RYA - lost the plot?

[Sandy Bottom]

You leave Captain Sensible out of this. He happens to be my friend and I will publicly state I have very high regard for him as a seaman and he is a gentleman.

You do not know what a simpleton really is.
You have these fanciful notions and you like to contradict and nitpick and argue, for the sake of it, ha ha.
So please yourself. Go and contemplate your navel. You are not in my league at all, or his, for that matter.

I have just incidentally remembered another incident.
I have a group of friends and we decided in a group of nine to visit one of our group who had just bought a lovely house in Key Biscayne, in Florida. He had done his RYA training in the UK, and was very proud of his achievement.
He had a really lovely ketch he had delivered from Hong Kong to his waterfront mooring, a biggish boat a 56 or 58 footer, from memory. Beautiful, blue hull, teak decks, lovely.
At first, I did not reveal I had the Ocean ticket, so as not to belittle him.
But when I began to observe the blunders he made, I offered to skipper the vessel for him. He declined.
So I just let him get on with it ha ha.
We decided to sail to Bimini, which included a night passage.
We arrived at Bimini in the morning.
As there was a total complement of ten of us, I did not feel it necessary to be on deck when approaching the berth.
I was down below opening a can of beer when I felt the boat shudder and heard a sickening crunch.
I quickly rushed up but too late.
He was on the wheel approaching the berth at full tilt and did not put his engine on astern to stop her...
As a consequence of this he crunched his bow and buckled the bow rail in as far as the roller drum. A disaster.
Again, RYA qualified.
So I am mystified as to what is taught and learnt under the system.
And you, with all that experience you have with submarines, are probably not unlike him.

You drink, at sea, and you call yourself 'Professional'????

 

[Sandy Bottom]

No not Bimini Boatyard, Bimini Island.
Invitation declined.

Issue me with an invitation then, I'll take you on. Any boat, any time, anywhere.

 

[VO5]

You drink, at sea, and you call yourself 'Professional'????

Yes, off watch. With the owner at the helm in command and eight crew, and yards from the berth. Why not ?
Nitpicking again are you ? Dear Oh Dear !

 

[VO5]

Issue me with an invitation then, I'll take you on. Any boat, any time, anywhere.

I am not going to invite you anywhere at any time or under any circumstances.
I follow the advice given by J P Morgan.

 

[Sandy Bottom]

Yes, off watch. With the owner at the helm in command and eight crew, and yards from the berth. Why not ?
Nitpicking again are you ? Dear Oh Dear !

Not nitpicking, you either consume alcohol at sea or you do not. It's called being professional. It's a bit like an amateur THINKING that he knows what a yellow flashing light on a submarine means, and a professional who ACTUALLY knows what it means. But you wouldn't understand that.
Your choice to decline the challenge (either way) is perfectly understood.

 

[VO5]

Not nitpicking, you either consume alcohol at sea or you do not. It's called being professional. It's a bit like an amateur THINKING that he knows what a yellow flashing light on a submarine means, and a professional who ACTUALLY knows what it means. But you wouldn't understand that.

And you would not understand the advice given by J P Morgan, the Commodore of The New York Yacht Club at the turn of the century, that stands the test of time.

I will leave you to find that out for yourself.

 

[Sandy Bottom]

And you would not understand the advice given by J P Morgan, the Commodore of The New York Yacht Club at the turn of the century, that stands the test of time.

I will leave you to find that out for yourself.

You pick other people to speak for you if you feel the need, I'm happy to speak for myself boy.

 

[VO5]

You pick other people to speak for you if you feel the need, I'm happy to speak for myself boy.

So much the better for you. Because what he commented on all those years ago was tailor made for you.
It saves me from having to embarrass you publicly by repeating his wisdom.
No doubt someone here will come along and enlighten you sooner or later.
Anyone here wants to know what he said can send me a PM.

 

[Sandy Bottom]

So much the better for you. Because what he commented on all those years ago was tailor made for you.
It saves me from having to embarrass you publicly by repeating his wisdom.
No doubt someone here will come along and enlighten you sooner or later.

Calling for help from 'someone on here' oh dear, how sad is that - have a go yourself matey.
To repeat - any boat, any time, anywhere. I cannot be straighter than that.

Waffle time over, put up or shut up.

 

[VO5]

Calling for help from 'someone on here' oh dear, how sad is that - have a go yourself matey.
To repeat - any boat, any time, anywhere. I cannot be straighter than that.

Waffle time over, put up or shut up.

No, certainly not.
I strictly adhere to the protocols established by J P Morgan.
He was wise and succinct.

