Scanner issues affecting the whole system

[Mavis]

My radar (Raymarine, circ 2010) works for a few hours and then the screen goes solid yellow and stops transmitting. Once this happens I start to notice all sorts of weird things happening to all the other NMEA connected devices. I might loose my GPS signal, or my AIS might stop working, etc. it all gets a bit erratic. The strange thing is that after turning the radar off, the next time I use the boat everything works fine until such time as the radar screen goes solid yellow again. All my instruments are Raymarine, and connected to the old C80 plotter. Any clues please?.

 

[KompetentKrew]

Sounds like overheating electronics.

I would speak to these guys: Marine Electronics Servicing and Repairs | The Service Centre

 

[Mavis]

Sounds like overheating electronics.

I would speak to these guys: Marine Electronics Servicing and Repairs | The Service Centre

Thanks, I will.

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

My radar (Raymarine, circ 2010) works for a few hours and then the screen goes solid yellow and stops transmitting. Once this happens I start to notice all sorts of weird things happening to all the other NMEA connected devices. I might loose my GPS signal, or my AIS might stop working, etc. it all gets a bit erratic. The strange thing is that after turning the radar off, the next time I use the boat everything works fine until such time as the radar screen goes solid yellow again. All my instruments are Raymarine, and connected to the old C80 plotter. Any clues please?.

Silly question but have you checked your voltage level when this happens?

 

[Mark-1]

Silly question but have you checked your voltage level when this happens?

Yeah. It does feel like the Radar problem might be a symptom of something wrong in the whole network rather than the Radar causing a problem on the network.

 

[westernman]

Yeah. It does feel like the Radar problem might be a symptom of something wrong in the whole network rather than the Radar causing a problem on the network.

Radars draw a significant amount of current. And sometimes that can be choppy as a very large amount of power is drawn for a short amount of time.
A 2KW radar is just that - 2KW of power in the output chirp. So more power goes in.

If your batteries or wiring are not up to scratch you might be getting voltage dips which will make electronics go haywire in unpredictable and misleading ways.

A friends car's 12V battery (not the 400V hybrid not) was on its last legs (not obvious). If he left the car a couple of days he would get every warning imaginable that something was not working. Every possible warning except anything to do with the 12V battery. He even got warnings that the HV battery was broken.

A new 12V battery and everything is back to normal.

Could be something similar in your system as well.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

Radars draw a significant amount of current. And sometimes that can be choppy as a very large amount of power is drawn for a short amount of time.
A 2KW radar is just that - 2KW of power in the output chirp. So more power goes in.

If your batteries or wiring are not up to scratch you might be getting voltage dips which will make electronics go haywire in unpredictable and misleading ways.

A friends car's 12V battery (not the 400V hybrid not) was on its last legs (not obvious). If he left the car a couple of days he would get every warning imaginable that something was not working. Every possible warning except anything to do with the 12V battery. He even got warnings that the HV battery was broken.

A new 12V battery and everything is back to normal.

Could be something similar in your system as well.

After a long period when both my cars - an EV and a conventional ICE - were unused, BOTH had similar symptoms to the above, in both cases caused by low voltage on the 12V side of the electrics.

I don't know what it is about the Seatalk (old style) network, but a faulty device can cause all sorts of odd indications elsewhere in the system! My tiller-pilot failed, and the main immediate symptom was the log suddenly switching to reading in kph rather than knots!

I note that the CONTINUOUS power requirement of my radar is 40w - still over 3A draw, which is substantial in terms of a sailing boat's power budget, but the peak power output of 4kW is a bit misleading when it comes to computing the power drain; it is only needed for a fraction of a microsecond at a time! Of course, an older model with less efficient motors might draw more. Under sail, I would not run the radar continuously, only as an aid when needed.

 

[dunedin]

My radar (Raymarine, circ 2010) works for a few hours and then the screen goes solid yellow and stops transmitting. Once this happens I start to notice all sorts of weird things happening to all the other NMEA connected devices. I might loose my GPS signal, or my AIS might stop working, etc. it all gets a bit erratic. The strange thing is that after turning the radar off, the next time I use the boat everything works fine until such time as the radar screen goes solid yellow again. All my instruments are Raymarine, and connected to the old C80 plotter. Any clues please?.

Not sure what is meant by “other NMEA connected devices”, because I assume the radar scanner itself is not NMEA connected. The radar needs a bigger bandwidth than NMEA can provide and is generally connected by a RayNet cable of some type, depending on generation.

 

[Mavis]

Thanks everyone. No I hadn't checked my voltage while these problems appear and thanks to you that will be my next job. I tend to use the radar mainly with the engine running but will check anyway. When I mentioned "other NMEA connected devices" I mean that all the instruments start to randomly play up. The radar is obviously not NMEA connected

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

Thanks everyone. No I hadn't checked my voltage while these problems appear and thanks to you that will be my next job. I tend to use the radar mainly with the engine running but will check anyway. When I mentioned "other NMEA connected devices" I mean that all the instruments start to randomly play up. The radar is obviously not NMEA connected

It is sounding like a power supply problem as that would appear to be the common factor. Remember it could be a bad connection in the system so you could have good readings at the battery or main panel. You may have to "dig around" a bit. Good luck!

 

[Graham376]

Not sure what is meant by “other NMEA connected devices”, because I assume the radar scanner itself is not NMEA connected. The radar needs a bigger bandwidth than NMEA can provide and is generally connected by a RayNet cable of some type, depending on generation.

My radar display (not the dome) is connected to gps by NMEA so, if the OP's is the same, it's possible as @AntarcticPilot says, for something else down the line to be causing the fault.

