Scillonian in trouble?
- Thread starter Seven Spades
- Start date
dogleg
Well-Known Member
Scillonian was in Penzance casualty was local trip boat from St Mary's
Woodlouse
Well-Known Member
I thought it was unlikely to be the Scillonian when it mentioned the vessel getting towed back to st Mary's by the lifeboat. I know it's not a big ship but it would still warrant a little tug boat at least.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
2500 hp not enough?
Woodlouse
Well-Known Member
Depends on how that power is used doesn't it. The propellers used for pushing a 40 ton boat at 25 knots are quite different to the propellers used for towing a 1,200 ton ship. Even the French lifeboats would struggle with that.
dogleg
Well-Known Member
as usual the press are wrong, the casualty went back under its own power having had LB salvage pump put aboard, in certain conditions a Severn could tow a vessel like the Scillonian witness the towing of a larger cargo vessel off Hartland Point recently by 2 Tamars in gale force conditions.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
Towing is a primary function of lifeboats.
chanelyacht
Well-Known Member
Yes, we know. Give it a rest FFS.
The Severn would have no issues towing the Scillonian, having done it on exercise with them.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
My comment was intended for Woodlouse. However feel free to spoil the thread. Again.
BTW do you intend to justify your accusations of me in your post #80 on the "Boathouse" thread?
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Woodlouse
Well-Known Member
That's interesting to know.
Yes, but they're not salvage tugs. The difference between towing a yacht and a ship is quite substantial and I'd assumed that the Scillonian would be a bit on the big side. Apparently not, good on the RNLI for developing such wonderfully capable boats eh?
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
Well the UK used to have a salvage tug in those waters but no longer. The French had to take over the responsibility. 22000hp worth.
Apparently though the Severns are being phased out and so in the future they will only have the 2000hp Tamar. However it needs 2000hp to drive it as fast but not as far as the bigger 1300hp French AWB...:triumphant:
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RalphyM
Member
What do you mean by phased out? The Severn was introduced in 1996 (last built in 2004) with a planned service life of 25 years so the first are due for replacement in early 2020s. The Tamar is categorically not a replacement for the Severn. It is designed to fulfill the niche of slipway launched boat (and certain other stations where the deep draft Severn and Trent are not appropriate). My understanding is that preliminary design work is underway for the replacement but is at very early stages.
I know you have a bit of a thing about the RNLI and that's your perogative but the Severn will be a 30 odd year old design by the time it needs replacing and I would expect the replacement will incorporate a lot of the learning from the latest gen lifeboats. As an example, the Tamar went with props as water jets were deemed not repliable enough at that time. In the 10years or so between Tamar and Shannon. Enough improvements were made in the systems to make that an effective option. So there are plenty of ways to make it more effective. I'd also assume that the SIMS controls would be integrated into the new design.
chanelyacht
Well-Known Member
No, the French haven't had to "take over responsibility". Their responsibility still stops at the median line (other than the responsibility of any vessel at sea to assist)- if they come into UK AOR (as with the Ice Prince for example) then it is a commercial arrangement between Abeille and the casualty, facilitated by SOSREP.
Towage in UK waters is between casualty and salvor, but can be directed through two towage brokerages by the MCA when required to save life or prevent pollution.
No, they're not - not for replacement by the Tamar anyway. At some point they will reach design life end, by which time a replacement will be on the stocks.
I do wish you'd make some posts which are actually true every now and again.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
They're cutting that a bit fine if they are only on the preliminary stage now....!!
Our local boat was built in 1999. It has jet props and has a reported effective life of 30 years and a top speed of 30knts.
RalphyM
Member
and? The RNLI looked at water jets found they weren't, at that time, suitable for their requirements. By the time of the Shannon they were. The fact that the french had less demanding requirements is irrelevant.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
What makes you suppose that?
RalphyM
Member
Water jets were less capable in 1999 than now
French chose jets in 1999 as suitable for their requirements
RNLI deemed that capability at that point not suitable for their requirements
ergo, French requirements were less demanding than RNLI.
I can think of a number of capabilities that may have been needed by RNLI that the french don't (e.g ability to run "dry" for a longer period while on the slip before launch).
KINGFISHER 9
Well-Known Member
It's a pity the SNSM don't look after their boats as well as the RNLI .... some very scruffy examples on our stretch of coast ... I'm sure they do a good job but seeing sparkling RNLI boats does instil a little confidence.
chanelyacht
Well-Known Member
The problem with jets on small craft is you can't get the same "bite" for towage, so you have a lower bollard pull. Jets are great for fast, shallow water work (hence the RNLI using them since they started operating on the Thames years ago), as long as you're prepared for the maintenance costs in silty areas.
So you get a very fast, very capable craft (like the 10m Halmatics with Castoldi jets for example) but you wouldn't be able to tow, or hold off, a much bigger craft for very long. The old Salcombe Tyne class for example held a 1200GRT vessel (the Janet C, 40 times larger than the lifeboat) in force 9 winds off a lee shore for around 6 hours. You just wouldn't do that with jets on a 47ft vessel.
RalphyM
Member
yes, this was exactly my point. The requirements the RNLI had at the time could not be met by water jets. I agree that on a per HP basis a waterjet will have a lower bollard pull than props. However, this is balanced by the higher speed ability. I assume RNLI would have had requirements for both pulling and high speed, more biased towards the towing aspect (and other factors no doubt).
I remember that rescue, the coxswain got a bronze medal if I remember rightly. The same crew that were on the BBC documentary, might even have been around the same time.
