Sealine S42 engine differences

[oldgit]

"As for cupboards, you clearly have not met my wife "

 

[outatsea]

Well for space they are great boats. My tuppence - The shaft is a much better sea boat but rides rather bow high but if you never go out on crappy days its not an issue, they both are a breeze around the marina its just needs a good lesson and then lots of practise!! The older Kad 44 or Kad 300 if well looked after are good value and very economical.

Have had both an S37 - my first Sealine and a great sea boat - and an S41 on outdrives. I kept the S41 for just one season as it's handling in any form of seaway was atrocious to the point of being scary. It got traded in for an S48 on shafts - another great sea boat. The S43 on shafts handles better than the S41 but the bulky forward sections still gave a hard ride in a head sea.

 

[Portofino]

D6-350's = 80L/hr at a fast cruise.
TAMD75's = 120L/hr at a fast cruise, 190L/hr flat out.

You might be saving on outdrive maintenance costs, but ...

If these No,s are correct ,that's a 50% difference -ouch £££

As well as fuel I,am saving on diving/ lift out costs cos I can lift em up and clean props from the bathing platform .
Handling you can also " vector" and move it sideways - with the help of the bow thruster .
But if it's planned on being a floating caravan then shafts .But as soon as move it look back and watch £££'s going up in smoke
D6's I wonder as the years go by what sort of IT gremlins will start to emerge ? Steering rams have been done to death on here.For these reasons I would not fancy an old ( however you define that ) D6 DPH boat

One wonders how many MoBo ers end up " Fuel cripples" look around the marina !

 

[lanerboy]

thanks for all the replies very interesting reading

Another problem is s42/43 on shafts and with the hard top are like hens teeth very hard to find for sale, not much choice at all most are on stern drives that are for sale

 

[oldgit]

"One wonders how many MoBo ers end up " Fuel cripples" look around the marina !"

Just wander round any UK boatyard and look at the number of boats ashore (and you have to come ashore to fix or you sink)with dismantled outdrives or even worse one or two big gaping holes in the stern.Hopefully it just the outdrives that are bust and the water has not got into the transom and started to rot.
Lets not worry about ram seal leaks,rams corroding or the pins that corrode in the transom shield needing the engine moved or out..Lets not worry about the ram hoses or the Hydraulic pump getting water in the system.Is the leg lift indicater thingy still working.
Forget about the steering shaft bushes that need replacing every so often.
Forget about the gearchange seals.
Worry not about the propellor shaft seals letting water into the gearbox and reducing the gears to a milky mush
Who cares if the U/J rubber lets go and marinates the U/J along with the two bearings in the transom shield and ruins the dog shaft just for good measure.
You will need to get the hang of changing your props as well,as they will attract every passing bit of wood/builders bag or netting within 100m.
They cannot even built new ones properly and using the boating public to find the faults.
You would think after making the things for 50 years they would have got it a bit right by now.

Sooner or later like death and taxes those devices will bite.
Not if just when.

 

[Elessar]

thanks for all the replies very interesting reading

Another problem is s42/43 on shafts and with the hard top are like hens teeth very hard to find for sale, not much choice at all most are on stern drives that are for sale

Tells you what the new buyers bought then.

 

[Elessar]

"One wonders how many MoBo ers end up " Fuel cripples" look around the marina !"

Just wander round any UK boatyard and look at the number of boats ashore (and you have to come ashore to fix or you sink)with dismantled outdrives or even worse one or two big gaping holes in the stern.Hopefully it just the outdrives that are bust and the water has not got into the transom and started to rot.
Lets not worry about ram seal leaks,rams corroding or the pins that corrode in the transom shield needing the engine moved or out..Lets not worry about the ram hoses or the Hydraulic pump getting water in the system.Is the leg lift indicater thingy still working.
Forget about the steering shaft bushes that need replacing every so often.
Forget about the gearchange seals.
Worry not about the propellor shaft seals letting water into the gearbox and reducing the gears to a milky mush
Who cares if the U/J rubber lets go and marinates the U/J along with the two bearings in the transom shield and ruins the dog shaft just for good measure.
You will need to get the hang of changing your props as well,as they will attract every passing bit of wood/builders bag or netting within 100m.
They cannot even built new ones properly and using the boating public to find the faults.
You would think after making the things for 50 years they would have got it a bit right by now.

