SBC is now open for members ....

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Dear Dogwatch

I here apologise if my "sarcastic" heading and reply was not appreciated.

I in fact was not too chuffed at your "Polite" post .... but as we all know - each reads a post slightly differently to others, in some cases vastly different to the author ! You and I both know that well.

I do understand both sides of the coin .... but with the tone and posts coming in fired direct at me ......

The thread has shown a fact in the forums that has been underlying for increasing length of time ...... some are being left behind in the forum evolution ... But why ?

Some have said in the past - Post and make the fora what you want ... Some have and had threads hijacked or destroyed ......
There has been a increasing sarcasm and "wind-up" style pervading the forums such that odd people have stopped posting ... or step back and rarely post ....

I have a PM that really is an eye-opener .... I shall not name the author - that si unfair as it was confidential to me - but he is so annoyed and upset by many thread drifts and comments that he will not rise to post ... he stays on the list to gain any titbit of knowlegde that occasionally gets through ..... It's shame - as that person was a very valuable poster on these very fora.

Isn't it interesting that I have PM's from silent and respected forum people ? But there is the "band" of posters that have auctioned of this thread to controversy and derision .....

I know of no-one that has signed up to any group that I am involved in that has left YBW forums or reduced posting as a result. In fact only recently due to a couple of Forum people AND my efforts - Lowrance Plotters are expected to send out an updated s/ware item for their plotters .... a good example of YBW forums being supported by Lowrance Plotter Group .....

I feel sorry that there are some that only read personal gain in my actions - as that is what reading through seems to indicate ...

I'm tired ... I really don't need this barrack-room style sh**e ......
 
[quote....Hmm lets see...

Jim you [--word removed--]

Jim you fecker

Oh....... I've been controlled...

Jim

[/ QUOTE ]

No one's stopped you saying it and that's an easy one to find your way round if you want to /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I was actually refering to the "Some of the reasons, why I have given up posting." quote - why are there so many sensitive people on the internet?
 
Nigel
You seem to be getting a lot of stick on this, from people who would not be eligible to join. I do not see anything wrong with the idea, it is a free country (well in England so they say, not sure about Estonia) give it a go, if people want it they will join, if not, you tried. I can see problems, that small boat owners spend more time using their boats, less time whingeing on the internet. So you may not get as many contributions as hoped. But if you arrange meetings that like-minded people can get to and exchange ideas in person. it would be good.
Good luck with it, and let people know how to join.
 
Gart ..... many thanks.

I would like to say thanks to all who have pm'd me and also posted in reasonable manner - both sides of fence. I appreciate all constructive comment and ideas. It is what makes the world a better place and develop. For and against has valuable place in all discussions when conducted properly ... makes for a more balanced outcome.

Thanks again ...
 
Well I am still not sure that this forum should be a free for all and that we should be finding ways around the very few "rules" that are appllied.


On many many issues I would not say I am sensitive....

Different people have different standards....

I can still say that I feel far less likely to post on here these days and that the number of positive responses to Nigels idea is a little disappointing .... in that it does indicate that others feel the same way...

But I'm not here for an argument...... just to pass comment


Jim
 
Irritation is the sincerest form of flattery..

I think you should be flattered that a number of people consider your proposals a threat to YBW. Your idea must have some merit to cause such a reaction.

However, in my opinion, they are quite wrong to assume that there will be any dilution in contributions to these boards - in fact the reverse may well be true. It could be that a number of people who don't post on here for various reasons - some of which have been mentioned - will find a voice on your forum and become more confident about posting on here and elsewhere.

As has been pointed out, there are many forums related to sailing already - one more won't make a jot of difference. I speak as someone who will be excluded from your forum by virtue of boat size but, having owned a couple of small boats, I recognise the appeal of this idea.
 
Re: Irritation is the sincerest form of flattery..

Thanks .....

I find it interesting that direct contact is held between myself and members of YBW staff - particularly Forum admin. I know that they do observe and remove posts / etc. if they get out of hand or unsuitable.
They have not taken any action or posted in any form on this thread .... I admire them for not getting involved .... leave it to the Forum-ites.

I will say this .... and I'm sure Keith will take action if needed >

To YBW (Keith in particular) : If my thread here is considered unsuitable or competition to YBW Forums - if YBW consider that it be best to remove it / edit or whatever in the interests of YBW ... I can live with that without problem. It will not affect my contributing to the Forums.

I too hope that contributions from small boat owners can generate from fostering a Small Boat fraternity .... as well as others ...



I find it also interesting that there are Clubs up and down the Country ..... I know of UK ones ... and sure other countries find similar ! .... where for long time size of boats has been limited or kept in the lower numbers by physical limitations of area / moorings etc. Clubs have then had voting to change the matter and increase boat size etc. I haved had personal experience of 2 clubs that developed / evolved with that ... and subsequently lost a lot of experienced long-standing members .... definite big and small boat groups started up. Funny enough the small boat groups being the less vocal / argumentative - as they were out on the water far more - not propping up the bar wingeing on about others ...
The clubs still survived though ... small boat owners came and went ... as did big boat owners ...

The forums over time have developed a bigger boat feel to them ... and small boat owners - quite a few have posted less and less ...... but they are still there ......... and my offer is not going to drag them away from here - the wealth and appeal of YBW forums is too great ....
 
