lifeboats have a completely different role from a pleasure yacht. If you look at a picture of one, you may notice other differences.
Ken
 
Hi
Mine are coming off (the stanchions, that is..).

The leverage is indeed the problem. and in my case a loose mounting let in water and led to rot.
If you raft up a lot (Bembridge, Yarmouth...) then people clamber across. You get some old boy in brick-coloured trousers. "Mind if I come across old chap?" "Go ahead, of course" And he grabs the wire, heaves 15 stone across, followed by his missis whose technique is to pull the boat a bit closer, again using the guardrail, before sitting on it on the way over (short legs don't you know).

The force applied by 15 stone 24 inches above the stanchion fitting -- well I'll leave that to the engineers, but having seen the results, off come the lot.

People will just have to hold on tight.

Chris
 
Took mine off six years ago, for that very reason.

Have not missed them for a moment - and we have a five year old boy, who was taken sailing before he could walk. His elder brother, now 12, used to fall in once a season, but, since he always had a harness and lifeline on, it was the work of a moment to retrieve him!

We have an absolute rule - children - lifejackets and harnesses at all times on deck.

Adults - ditto when going out of sheltered waters.

Both - lifejackets at all times in the dinghy (much the most dangerous thing in boating!)
 
An interesting post. Ours came with them, would we take them off. On balance no. To put this in context I'm talking about a 38' boat with widish sidedecks, low grab rails and not a great deal to hold onto once beyond the mast.

I agree with the points about not stopping a standing adult, I'm 6' 4" tall and don't have particularly good balance and it is only on boats like Nauticats where you have solid rails that I have any confidence in them not pitching me over. OTOH, I'd like to think that they would stop me rolling over the edge in the event of a slip on the foredeck, or at the very least would give something to grab on to.

The rail has definitely stopped Liz going over a couple of times, so even though the stanchion bases leak they'll be staying.
 
Agree 100% Mirelle's rules about kids, lifejackets, harness.
Would add that I am keeping the pushpit (and pulpit of course), that I plan to extend the pushpit a little forward to allow full size dodgers to go on being used, and the boat is only 24ft, with a high coachroof so plenty to hold onto.
Indeed the side decks are so narrow that it became a hazard to inch your way along, constrained by the cabin side and the rails.
I studied ways of re-fixing the stanchions, including an ineresting US perspective from one of those incredibly expert Woodenboat type shipwrights, and the conclusion seemed to be that the stanchion bases were inevitably going to be a weak spot.
Chris
 
The RNLI offshore lifeboats generally have a substantial toerail (bolted to brackets on deck) to which are secured the (equally substantial) stanchions for the lifelines - this is (IMHO) a much more effective method of securing them, rather than eg bolting bases to the deck.

I would always feel much safer on the foredeck if (given the choice) I had a small bulwark and no stanchions to contend with (while clipped on), rather than tall stanchions and no bulwark or toerail (while still being clipped on).
This is based on having nearly gone overboard under the lifelines on a couple of occasions because there was not even a toerail as an obstruction to impede progress.

Of course the ideal situation would be to have good stanchions of a proper height fastened to an impressive bulwark - but generally only 'larger' vessels can pull this off aesthetically and practically.
 
Well! I expected to get pelted on this one. We are almost as one: the bloody things are useless, offensive to the eye and a probable source of damage to the deck. Often singlehanding, I find myself going forward without a harness because of the false security the dam things give; without them I would rig the jackstays and clip on as I should. Off to room 101 with them. Brian
 
Yes. you're probably right about the perception of safety. Bit like ABS tempting people to brake too late into corners in the wet and such.
 
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