Sooner or later like death and taxes those devices will bite.
Not if just when.

You are describing two things. Poor maintenance and volvo. Other makes are available. Or the older volvos are ok if maintained.

 

[[2068]]

Let's go back to those fuel figures for a minute.

D6-350's = 80L/hr at a fast cruise.
TAMD75's = 120L/hr at a fast cruise, 190L/hr flat out.

They might not be 100% accurate, but not far off.
Assume the owner does 50 hours a year ... at £1.10 (optimistic) that's £2,200 in extra fuel costs per year.
For the enthusiastic 100 hours a year boater, that's £4,400.

At these prices, forget maintenance, the outdrive owner could simply unbolt one outdrive each year letting it fall to the seabed, and they'd still be quids in.

Shaftdrive boats made a lot of sense when marine diesel was 37p per litre.

 

[Portofino]

"One wonders how many MoBo ers end up " Fuel cripples" look around the marina !"

Just wander round any UK boatyard and look at the number of boats ashore (and you have to come ashore to fix or you sink)with dismantled outdrives or even worse one or two big gaping holes in the stern.Hopefully it just the outdrives that are bust and the water has not got into the transom and started to rot.
Lets not worry about ram seal leaks,rams corroding or the pins that corrode in the transom shield needing the engine moved or out..Lets not worry about the ram hoses or the Hydraulic pump getting water in the system.Is the leg lift indicater thingy still working.
Forget about the steering shaft bushes that need replacing every so often.
Forget about the gearchange seals.
Worry not about the propellor shaft seals letting water into the gearbox and reducing the gears to a milky mush
Who cares if the U/J rubber lets go and marinates the U/J along with the two bearings in the transom shield and ruins the dog shaft just for good measure.
You will need to get the hang of changing your props as well,as they will attract every passing bit of wood/builders bag or netting within 100m.
They cannot even built new ones properly and using the boating public to find the faults.
You would think after making the things for 50 years they would have got it a bit right by now.

Sooner or later like death and taxes those devices will bite.
Not if just when.

Point is at the fuel pontoon the savings soon add up if one does the hours/ miles .So over a ownership period there should be enough in the kitty to fund the above repairs ,( iam waiting) even downright just buy a new one .
Of course ,the more miles, and the higher the fuel price the shorter the break even point is .
The kad 300 / DPG set up I have had 8 years with ( VP agent looked after ) have really been no trouble so far.Seals etc changed regularly .i have had no water ingress ,but as I said big deal .
In the boat yard in the SoF plenty of shaft drive boats with shafts drawn and rudders off .
But so what age wear/ tear ,the sea effects everything ,Fuel usage is worth more of consideration I think .
Don,t mention generators ,air con units ,autopilots,or Passerelles .and bow thrusters
Not exactly fit and forget either .
All will end up costing £££ , but if you can reduce the fuel bill, makes spending £££ on maintenance more palatable ,even the legs which are just another item on the list .This list is not exhaustitive .
I have to say as MoBo er who uses the boat it's the fuel bill when all the costs are broken down thats by far the largest item .So given a choise??

 

[Portofino]

Let's go back to those fuel figures for a minute.

D6-350's = 80L/hr at a fast cruise.
TAMD75's = 120L/hr at a fast cruise, 190L/hr flat out.

They might not be 100% accurate, but not far off.
Assume the owner does 50 hours a year ... at £1.10 (optimistic) that's £2,200 in extra fuel costs per year.
For the enthusiastic 100 hours a year boater, that's £4,400.

