Singlehanded & Asymmetric spinnaker

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srah1953

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Looking for advice on how best to handle an asymmetric spinnaker while sailing solo. I can use autopilot to drive boat for lowering and raising the sail but when actually flying it, it seems to me that you need to be able to steer as well as manage sheets. Any thoughts?
PS I can of course just leave it in its bag where it feels right at home and has never once complained of neglect!
 
srah1953 said:
Looking for advice on how best to handle an asymmetric spinnaker while sailing solo. I can use autopilot to drive boat for lowering and raising the sail but when actually flying it, it seems to me that you need to be able to steer as well as manage sheets. Any thoughts?
PS I can of course just leave it in its bag where it feels right at home and has never once complained of neglect!
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Use mine all the time. Set the assymetric trim for the general direction I want to go, then only handle by steering. If wind shifts I might change the trim again, but other than that it looks after itself.

Only problems might occur if you are pushing the limits on sailing low or high, so keep safely away from the limits.
 
why should an asymetric be different from a cruising chute - which was I believe the origin of the asymetric anyway. and you can certainly fly a cruising chute using an autohelm
 
Lowering the sail is the only tricky bit IMHO. Apart from that you can treat pretty much like a large genny. I have certainly never experienced any problems in using one whilst on autopilot - which, of course, leaves a solo sailor free to manage the sheets and sails.

Wouldn't cruise without one now as it has revolutionised passage times in lighter winds. Just don't hang onto it too long when the wind gets up. If it all gets too hairy and heavy to handle, dump it in the sea and haul it in from there!
 
flaming said:
That is a terrible idea.
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Your opinion and you are entitled to it!

I was first given that advice by a very experienced racing man. Sometime later, when I found myself in a position where I had let the chute fly in about 20-25 knots, the drag from the sail was simply too great to gather the chute in. So remembering this advice, I dumped it in the sea and was easily able to gather it in from there.

Obviously you have to reduce the way off the boat first otherwise the drag will stop you getting the sail back onboard.

I have used the technique twice and it has been successful on both occasions and I have no hesitation in recommending it based on this.

So faced with a similar situation where the wind strength has increased quickly to the point where you simply do not have the physical strength to get the sail in (and you don't have a snuffer) what would you do?
 
Cruising assymetric

If you attach the tack to the bow not directly but via a long rope and pulley at the bow you should be able to retrieve the sail by pulling on the sheet forward of the sheeting point pulley thus hauling the whole sail in behind the jib and under the boom. The line attaching the tack being let out as you bring the sail in. It should be possible to do it all from the cockpit if halyard tack line and sheet are accessible.
this is my preferred retrieval for ordinary spinacker when wind gets up. The brace being equivalent to the tack line. The end of the pole being equivalent to the pulley at the bow. If you have a pole on the assymetric then obviously that will have to be stowed first.
olewill
 
silver-fox said:
So faced with a similar situation where the wind strength has increased quickly to the point where you simply do not have the physical strength to get the sail in (and you don't have a snuffer) what would you do?
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I don't recognise this situation... And I believe snuffers were sent by the devil.

If the wind is pulling the spinnaker out of your hands as you drop it, even singlehanded, then you are doing it wrong, simple as. Use the main and jib to shelter the spinnaker as you drop it. William_H has detailed the procedure quite nicely. Using this technique I have dropped a full size kite in 25-30 kts on a 40 foot cruiser racer. I was racing doublehanded, but we didn't have an autopilot, so efectively singlehanded as the other person was stuck behind the wheel.

I would suspect that over 90% of the damage I have ever done to spinnakers was a result of it going in the drink, and then you are left with a kite that needs washing and drying to stop salt crystals from abrading the sail and seriously reducing its life. Not to mention the serious annoyance of a very large, very wet, sail all over the interior of the boat.


In short, a terrible idea.
 
Will H and Flaming have it right, in terms of the drop. Tack is attached by a long - very long - tack line run through a block on the bow and back to a clutch at the cockpit. My drop procedure is:
Make sure the tack line is clear to run, then throw it over the stern and stream it.
Do the same with the spinny halyard, but add one turn around the winch first.
Bear away to 160 or 170 true wind angle, so the main and genoa blanket the kite.
Get the sheet in your hand, then blow the tack line - let it run completely.
Gather the foot of the kite (which will be unloaded and blanketed) into the cockpit.
When I've got the foot under control, blow the spinny halyard. The friction from the turn around the winch and the drag of the halyard through the water will slow the drop, and allow you to gather it in and shove it through the companionway, without the kite getting wet. It is important to get the sail below as quickly as possible.

I also agree with Flaming that intentionally dropping it into the water is a terrible idea. Frying pan / fire springs to mind.
 
silver-fox said:
Your opinion and you are entitled to it!

