Schengen Visa - 90/180 rule

[greeny]

'Permanent residency@ in Portugal is for 10 years. Then you have to renew it, which currently seems a fairly straight forward procedure; as to cost - don't know. Now doubt somebody will be along to clarify this.

Did my 10 yr one last year but can't remember the cost. Definitely not expensive or I would definitely have remembered.
Probably the usual 15/20 euro -ish.

 

[nortada]

Did my 10 yr one last year but can't remember the cost. Definitely not expensive or I would definitely have remembered.
Probably the usual 15/20 euro -ish.

Assuming you didn't get the new biometric permit, I expect you will have your permit in due course. As this must mean exrea expense, I wonder if this cost will be passed on to the 'customer'

 

[bobgarrett]

Full list of ports of entry here:
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/PDF/?uri=OJ:C:2017:120:FULL&from=EN#page=21
be sure to look at the sea points not air!

 

[greeny]

Assuming you didn't get the new biometric permit, I expect you will have your permit in due course. As this must mean exrea expense, I wonder if this cost will be passed on to the 'customer'

I got a plastic ID card that has photo, hologram, fingerprint, tax, health and ID data on it. I believe that it is a biometric card as detailed in this link:- Biometrics | the Portuguese experience
Is there another different one on the way then? Wouldn't surprise me.

 

[Kelpie]

I'm looking at my options for how to solve the problem of a summer Biscay crossing and winter Transat, whilst not spending more than 90d in Schengen.
(No, I don't really want to consider residency as the route since I'm only going to do this for a few months before leaving Europe, and I don't trust that current experiences and regulations will carry over to next year).

By pushing back our Biscay crossing until late July, maybe into August, and then starting our Transat mid December, we are about six weeks short of Schengen time. With my Irish passport I can stay with the boat whilst SWMBO and our son fly home, but we want to minimise that time apart so every day counts.

To what extent can you push your luck with checking in and out- i.e. can you officially check out of e.g. Las Palmas and not actually leave for another few days... or a fortnight...?
Similarly, once you arrive somewhere, can you in practise hang around a quiet anchorage for a few days before making your way to an official port of entry? Specifically this would likely be in Spain after the Biscay crossing, so I'm talking about sneaking up a Ria.
It would be interesting to see what happens in real life, it seems unlikely that officialdom would pounce on you within hours of dropping anchor?

 

[Mistroma]

I'm looking at my options for how to solve the problem of a summer Biscay crossing and winter Transat, whilst not spending more than 90d in Schengen.
(No, I don't really want to consider residency as the route since I'm only going to do this for a few months before leaving Europe, and I don't trust that current experiences and regulations will carry over to next year).

By pushing back our Biscay crossing until late July, maybe into August, and then starting our Transat mid December, we are about six weeks short of Schengen time. With my Irish passport I can stay with the boat whilst SWMBO and our son fly home, but we want to minimise that time apart so every day counts.

To what extent can you push your luck with checking in and out- i.e. can you officially check out of e.g. Las Palmas and not actually leave for another few days... or a fortnight...?
Similarly, once you arrive somewhere, can you in practise hang around a quiet anchorage for a few days before making your way to an official port of entry? Specifically this would likely be in Spain after the Biscay crossing, so I'm talking about sneaking up a Ria.
It would be interesting to see what happens in real life, it seems unlikely that officialdom would pounce on you within hours of dropping anchor?

I remember that official interest varied quite a lot in different Rias. I think that we were approached several times in Arousa for checks. They did point out in one evening check that we had picked a "bad spot" and I think that related to smuggling. I remember regular patrols in another Ria and guys searching the shoreline the next morning. We spotted quite a few RIBs with 1000+ HP outboards.

Further North was a lot quieter and we certainly anchored in Viviero for a few days before moving to the marina for 2 nights to re-supply (Gadis supermarket next door). I don't remember seeing any officials checking us out at anchor until we were much further South.

I guess they only bothered further South because of a known smuggling problem. Of course they might have an issue with UK citizens arriving unannounced next year and begin checking. Past experience doesn't really help much for 2021 in that respect.

It is a problem for an EU citizen to have non-EU family remain more than 90 days. They do have a basic residence right to live and work in Spain as if they were also EU citizens. However, that requires a Spanish residence permit which is described as simple and trivial to obtain. I can understand why you wouldn't want to bother for a one-off borderline case. Probably easier to just stick to 90 days.



I did notice some contradictory statements about residence for an EU citizen with a non-EU spouse.

1) The residence card is only valid as long as the EU national is living in Spain because the EU citizen must be in charge of the non-EU national.

2) The EU citizen can be outside Spain as long as he or she wants. But if the non-EU citizen that has obtained this visa is outside the country for more than 6 months, his or her card will expire and be lost.