At these prices, forget maintenance, the outdrive owner could simply unbolt one outdrive each year letting it fall to the seabed, and they'd still be quids in.

Shaftdrive boats made a lot of sense when marine diesel was 37p per litre.

Snap - he,just does not get it ! ( Oldgit )
Fuel price has changed the dynamics and shifted the argument .

 

[Elessar]

Snap - he,just does not get it ! ( Oldgit )
Fuel price has changed the dynamics and shifted the argument .

100 is enthusiastic? My lowest year in the last 10 is over 200.

 

[[2068]]

100 is enthusiastic? My lowest year in the last 10 is over 200.

wow, we seem to average about 100hrs a year.
But I think the "average" figure is approx 50hrs.

 

[Greg2]

I did say cue the perennial drives versus shafts debate....!!!

Funny how strong the debate gets....having had both I think that each has their merits and the arguments can sometimes be over egged a little on both sides.....

 

[oldgit]

Curious how most of the defenders of outdrives will have no experience of either shafts or the problems associated with outdrives.
Lets wait and see when they been all boating long enough to have experienced both ?

 

[[2068]]

...the defenders of outdrives will have no experience of ... the problems associated with outdrives.

Clue: Sealine S28's never had a shaftdrive option, and I've experienced most of the bad things that can happen to outdrives.
Shaftdrives are just great so long as someone else is paying for the fuel, e.g. bombing around on someone elses Fairline Targe 43
And a good option for flybridges, where you don't want to deposit the crew off the flybridge into the sea during a tight turn.

But a shaftdrive sports cruiser / tent boat?
Seems a bit of an oddity to me.

.

 

[zazu]

We bought our S42 new in December 2004 trading in a S34. We seriously looked at shafts because of all the valid points made above but the extra cost was £40,000.

All the D6 problems are well documented but you just work through them and sort them. My engineer (independent and has looked after the boat from new) has developed his own kit for replacing steering ram seals although ironically we have only had to change them once as the Volvo grommets seem to work very well.

In contrast the engines are very smooth and quiet and I average 1.4mpg cruising around 25kts.

I have now clocked up 1030hrs and approx. 13,000 miles.

 

[Elessar]

Curious how most of the defenders of outdrives will have no experience of either shafts or the problems associated with outdrives.
Lets wait and see when they been all boating long enough to have experienced both ?

Oh come on. Ive owned both and driven both. And you nicked my most appropriate user name.

 

[oldgit]

Oh come on. Ive owned both and driven both. And you nicked my most appropriate user name.

You will have noticed the word "most" in my post.....and remind me..... what make of outdrive was it that would self destruct into a pile of molten metal if you did not keep a hose pipe spraying a constant supply of sea water on it......Oooo I remember it was Black and started with ME *******r.

 

[Elessar]

You will have noticed the word "most" in my post.....and remind me..... what make of outdrive was it that would self destruct into a pile of molten metal if you did not keep a hose pipe spraying a constant supply of sea water on it......Oooo I remember it was Black and started with ME *******r.

Yes true. If installed properly they are OK. I installed it. Main issue was it was a petrol leg not the X rated deisel version. But there were issues even with x versions when pushing power to the limit as I did.
Mercruiser suffered a bit of volvo itis, they sold a blanking kit for the intake water for diesel engines, because the leg couldn't provide enough water and a seacock was needed. This meant the engine cooling water was not coming up through the leg and this is poor practice as it ran hotter.
Rectifying that seemed wise when replacing the leg, and adding a drive shower - a passive device to scoop up water and spray it on the drive - gave trouble free service after that.

 

[Jurgen]

thanks for that, I don't do massive milage it is more like a caravan on water for us we tend to nip out into the bay drop anchor and chill been down the coast a couple of times

this year I have used £800 in fuel so shafts may save me money over the drive servicing costs looking at it how you describe it



cheers

Lucky boy, reckon we've spent around £2000 on fuel but to be fair we've put on circa 600 nautical miles at varying speeds