Sea Horse Trust in The Guardian

[oldharry]

I doubt it. It would somehow lack the ambience of Studlands sandy beaches!

 

[AntarcticPilot]

One of Natural England's Senior Marine Advisors told me some years ago they were looking at potential disturbance to marine life from anthropogenic (human) noise, by which she meant engine noise and propellor whine from leisure boats. I have not seen any firm conclusions, but the latest report I can find, Natural England's NO0235 (Radford, Morley and Jones) suggests (P18) that there is no clear evidence of disturbance unless the sound source is nearby. It seems very few fish 'hear' in the sense we do, but their skins are sensitive to small pressure variations such as those produced by underwater sound, so if I understand it right they feel rather than 'hear' sounds. The report suggests that this does not seem to cause disturbance except in close proximity. Whichever, this report would suggest that NGMs claim noise from the rig will cause distress and disease in a range of local species is as Seajet says, total BS and BX and completely unsupported by current research. A familiar situation, but launched on his gullible and admiring supporters it is received without question. Makes a good Press story too!

Use of explosives to stun and catch fish isnt necessarily purely foreign either: I seem to remember Claude Greengrass in TV's Heartbeat using dynamite to poach Lord Ashfordley's Salmon! JNCC havea 'Marine Noise Registry' which records the effects of 'impulsive' noise in UK waters: Pile driving, use of explosives for construction, demolition and such like as well as military and Naval explosives are studied and recorded. This does seem mainly to deal with noise at a level which on both land and sea would have the potential for acoustic damage or death of any life in close proximity.

I have been in meetings where the effect of noise on marine mammals was considered in the light of marine mammal conservation in the Southern Oceans. The general concensus of the marine biologists present was that "normal" levels of ship and sonar noise were not damaging, but that things like military sonar and seismic sources (dynamite or air guns) were. Normal machinery noise was not held to be damaging. This was all in the context of Antarctica, which is one of the most highly environmentally protected areas of the planet.

 

[oldharry]

What was concerning the NE Consultant i referred to was the fact that small boat noise, particularly fast revving outboards can be much higher pitched and therfore more penetrating than big ship sounds. However NO0235 is fairly sure that it is not an issue, as few species respond to pressure waves much above 2 - 3khz. NGM reckons that his seahorses are stressed by excessive noise, and get poorly. Its good PR even if its not good science!

 

[Heckler]

In the Guardian article, NGM is quoted as saying that "The noise from the rig causes them stress and activates diseases. The sediment from the drilling makes it difficult for them to feed.” How does he "know" this? Causes stress? Noise activated diseases? Feeding difficulties? Is there any scientific backing for his claims?

The sediment story is a load of cods. Nowadays we dont dump tailings/cuttings on the sea bed!

 

[FlyingGoose]

I have been in meetings where the effect of noise on marine mammals was considered in the light of marine mammal conservation in the Southern Oceans. The general concensus of the marine biologists present was that "normal" levels of ship and sonar noise were not damaging, but that things like military sonar and seismic sources (dynamite or air guns) were. Normal machinery noise was not held to be damaging. This was all in the context of Antarctica, which is one of the most highly environmentally protected areas of the planet.

Yes well documented the US military did studies on this , high power frequencies will affect cetaceans, due to their ability to detect these waves in small quantities, a bit like our ear drums under pressure , or with loud bangs and such.
But back on track with seahorses I would imagine that it is near impossible to detect stress or to quantify illness due too noise, it is just unattainable to get these results IMOP.

 

[grumpy_o_g]

Considering the amount of work that goes on in Poole Harbour - dredging, pile-driving, bridge-building, breakwater building and maintenance, etc. any half-sane sea horse disturbed by noise would probably be hiding underneath the rig in the peace and quiet. Wonder how disturbed the sea horse gets when something the size of a dolphin but with strange tentacles grabs hold of it, plucks it out of it's hiding place and shoves a cable tie round it?

 

[Boathook]

Considering the amount of work that goes on in Poole Harbour - dredging, pile-driving, bridge-building, breakwater building and maintenance, etc. any half-sane sea horse disturbed by noise would probably be hiding underneath the rig in the peace and quiet. Wonder how disturbed the sea horse gets when something the size of a dolphin but with strange tentacles grabs hold of it, plucks it out of it's hiding place and shoves a cable tie round it?

I believe that is why they left Studland due to this type of disturbance.

 

[Seajet]

There is not a lot of high power sonar - or exlposives work going on around Poole or Studland , way too shallow for submarine work even from the shore and may upset the Sunseeker engine mountings and /or underwater lights

I do agree completetly sonar effect on whales, Orca's and Dolphins is a major concern, believe me the Western navies are trying to find a way of detecting subs etc without upsetting sea creatures ' biologicals ' - $ Billions have been spent on this as it not only helps PR not blowing up nice creatures, also helps find an enemy...

I have had my 30' boat with a 1980's German warship approaching active sub-searching, sonar going in a NATO exercise, it's nothing like the ' ping ping ' of Asdic in the WWII films, it's a a bloody great hull and crew shaking BOING !!! '

Of course this is absolutely irrelevant to Seahorses which are hundreds of miles away and happen to like being around recreational boats as long as they are not dropping depth charges, which is reasonably unusual for yachts these days.

 

[oldharry]

I believe that is why they left Studland due to this type of disturbance.

It was actually predicted they would leave by a leading Marine Biologist in 2011 because of the level of exposure to divers that year. He published papers from work in Aussie land, which I sent to MMO with the suggestion that Seahorse research licences should limit the number of visits made to a site. They didn't do anything about it though,. This guy was PhD level researcher unlike our unqualified man.