3) The European Union citizen must be a resident in Spain. Remember that being a resident implies living for more than 183 days per natural year in Spain.

I only looked this up because we will probably return to Spain at some point and I would be using my Irish passport. My interest lies more with Greek residence for my wife and myself in 2020 using our UK passports. We spent about 180-200 days in the EU each year without any problem since 2012. I don't imagine anyone in Greece will monitor 190 +- 10 days for a few more years.

 

[sailaboutvic]

@Kelpie some here believe that from the day the UK depart from the EU any red duster boat will be ponce on by official, I don't believe that for one min no more then any other non EU boat does non ,
there are a few hot spot like Mistroma said which are best to keep away from one Mike not said is the Guadiana , I don't think I ever been up that river without a visit ?
No disrespect to anyone here but a lot of people here spend most of there time in one country , we don't we visit as many as five EU country and non EU each year last time I got boarded when we was not in a harbour was , sorry can't remember at least six years ago , we did get ask to visit the coast guard in Italy twice last year only because we was in a harbour and on a free transit berth and then all they was interested in was how long we was going to stay , and insurance , not even boat papers.
This year once in Oibla Sardinia again on a town wall there wasn't interested in any paper just there €15 mooring fee .by the way there was an non EU boat with us and the same applied to them .
Now that may change in time no one know. You could take the route what I posted before which is check in spend a few weeks then check out again that give you the chance to get to know a place and what the likely is of getting boarded , of cause there a risk of getting caught there also a risk of sinking life a risk .
If you are boarded then make your excuse why you had to return and not yet checked in .
Now to some this isn't the route they would take fair enough everyone to there own ,
in real life non EU cruisers have been using this plain for many years and I not met , heard or read in any of the cruisers on any forum anyone having been ban of fined as yet and bad news travel fast .
You can also lost days officially by checking out the EU to go to Gib there a few days lost, then there North Africa or again to go to the Islands another five days lost or you abide by the rules and do it the official way and just have your 90 days .
As we say you pay your money and take your chance .
I know what I be doing .
One last thing if you have AIS turn the bloody thing off or you may just as well fly a banner saying here I am come and get me .

 

[grumpygit]

@Kelpie some here believe that from the day the UK depart from the EU any red duster boat will be ponce on by official, I don't believe that for one min no more then any other non EU boat does non ,
there are a few hot spot like Mistroma said which are best to keep away from one Mike not said is the Guadiana , I don't think I ever been up that river without a visit ?
No disrespect to anyone here but a lot of people here spend most of there time in one country , we don't we visit as many as five EU country and non EU each year last time I got boarded when we was not in a harbour was , sorry can't remember at least six years ago , we did get ask to visit the coast guard in Italy twice last year only because we was in a harbour and on a free transit berth and then all they was interested in was how long we was going to stay , and insurance , not even boat papers.
This year once in Oibla Sardinia again on a town wall there wasn't interested in any paper just there €15 mooring fee .by the way there was an non EU boat with us and the same applied to them .
Now that may change in time no one know. You could take the route what I posted before which is check in spend a few weeks then check out again that give you the chance to get to know a place and what the likely is of getting boarded , of cause there a risk of getting caught there also a risk of sinking life a risk .
If you are boarded then make your excuse why you had to return and not yet checked in .
Now to some this isn't the route they would take fair enough everyone to there own ,
in real life non EU cruisers have been using this plain for many years and I not met , heard or read in any of the cruisers on any forum anyone having been ban of fined as yet and bad news travel fast .
You can also lost days officially by checking out the EU to go to Gib there a few days lost, then there North Africa or again to go to the Islands another five days lost or you abide by the rules and do it the official way and just have your 90 days .
As we say you pay your money and take your chance .
I know what I be doing .
One last thing if you have AIS turn the bloody thing off or you may just as well fly a banner saying here I am come and get me .

I sure you are quite right Vic with you assumption(s). Of course I can only speak for Greece and I too struggle to see things happen for the worse overnight or anyone being pounced on!
Here in Greece with the Greek officials in my area, they are generally quite amicable.
Probably such as Italy and Spain who are much more attuned officially and bureaucratically may be more aware, of what degree though. I can't see anyone getting put in chains and thrown in a cell. It'll probably be just be, move on captain.
Without coercing people to break any rules or laws I'm sure most if not all won't be troubled unless they draw attention to themselves for other reasons.
But I may be proved otherwise though.