 

[dunedin]

My radar display (not the dome) is connected to gps by NMEA so, if the OP's is the same, it's possible as @AntarcticPilot says, for something else down the line to be causing the fault.

Yes generally the radar image is displayed on a MultiFunction Dispay (MFD aka chart plotter). But the radar itself is not connected to NMEA. Radar clearly doesn’t need or use GPS (one of its roles is to assist in event of GPS failure), though it often uses the heading sensor from an autopilot.

 

[Graham376]

Yes generally the radar image is displayed on a MultiFunction Dispay (MFD aka chart plotter). But the radar itself is not connected to NMEA. Radar clearly doesn’t need or use GPS (one of its roles is to assist in event of GPS failure), though it often uses the heading sensor from an autopilot.

As I've said, my radar IS connected to gps, it's used to show the selected gps waypoint on the radar display, surrounded by a lolipop. I have no radar output to MFD or chart plotter. If the input gps data is corrupt, it could well have an effect on the display.

 

[dunedin]

As I've said, my radar IS connected to gps, it's used to show the selected gps waypoint on the radar display, surrounded by a lolipop. I have no radar output to MFD or chart plotter. If the input gps data is corrupt, it could well have an effect on the display.

Well if you have a radar scanner on a yacht connected to a display that isn’t an MFD / chart plotter then that is a vanishingly rare configuration. Wasn’t aware that dedicated radar displays have been sold for the past 20 years or so. Certainly even on my previous boat with instruments from last century, the radar scanner was connected to a Raymarine display that also had a chart card reader (the term MFD wasn’t widely used then, the though the concept was already the norm).
And if on a display and want to display waypoints but not a chart that is even more vanishingly small segment
Out of interest, what make / model is your radar display?

 

[Graham376]

Well if you have a radar scanner on a yacht connected to a display that isn’t an MFD / chart plotter then that is a vanishingly rare configuration. Wasn’t aware that dedicated radar displays have been sold for the past 20 years or so. Certainly even on my previous boat with instruments from last century, the radar scanner was connected to a Raymarine display that also had a chart card reader (the term MFD wasn’t widely used then, the though the concept was already the norm).
And if on a display and want to display waypoints but not a chart that is even more vanishingly small segment
Out of interest, what make / model is your radar display?

Radar is Furuno 1712, fitted 2003. Furuno and possibly other makes still sell radars with display - Furuno 1815 Radar System | Force 4 Chandlery Shopping&utm_term=4581458813449670&utm_content=Bing Shopping

 

[dunedin]

Radar is Furuno 1712, fitted 2003. Furuno and possibly other makes still sell radars with display - Furuno 1815 Radar System | Force 4 Chandlery Shopping&utm_term=4581458813449670&utm_content=Bing Shopping

Furuno primarily sell to commercial boats, so perhaps there is some regulatory reason why some boats need a radar without mapping.

But otherwise seems a very bizarre choice to pay and find space for a dedicated radar display which may only be needed for 5-10% of boating time, when for the same money could install an MFD (probably using the same physical box and screen) which could be used for charts, AIS etc 100% of the time as well as show radar, overlaid on the chart if prefer, when needed. But each to their own choices.

 

[Boathook]

Furuno primarily sell to commercial boats, so perhaps there is some regulatory reason why some boats need a radar without mapping.

But otherwise seems a very bizarre choice to pay and find space for a dedicated radar display which may only be needed for 5-10% of boating time, when for the same money could install an MFD (probably using the same physical box and screen) which could be used for charts, AIS etc 100% of the time as well as show radar, overlaid on the chart if prefer, when needed. But each to their own choices.

I installed my Furuno 1623 radar before I had a chart plotter and it is a standalone display, though it does talk to the Furuno gps that puts the waypoint mark being aimed at on the radar screen.

 

[Graham376]

Furuno primarily sell to commercial boats, so perhaps there is some regulatory reason why some boats need a radar without mapping.

But otherwise seems a very bizarre choice to pay and find space for a dedicated radar display which may only be needed for 5-10% of boating time, when for the same money could install an MFD (probably using the same physical box and screen) which could be used for charts, AIS etc 100% of the time as well as show radar, overlaid on the chart if prefer, when needed. But each to their own choices.

So, if the MFD goes down, everything is lost. No thanks, I would rather have stand alone displays.

 

[dunedin]

So, if the MFD goes down, everything is lost. No thanks, I would rather have stand alone displays.

Then get two MFD displays and connect one to radar. Or a tablet with Navionics on it. Then got backup plotter so better resilience than currently.
But again, each to their own,

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

Thanks everyone. No I hadn't checked my voltage while these problems appear and thanks to you that will be my next job. I tend to use the radar mainly with the engine running but will check anyway. When I mentioned "other NMEA connected devices" I mean that all the instruments start to randomly play up. The radar is obviously not NMEA connected

To elaborate on my previous. Have you tried running your radar and other equipment separately, I mean make sure that there are No connections between the radar and other equipment, unplug if there are! Isolate one lot and for example, run the radar on its own, then vice versa. see where and if the fault occurs. If of course you do find a power supply fault the above may be be irrelevant.
Also be aware that if the fault is in anyway time related, you say it occurs after a few Hrs running, it could be an overheat problem either to some part of the equipment or a connection getting hot and changing resistance just enough to cause the fault. does the fault rectify itself if you switch everything off and back on again or do you have to wait for a period of time i.e. Cool down? Sorry to keep adding possibilities, but they are all there. Unfortunately.