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clouty

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27 Aug 2003
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301
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Shoreham again
janeclout.com
Dear everyone,

I am participating in the above demonstration of intent to change. So is Dame Ellen, not that I would dare to compare myself with that brave lady. I am satisfied that the event is well supported by Solent boats, but that there are at present few from my area around Brighton that have registered with sail8@ybw.com.

I have been in close touch with Ten Alps Events, who are covering the organisation in the UK. The Cherbourg side is being run by Bob G's side, and there are plenty of vetted passengers, I am informed.

The call is to get to Cherbourg sometime Saturday, then sail to Portsmouth for Sunday PM. See sail8@ybw.com

If you are in sympathy with the idea that the developed world should try to help nations in crisis instead of bleeding them dry with unfair trade and repayments of debt, taken from the poorest, when the money went in the first place to line the pockets of the richest few, to pay for weapons and rich men's toys, providing profit for our western industries, and if you have access to a seagoing boat, and the weekend off, then look at sail8@ybw.com, register, get your berthing sorted in Cherbourg, and lets have a cross channel jolly with real heart and purpose.

If you think I'm entirely mad, that is your perogative!
 
Well done Clouty . . .

Sad to see that this post has had no replies. I am rather too far from the Channel to make it for the event, but hope it goes well.

- Nick
 
I`ve said this before and now I`ll say it again.
Any leisure boat carrying ` passengers` is operating outside the terms of its insurance.
Any boat not fully coded and licenced, and carrying full safety equipment,including liferaft(s) for the intended numbers on board,carrying `passengers`,is operating outside the terms of the law,Sail8 notwithstanding.
The French powers-that-be,whose maritime rules and regs regarding registration and equipment are stricter than ours, have been a bit quiet on this so far.....
This whole idea, however well intended,IMHO,is half baked.
 
I'm not taking part in Sail8 - the reason I ask is that it's my first crossing and when planned didn't know this was taking place & was hoping for quiet seas & marinas
 
Thank you, Webcraft, for the support. This forum has been very negative about the sail8 initiative, and I wonder if there are other supporters on Scuttlebut who just don't feel like putting their head above the parapet.

Me, I'm fearless. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

All it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing.

As far as being half baked, it going to be fun, and a lot of people will hear a lot about one of the major issues of our time, vis do we let Africa sink under the weight of poverty and disease (these two intimately connected) and then have to deal with the rats that will leave that foundering vessel in their masses? And deal with the economic fallout that will be caused by the impending multiple disasters? Or do we lift the economic load a little, help with health resources, put pressure on the likes of Mugabi (sp?) and help the continent out of the trap we built with our arbitary political bounderies - putting Tutsies and Huttoos together in Rwanda, for instance. I mean, what ignorant arrogance. And the impossible trade skewing caused by our farm subsidies. These are people like you and me. Different, yes, as I am from you.

I cannot believe it is a major legal or insurance issue to take a few albeit new friends for a sea trip on one's own boat with no payment being made.

I think there's a bit of guilt out there.

Jane
 
OK, head above parapet time- Good on you Jane, I would have taken part if my boat was up to it and if I hadn't had previous commitments.
If I had taken part, I might have taken the precaution of drawing up a safety brief /disclaimer type of thing or something similar in French.
 
Not entirely mad but

um, it's a nice gesture, sort of.

However, Geldof is demonstrably wrong - the poor of the world cannot made richer by a few politicians - the fact is that africans have been made very much poorer by a few (other) politicians well placed to steal - such that the theft from Nigeria alon over the past 20 years is as much as the TOTAL amount of aid given to the whole of africa in the last 4 decades. Let alone the rest of them.

Given the wall of odds against them, thowing a bit more money at the problem won't solve very much. And floating about in the channel for a jolly weekend seems an almost insultingly do-goodish middle-class "protest" given the scale of the problem. If it makes you feel good that's fine. But sail8 won't help a single person in Africa - it's helping participants feel involved.

