Skull and crossbones

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nickfabbri

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With reference to another " discussion " in the bar following a "few" pints imbibed because poor weather stopped sailing~

There is opinion that the use of the skull and crossbones flag/ motif still signals piracy and as such is illegal to fly a flag/burgee/spinnaker with the skull and crossbones on it.

The counter arguement is that " surely if a couple of kids are out in a dinghy messing about, then it poses no harm", whereas if you happen to own a rusty skiff and are bobbing about off the coast of Somalia, then it may have more sinister implications.

I am just curious, and open this to the forum. Plus i do have a secret hankering for a huge black spinnaker with the motif on.
 
Andrew_Fanner said:
We have understood for years the flying of the JR when moored up, to indicate "kids on board looking for other kids to play with".
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We tried explaining that to the French CG but got nowhere........ :(

I can hardly believe that the Somalis are flying JRs.

Shame there isn't a definitive 'kids on board' flag to fly.

Then again, here in the Med there aren't many (any?).

C.
 
nickfabbri said:
whereas if you happen to own a rusty skiff and are bobbing about off the coast of Somalia, then it may have more sinister implications.
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If only pirates off Somalia raised their JR's before going to sea, it would make life so much easier for the navy who could then use them for target practice without fear of being accused of attacking an "innocent but armed fishing boats"...
 
Such a law has no relevance in practice so talking about kids in dinghies vs Somali thugs is immaterial. The latter won't fly it, and the former won't get in any trouble regardless of whether any rusty old legislation may still be lying around. Just like shooting Welshmen inside various city walls isn't going to be laughed off when you point to the various ancient statutes that show up in trivia books.

I've not come across it as a signal of friendly kids, although I rather like the idea. Unfortunately they have no monopoly on it, and it seems they're just as likely to come across a boatload of pissed-up young bankers on a corporate racing jolly. I guess if you see one flying on the other side of the harbour it's at least a cue to go and investigate.

Pete
 
"Illegal" implies a law relates to it - and I very much doubt that.
I can't imagine a law relating to anything flown off the spreaders unless it is a national flag being misused. I occasionally fly a yellow duster salvaged from the cleaning locker from mine.

Is there any evidence that pirates did use the JR or is this just another piece of Victorian whimsy? They've also used every other flag in the locker but they aren't "illegal" because of it.

In the parts of the Med I inhabit there are planty of pirates but they tend to infest the land - waterborne a JR usually denotes a charter boatload crammed full of pissed-up Germans, Austrians or Russians indicating antisocial qualities and absence of seamanship rather than homicidal tendencies but thoroughly worth avoiding all the same.

Keep 'em hoisted!
Lord, how tiny-minded and petty can people get objecting to that!

Who was objecting, anyway? And why? I'd just laugh at them! Saad people.
 
nickfabbri said:
With reference to another " discussion " in the bar following a "few" pints imbibed because poor weather stopped sailing~

There is opinion that the use of the skull and crossbones flag/ motif still signals piracy and as such is illegal to fly a flag/burgee/spinnaker with the skull and crossbones on it.

The counter arguement is that " surely if a couple of kids are out in a dinghy messing about, then it poses no harm", whereas if you happen to own a rusty skiff and are bobbing about off the coast of Somalia, then it may have more sinister implications.

I am just curious, and open this to the forum. Plus i do have a secret hankering for a huge black spinnaker with the motif on.
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Well i fly one as you can see on the left! Never any probs just a bit of fun at festivals etc.
As for Spmali pirates it would be a very un covert tactic advertising they were pirates.
 
MASH said:
Is there any evidence that pirates did use the JR or is this just another piece of Victorian whimsy?
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Yes, plenty. It went up when the ship was about to attack. They were all personalised, so you knew which notorious pirate was attacking you, so that once you'd passed the story on, the next crew to sight that particular Jolly Roger knew that their best chance of survival was to peacefully comply.
 
alahol2 said:
I'm sure I've seen photos of RN submarines returning to base flying 'Jolly Rogers', or does that just describe what they've been doing for the last 6 months:rolleyes:
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It's a submariner tradition from when they were considered "a bunch of pirates" by the respectable surface Navy, and signifies that they have had a "kill" on that patrol.

These days "a kill" seems to include launching cruise missiles into Afghanistan from hundreds of miles away, which might be technically accurate but doesn't really feel quite the same.

Pete
 
The Channel Sailing Club were once known as the Pirates cruising club as non boat owners could 'pirate' as crew for others. Their burgee was the Skull & crossbones.

I believe when they wanted to be RYA affilliated it was not allowed so they adopted the 'quacking duck' burgee they now use,
 
Well at some point I got bought a Skull and Crossbones flag/ensign/burgee thingymajig.

Never used it.. Yet. Maybe i'll replace my red ensign with it and see what response I get. Knowing my luck, i'll have Coastguard frigate chasing me up the channel. :)
 
prv said:
It's a submariner tradition from when they were considered "a bunch of pirates" by the respectable surface Navy, and signifies that they have had a "kill" on that patrol. .....
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I watched HMS Conqueror return to Faslane from the Rhu narrows on the Gairloch. I was bobbing about in a Wayferer dinghy. She did fly the Jolly Roger and she also flew a long triangular flag. I think this flag's length represents years in commission but I may be wrong on that.
 
nickfabbri said:
With reference to another " discussion " in the bar following a "few" pints imbibed because poor weather stopped sailing~

There is opinion that the use of the skull and crossbones flag/ motif still signals piracy and as such is illegal to fly a flag/burgee/spinnaker with the skull and crossbones on it.

The counter arguement is that " surely if a couple of kids are out in a dinghy messing about, then it poses no harm", whereas if you happen to own a rusty skiff and are bobbing about off the coast of Somalia, then it may have more sinister implications.

I am just curious, and open this to the forum. Plus i do have a secret hankering for a huge black spinnaker with the motif on.
Click to expand...

its not a proper flag its just a bit of fun. go for the kite, theres a new pirates of the caribbean out your kids will love you for it.

I certainly hope you were talking like a pirate over your 'few' pints. arrrrggghh! fetch aft the rum!!! aarrrghh!!!

did you get legless?! (sorry thats awful)

pieces of eight pieces of eight
 
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