 

[sailaboutvic]

I sure you are quite right Vic with you assumption(s). Of course I can only speak for Greece and I too struggle to see things happen for the worse overnight or anyone being pounced on!
Here in Greece with the Greek officials in my area, they are generally quite amicable.
Probably such as Italy and Spain who are much more attuned officially and bureaucratically may be more aware, of what degree though. I can't see anyone getting put in chains and thrown in a cell. It'll probably be just be, move on captain.
Without coercing people to break any rules or laws I'm sure most if not all won't be troubled unless they draw attention to themselves for other reasons.
But I may be proved otherwise though.

Let's be honest all anyone doing and been doing for the last few years is making Assumption , come next year EU country's may not blink a eye .
As far as Kelpie is concern he looking for some extra weeks maybe a month or so , I know personally I wouldn't have a problem stretcing that much ,
I spend a lot of years in Greece I guess over 30 years there not many time we not entered Greece for some months at less but mostly we spend season after season and winters too , I think you have to be very unlucky to have a problem there you couldn't talk your way out of unless you sunk your boat or damage someone and the PP got involved .
Even all the crusing tax thing , you could lose yourself in Greece as long as you know the country .

 

[Kelpie]

Thanks Vic, reassuring. I think I'll need about 40-45 days extra to close the gap between my Biscay and Transat passages.
Has anybody got experience of doing an early check-out in the Canaries?

 

[sailaboutvic]

Capsen many be the man to talk to as I have no experience of the Canaries , he may be able to say what the chances are of getting check while at anchor , in which case you could check out of the EU on main land Europe, get to the Canaries and hang around the islands until your ready to check back in , some see this as a illegal act , I see it as doing the EU dance . What really matters is how you see it

 

[jordanbasset]

The other factor to consider is whether the Coronavirus is till around, if it is (and Spain has high rates at the moment) the authorities will probably be more aware of boats arriving and where from

 

[sailaboutvic]

The other factor to consider is whether the Coronavirus is till around, if it is (and Spain has high rates at the moment) the authorities will probably be more aware of boats arriving and where from

Agree although I don't think he plainning to cross till next summer and if the worst come to it ! I guess it be a bit like this year they will open up again , I can't see what other choice they have unless they want to lose all the income from the tourism plus hundreds of businesses going bust .

 

[Kelpie]

Yes it's next year we're planning for.
I'm thinking about checking out of Schengen when we start heading for the Canaries, then check back in on arrival. Add a couple of days of here and there, plus the passage itself, and you're at ten days. Every little helps.

 

[nortada]

Yes it's next year we're planning for.
I'm thinking about checking out of Schengen when we start heading for the Canaries, then check back in on arrival. Add a couple of days of here and there, plus the passage itself, and you're at ten days. Every little helps.

When you check out of Schengen, you will be asked for you destination and when you check back in, where have you come from. What will you say Agadir or somewhere else in North Africa

Of course, you could actually go to Agadir and start your crossing from there.

Agadir has a reasonable marina and should you require it, a local international airport with links to the UK.

 

[Kelpie]

Why can't I just say I planned to stop somewhere outside of Schengen but decided against it? Can you put "sea" as your destination when you check out?

 

[sailaboutvic]

Why can't I just say I planned to stop somewhere outside of Schengen but decided against it? Can you put "sea" as your destination when you check out?

Seems you caught on basically that's what you would do , you can put morocco and decide against it , it's not unusual for a sailing boat to take some weeks to sail a few hundred miles .
Plus there nothing to say you have to land anywhere until you want too .

 

[usualnomad]

Hi,

I'm wondering if you can help me with a query about a new european travel requirement. I have plans to move with my fiance from the US to Spain by the end of 2022 (the original plans were set to 2021, but we all know what coronavirus did with all of our plans).

We came across this information about a new travel authorization ETIAS for Spain, and I'm a bit confused whether this is going to affect me or not. I am from Argentina but I just received my Green Card. I know that it will be no problem with my fiance since she is from Spain.

I understand that ETIAS will be required for short travels, but should I get ETIAS even if I´m going to work in Spain and ask for a working visa? Would it still be a requirement?

Thanks for your help.

 

[Graham376]

From what I read, you (and we Brits) will have to have ETIAS from next year. ETIAS Argentina | Europe Visa Waiver for Argentine Citizens (etiasvisa.com)

 

[AndersG]

Hi,

I'm wondering if you can help me with a query about a new european travel requirement. I have plans to move with my fiance from the US to Spain by the end of 2022 (the original plans were set to 2021, but we all know what coronavirus did with all of our plans).

We came across this information about a new travel authorization ETIAS for Spain, and I'm a bit confused whether this is going to affect me or not. I am from Argentina but I just received my Green Card. I know that it will be no problem with my fiance since she is from Spain.

I understand that ETIAS will be required for short travels, but should I get ETIAS even if I´m going to work in Spain and ask for a working visa? Would it still be a requirement?

Thanks for your help.

I don't think you need an ETIAS if you arrive with a long term visa.