If your passengers thank you as they alight you might well hear yourself "oh, its the least i can do" - and it is. After all, if you weren't doing sail8 this weekend what would you be doing, if you owned a channel capable yacht? Erm, possibly going to cherbourg, perhaps?

Fact is, armed threats are needed to bring some african leaders to account and nobody has the stomach for it, especially post-iraq. Me included, sort of.
 
I can't help wondering exactly what you will achieve.

Perhaps a warm feeling but how can moving Frenchmen from France to England cause an effect in Africa?

I really do not understand the guilt trip.

Putting Hutu and Tutsi in Rwanda was not your idea or indeed mine. Certain not our fault that they choose to slaughter each other. No other border arbitary or not (they're all political by definition) has prevented one group trying to kill another.

What pressure will you put on Mugabe - Remember he was the "freedom fighter" that the 1970s versions of Geldof etc said was going to rescue the Rhodesian people from the wicked regime of Mr Smith. It was a the left wing Labour party who put him in power.

The West has been pouring money into Africa since the end of the colonial days, but to what effect?

A few very very rich Africans and a lot of very poor countries.

What has changed? How will putting more money into Africa now be different to all the millions that have gone before?

Have a walk around your local supermarket - you will see produce from many countries, including several African ones plus Asian and South and Central American states. What changes exactly do you want to see in the trading regulations? Which Farm subsidies do you want to change and how do you want them changed? Perhaps a little more detail, some facts perhaps, may help the argument.

As for the trip - good luck to you , hope you enjoy it, but don't pretend it will help anyone in Africa.

It won't.
 
Re: Well I think your daft...

but then whats wrong with a bit of daft.

If it makes you feel good then go for it.

I would ask my insurers the question though. Payment has little to do with passenger status. I'd consider the risks involved very carefully. As a sometime charter skipper I'm particularly aware of the danger of public liabilities, after all, no one wants to loose sleep and perhaps so much more while tring to be helpful to Africa, and I often consider how much trouble I'd be in if one of my "passengers" was found to be undesirable or in possession of something illegal.

Once you've ticked all your boxes you'll have an even happier time.
 
Re: Not entirely mad but

If I felt it would make a difference, I would have gladly signed up.

It's the most half-baked loony idea I've heard for many a year and will serve only to make the participants feel a misguided sense of guilt displacement.

The real issue remains. We're too cowardly to take on the African problem.
 
Re: Not entirely mad

The point of the Live 8 initiative, of which sail 8 is a part, is to bring the issues in question to a wider audience and to put political pressure on the G8 summit in Edinburgh the weekend after next. One small sailing boat would make little difference, but a flotilla will generate enough news coverage to enable the arguments for debt relief to be aired on a wider platform. We've got a bbc news reporter who is threatening to join us for the trip across...

It is better to light one small candle than to curse the darkness

Oh god, I am full of aphorisms...

Malawi pays out over half it's GDP in debt repayments.

We Europeans don't know we're born. And as we are learning, it is a small world. Vunerable. We need to take better care of it, or we will pay the price.

Watch the Geldorf documentary on BBC1 at 7.30 tonight. Beautifully made, human and insightful. Pretty pictures too.
 
Mugabe - democracratically elected....

"Elections were held for a new national parliament as Zimbabwe Rhodesia, which was won by the only black party that had renounced violence and was allowed to contest – the UANC, led by Bishop Abel Muzorewa and Canaan Banana. Sanctions, however, were not lifted, because Britain and the USA said there was not proper representation in the elections – meaning Nkomo and Mugabe. Britain called all parties to Lancaster House in September 1979, which were attended by Smith, Mugabe, Nkomo, Chenjerai Hunzvi, Edson Zvobgo and others, where Muzorewa was persuaded to accept new elections, which were held late February, 1980.

After a campaign marked by intimidation from all sides, mistrust from security forces and reports of full ballot boxes found on the road, the Shona majority was decisive in electing Mugabe to head the first government as prime minister on March 4, 1980. ZANU won 57 out of 80 contested seats in the new parliament, with 20 other seats reserved for whites."

Not exactly fair elections, but not exactly put in place by UK.

Been downhill all the way since then.... /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
 
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