Re: Irritation is the sincerest form of flattery..

Well put. I have posted no less due to being a member of a number of boating fora and mailing lists and will continue to do so.
 
I don't think there is ever any shortage of posters, people come, go and are soon forgotten. I also don't see why anyone should see another forum as threat, I probably post on about 20 or so in varying degrees - you don't have to leave one to join another. There seems to be a history of antagonism between boating forums.

I don't think the lack of positive responses to Nige's idea indicates that people are less inclined to post, just that there may be less than expected with boats that fall into the proposed category or those that have them aren't inclined towards a forum specifically for them.

Personally, I find the merging of the virtual world with the real world is an unattractive proposition.
 
Lack of response ?

Sorry but that is actually wrong ....

I must admit that I had to re-read Jim's post and on secoind reading found the wording actually to mean that there was a positive response ... it looks other way when read quickly ...

As to other forums ... I've been invited to submit material - commercial and private to various, but I may be registered on them - but am not active. My main fora are YBW ....

I maintain / moderate other groups - aimed at specific topics .... but still 95% I woulod estimate of all group / fora time - I spend here on YBW ....

But anyway - there has been a reasonable positive response along with a few reasonable messages that are against the idea .... + of course this thread ... so far - it is majority positive.


Quickie .... Lescargot ..... why not come down and meet Jim or myself sometime when we are in Newport ? Like many we have met - actual is rarely same as imagined via forum !
But I have a feeling we already met .... you have a Snapdragon 23 ? with modified rudder and over-sized genny ? Didn't you belong to Tudor Club at one time .... ?
 
Re: Lack of response ?

I am not totally opposed to the idea and Im sure those that take part will have a bit of fun make new friends etc.

You said theres nothing stopping members setting up local groups elsewhere.Thats my whole point.People allready do here in the Bristol Channel and I am sure in other places through the existing facilities on YBW forums.

There is no need for a seperate group especially one with rules and regs about boat size and type.People arent stupid ,If you organise a meet suitable only for shoal draft boats and someone with a deep fin tries to join then just tell them ,no need to proclude them completely.
 
Re: Lack of response ?

Maybe it should be "Small Boat Fan Club". For people who like or are interested in them, not necessarily just owners. The attraction to me of a specialist forum is that it would be understood that any question or discussion was from that common viewpoint.

So for example a question about spinnaker rigging wouldn't be answered along the lines of "on most Open 70s they do it this way". However if the Open 70 sailor knows how to rig a 26 footer, why shouldn't he contribute?
 
Re: Rude or Wot!!! Discussion was held in fact ....

I have been involved in both the sailing world, as an offshore yacht master and instructor, and the powerboat world as a qualified offshore racer and rib instructor, both in many parts of the world and on different sized boats. I now have a MAB and can confirm that there is a world of difference between not just the powerboat and sailing world but between the 'rich' and 'poor' ends of the sailing world.

I'm not saying animosity, just difference in outlook.

For example, the thought of paying £100 for a lift and bottom scrub is normal to some but not something I could entertain. If I had the money, I'd spend it on something I couldn't do myself. I suppose it's interesting to see how the other half live, though.

I have no experience of the 'poor' end of the powerboat world, if such a thing exists.

I would welcome a small sailing boat forum for poor DIY type sailors like myself.
 
Re: Rude or Wot!!! Discussion was held in fact ....

I cannot match your depth of expertise but can totally empathise with the rest of your post. Finding £40 for some new glazing means a choice between that or something else the boat needs, never both.

The 'poor' mobo does exist and struggles along with exactly equivalent cheap boats, lots of make do and mend, DIY for everything and scrounging bits from the yard skip just like any other impoverished boat owner. In fact, that is a source of friendship with no raggie/mobo rivallry and folk lending a hand when needed.

I see no justification for the aggressive anti SBC sentiment but lots of evidence as to why many don't take such an active role on the YBW fora.

Me, I'll continue much as before on YBW, reading and learning a lot, contributing when I can. SBC won't change that.
 
Now I am enjoying the chat thats developing ...

Instead of what damage I have done - liable to do .... we now have healthy debate ...

I also have to decide where to spend ... and know that many others have same problem / decision to make.

One post hits the nail on the head - questions / answers directly related to the group / boats ......

As explained before - the decision to exclude was based on trying to control input .... yes it's true that venue can decide participants to meets etc. - but that only sorts the meets ... not the group as a whole. But the exclusion system is still only provisional and bound to alter etc.
If you were looking to redress a balance ... would it be by creating another unbalanced machine ? No - you take a bold decision to install controls to do that automatically.

There is no wish to "alienate" ..... why ? So if an owner of a 35ftr feels put out - sorry but that is because some other 35ftr owner has spoilt the recipe.

My own experience and yarmouth showed it very well ..... There's 3 MAB's .... mine, Centaur and a Snappy. Happy, admiring the gleaming white new stuff around us .... In terms of who helped most when it came to hands on .... it was the two largest MOBO's there ..... I mean expensive jobs as well. I have to sadly say that the mid-range sail job disappeared leaving others to sort his mooring while he was in town ...

So boat size / wealth etc. is not the issue or indicator ..... but it is surprising that a lot of snobbery / nose jobs come from the mid-field ....

Now come on - enough of this ....
 
Re: Hang on

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