Shared costs: what is considered reasonable?

"the owner of the vessel engaged in the voyage or excursion may only receive money for, or in connection with, the operation of the vessel or the carrying of any person in the vessel as a contribution to the direct expenses of the operation of the vessel incurred during the voyage or excursion.?

I am more supportive Frans. Caveat I am neither a lawyer not in the trade. Just a businessman.

Seems reasonable in principle (and based on the above quote) to seek contribution to variable costs. These can be variable per capita, or variable linked to miles/days at sea. Definitely food and fuel and mooring fees if attributable to the voyage (but not your home port). Definitely laundry and washing materials. I don't see why, in principle, not to include wear and tear on sails, engine and ropes. Maybe stretching it to allow for wear and tear on the gelcoat every time someone drops a winch handle, or the floorboards when they drop their lifejacket. Hard to include your annual antifoul, engine service and and anode replacement. I don't see how you can charge for the fact you bought a saucepan.

I would argue that you are still some way from running a business. You are still miles from a contribution to cover all your fixed costs, including the depreciation of the main asset, and on top of that to make a profit.

I get where you are coming from. Good for you. It's not for everyone, so other people might be generous and wealthy enough to invite friends for free; others can as guests instead choose to pay thousands for coded charter service and all the advantages that brings. If only more people looked for ways to share the joys and costs of sailing, we'd have fewer unused boats filling our over-subscribed marinas.

Where I come from is a racing background. Plenty of amateur syndicates where there's an owner with a bunch of mates, and they chip in together not only for meals, beers and entry fees, but also for sails. Never once have I heard it suggested that they on a commercial footing.

Where you find friends to sail with is totally irrelevant. Where you could get stuck is that not everyone will understand, as you do, the full extent of the variable costs. Some might think for hundreds of euros/week that it's a commercial arrangement. So to cover your ass, I would
-as suggested, state everything as a contribution towards variable costs NOT as a charge or fee
- state (per above) what those costs are
- be able to demonstrate that YOU have also made your personal contribution (if guests want to show their appreciation, do it ashore)
- most importantly, state clearly, and ask for acceptance via email, that it is not a commercial venture and there is no contractual obligation or liability.

Aside from the above, there's no contract. If they don't turn up, you have no comeback. If you don't like the look of them and refuse them on board day 1, they have no comeback.

The more of your variable costs you recover, the greater the risk of misunderstanding, and the greater the need for absolute transparency. Good luck.
 
I'd be interested to see how this works out but I suspect the easiest, cheapest & most fulfilling way to go about things is just to suck it up and pay all costs yourself.

As far as I'm aware 'coding' is only a UK thing and is half way between commercial & leisure, a bit like the Yachtmaster qualification.

On a Dutch flag you might end up having to use a class society, which would make code compliance seem like a relaxing massage.
 
Just seen this on one of the crusing sites ...
Charter of Friends?

We live aboard our Beneteau 473 during the European summer sailing around the beautiful islands of Greece. We welcome guests to join us and enjoy the sailing and holiday experience.
In May & June we will be sailing around the beautiful Ionian islands close to Corfu.
This will be a leisurely sailing holiday around the islands with lots of time for swimming, relaxing, sightseeing and dinner each evening in a local taverna. Whilst our sailing is designed to be a relaxing holiday rather than hard core sailing we do encourage guests to join in the sailing activities and can offer skill coaching as well.
As we do not run a charter we don't have a schedule of fees but do ask guests to make a contribution towards costs. We have three double cabins, each with private bathroom We welcome singles, couples and groups and if you have a larger group we can actually accommodate up to 9 guest.
If you would like more information please contact us.
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VIEW YACHT OWNER'S PROFILE
CONTACT YACHT OWNER
 
Just seen this on one of the crusing sites ...
Charter of Friends?

We live aboard our Beneteau 473 during the European summer sailing around the beautiful islands of Greece. We welcome guests to join us and enjoy the sailing and holiday experience.
In May & June we will be sailing around the beautiful Ionian islands close to Corfu.
This will be a leisurely sailing holiday around the islands with lots of time for swimming, relaxing, sightseeing and dinner each evening in a local taverna. Whilst our sailing is designed to be a relaxing holiday rather than hard core sailing we do encourage guests to join in the sailing activities and can offer skill coaching as well.
As we do not run a charter we don't have a schedule of fees but do ask guests to make a contribution towards costs. We have three double cabins, each with private bathroom We welcome singles, couples and groups and if you have a larger group we can actually accommodate up to 9 guest.
If you would like more information please contact us.
TAGS
VIEW YACHT OWNER'S PROFILE
CONTACT YACHT OWNER
If it looks like a duck....

If it’s a British registered vessel and nothing ever goes wrong then that’s one thing. However if there was an accident, the potential legal ramifications would be enormous. I’m afraid that them saying they’re not a charter doesn’t make it not a charter.
 
I don't see why, in principle, not to include wear and tear on sails, engine and ropes.

Did you not read the quote from the UK regulations that John Morris quoted above?

'may only receive money for, or in connection with, the operation of the vessel or the carrying of any person in the vessel as a contribution to the direct expenses of the operation of the vessel incurred during the voyage or excursion.
 
Just seen this on one of the crusing sites ...
Charter of Friends?

We live aboard our Beneteau 473 during the European summer sailing around the beautiful islands of Greece. We welcome guests to join us and enjoy the sailing and holiday experience.
In May & June we will be sailing around the beautiful Ionian islands close to Corfu.
This will be a leisurely sailing holiday around the islands with lots of time for swimming, relaxing, sightseeing and dinner each evening in a local taverna. Whilst our sailing is designed to be a relaxing holiday rather than hard core sailing we do encourage guests to join in the sailing activities and can offer skill coaching as well.
As we do not run a charter we don't have a schedule of fees but do ask guests to make a contribution towards costs. We have three double cabins, each with private bathroom We welcome singles, couples and groups and if you have a larger group we can actually accommodate up to 9 guest.
If you would like more information please contact us.
TAGS
VIEW YACHT OWNER'S PROFILE
CONTACT YACHT OWNER
This subject certainly has long legs! I wonder if those who are offering this do so in all innocence of how far out of line they are with international maritime business practice. The offer to have up to 9 paying stranger 'guests' aboard a private yacht, which might or might not be seaworthy under the command of a skipper who might or might not be competent, will fairly be seen by fully regulated charter/sea schools as naught but a cowboy operation and by any governing MCA as a candidate for investigation. I hesitate to post this comment as I suspect those making this offer are very competent and do actually run a well found yacht; but I am guessing that is so. If they were running a charter yacht, I would know for sure and that is the certainty a paying guest should have. CBT
 
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