I was first given that advice by a very experienced racing man. Sometime later, when I found myself in a position where I had let the chute fly in about 20-25 knots, the drag from the sail was simply too great to gather the chute in. So remembering this advice, I dumped it in the sea and was easily able to gather it in from there.

Obviously you have to reduce the way off the boat first otherwise the drag will stop you getting the sail back onboard.

I have used the technique twice and it has been successful on both occasions and I have no hesitation in recommending it based on this.

So faced with a similar situation where the wind strength has increased quickly to the point where you simply do not have the physical strength to get the sail in (and you don't have a snuffer) what would you do?
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Sorry SF - I have to agree with Flaming on this one ... having dropped a kite (and seen it done) into the drink from racing dinghies on many occasion the usual effect is to stop the boat - which is why it's known as 'Trawling the Kite' - the subsequent recovery of the kite can and does stretch it and in extreme - rips it ... and this is on boats with chutes designed to recover the sail smoothly.
Stopping the boat to recover the kite from the water is not simple - but if you can stop the boat recovery can be very easy - although generally this means capsizing the dinghy!
Based on my experience summarised above I would not choose to drop a kite into the water to recover unless there really was no other option - My preference is to either use a snuffer (which Flaming doesn't like anyway - but I don't care!) or blanket the sail behind another sail....

Singlehanded raising and lowering of the kite will be a bit daunting - but for cruising - once it is set you can leave it there and trim mostly by steering...
 
I am thinking carefully about the arguments for not dropping a chute in the drink - and I am happy to learn from the experience of others.

What seems to be passing everyone by is that with the tack blown, and the chute in the lee of the main, the drag on the sail was too great to able to draw the sail into the cockpit.

Maybe I am understating the wind strength,
-maybe it is a function flying of a chute on a 42ft boat,
-maybe I am wimp,
-or maybe I was plain doing it wrong?

Anyway since these experiences I have acquired a snuffer ....which should drive Flaming apoplectic as I am now on the dark side:D

And just for the record, I have an intense dislike of any sailing activity that means I have to put my beer down (just my interpretation of single handed sailing) ;)
 
SF, I just don't understand, unless the clew had also got away from you before you blew the tack. First - did you really "blow" the tack, as in it was no longer connected to the boat? Or was the tack line really long enough to be completely slack? I'll have to measure mine, but I think the tack line on my boat is at least 2X boat length and possibly longer, so when I blow it, all pressure comes off the sail.

But it is important to have hold of the sheet when you blow the tack, so you can pull the kite in under the main. If you blow the tack without first grabbing the sheet, the kite will go all the way aft to the quarter - and potentially move aft of the wind shadow of the main. So hold the sheet in your hand, then blow the tack and you will be able to immediately start gathering the foot in. Everything will go very light for a few seconds. Then when you've got the foot, drop the halyard.

One other potential cause of your troubles might be not bearing away enough. There is a big difference in trying to do it when the true wind angle is 120 degrees, and when it is 165 degrees.
 
silver-fox said:
Anyway since these experiences I have acquired a snuffer ....which should drive Flaming apoplectic as I am now on the dark side:D
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Hmm - perhaps I'll have to redouble my efforts in finding a suitable chute & snuffer for the new boat and we can sail down the solent flanking Flaming snuffing and de-snuffing with a pint in hand!! ;)
 
fireball said:
Hmm - perhaps I'll have to redouble my efforts in finding a suitable chute & snuffer for the new boat and we can sail down the solent flanking Flaming snuffing and de-snuffing with a pint in hand!! ;)
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Each to their own, I'll be keeping a camera handy for the inevitable snafu though....!
 
Boo2 said:
Sorry, why ?

Boo2
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Been so many threads about this, but to summarise.... because they don't add any function to spinnaker handling to spinnaker handling that can't be replicated with good technique, because when it all gets hairy and you want rid of the kite in a hurry you still have to go on the foredeck instead of being safely positioned in the main hatch, because they are no use at all after a broach with the boat flat on its side, because if you gybe and then go to snuff your snuffing lines are on the wrong side of the forestay (sounds fun if you're in a hurry right)?, because they encourage flying kites amongst people who don't have (and aren't prepared to learn) the skills to get them out of trouble when the efluent hits the rotating thing and the snuffer lets them down.

But I only fly kites every time I go sailing in winds up to 30kts, often shorthanded, what do I know?
 
I see your point - but with over 20 years of flying kites myself (on much smaller boats) I'm quite happy (or will be when I get one for this boat having had one on the last) to use a chute with snuffer - as I know the limitations of the kit and myself and find the neat way the snuffer works to be beneficial.
And if the manure does hit the twirly thing then I can still drop into the main hatch in the conventional way - but it is highly unlikely to be required as I'm not racing with it and am very aware of wind strengths/directions when flying one (not suggesting you're not - but you're probably a lot less cautious)
 
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