 

[GHA]

And another thing.....

The 'International Certificate of Competence' is mandated by a UN subsidiary body, and arrangements for issue are a responsibility of individual governments. The RYA is the sole body within the UK mandated, via the MCA, to issue such certificates i.e. a monopoly.l

Is it?

http://www.bwsw.org.uk/coaching-and.../international-certificate-of-competence-icc/

 

[Sandy Bottom]

No, certainly not.
I strictly adhere to the protocols established by J P Morgan.
He was wise and succinct.

Say's it all really.

 

[VO5]

Say's it all really.

It says more than you imagine. And I cling to his advice because his wisdom is timeless, classic,

 

[Sandy Bottom]

It says more than you imagine. And I cling to his advice because his wisdom is timeless, classic, [/QUOTE

He has wisdom? Well that's a blessing, can you speak via him in future, it will make life much simpler.

 

[VO5]

Well, at least one of you has wisdom, that's a blessing

Listen, Hey ! That's enough answering back to your elders and betters. Go to bed.
Look up what J P Morgan said in the morning. There is an important lesson in it for you.

 

[Sandy Bottom]

I'm on watch, at sea, there's a lesson for you

 

[oldbilbo]

Is it?

http://www.bwsw.org.uk/coaching-and.../international-certificate-of-competence-icc/

My dear Greenwich Hour Angle, you have the better of me on that. All these years and I little suspected that I could have acquired the coveted 'ICC in Wakeboarding'....

Tell me, please, does such an accolade cost substantially MORE, or rather LESS, than the common or garden RYA variety? Do they do 'graduated variants', such as Coastal, Offshore, Ocean....? I can just see it on my yottie CV now, when applying for STCW95..... 'ICC Offshore ( Wakeboarding - Barefoot/Disabled/Kneeling )'....

:encouragement:

 

[Simondjuk]

I have just incidentally remembered another incident.
I have a group of friends and we decided in a group of nine to visit one of our group who had just bought a lovely house in Key Biscayne, in Florida. He had done his RYA training in the UK, and was very proud of his achievement.
He had a really lovely ketch he had delivered from Hong Kong to his waterfront mooring, a biggish boat a 56 or 58 footer, from memory. Beautiful, blue hull, teak decks, lovely.
At first, I did not reveal I had the Ocean ticket, so as not to belittle him.
But when I began to observe the blunders he made, I offered to skipper the vessel for him. He declined.
So I just let him get on with it ha ha.
We decided to sail to Bimini, which included a night passage.
We arrived at Bimini in the morning.
As there was a total complement of ten of us, I did not feel it necessary to be on deck when approaching the berth.
I was down below opening a can of beer when I felt the boat shudder and heard a sickening crunch.
I quickly rushed up but too late.
He was on the wheel approaching the berth at full tilt and did not put his engine on astern to stop her...
As a consequence of this he crunched his bow and buckled the bow rail in as far as the roller drum. A disaster.
Again, RYA qualified.
So I am mystified as to what is taught and learnt under the system.

Your friend's failure to comprehend that steaming at full tilt into a dock might be a bad idea suggests that they lacked much more than any training could make up for.

It also seems that your prioritising pouring yourself a beer over being on deck for the arrival was a failure in judgement, especially given your prior concern over your friend's ability to skipper his vessel.

I find it implausible, both that so elementary a lapse could occur on your part and that you'd choose to fraternise with such a moron. It's a tall tale surely?

 

[john_morris_uk]

Some people's posts speak volumes about their character, but rather than join any slanging match (unedifying and unhelpful) I feel one or two things ought to be pointed out.

There's lots of talk of 'the right way' and implications of there being only one proper and correct way to do things when the truth is that there are often several ways to do things and sometimes they are all perfectly valid. Experienced and competent seaman know this.

Of course there are often ways NOT to do things and sometimes better and worse ways to do things but so what? I'm teaching an RYA Competent Crew course this week and although I've taught the novices how to put a line on a cleat, I've also explained some variations and why (IMHO) locking the last X under itself is more suited to dinghy sailors than mooring lines on 11 tonne boats.

I have opinions about how a preventor should be rigged but there are some variations that might be appropriate in different boats and circumstances. What is certain is there is most certainly NOT "one right way". The same principle applies to almost every aspect of seamanship. There are better and worse ways and ways you definitely shouldn't do things.

I've seen car drivers do stupid things but I don't discredit the whole of the DVLA and UK driver examining and training because I've spotted some idiots who got through the system. I also note that a professional seaman and qualified bridge watchkeeper and Master Mariner tried to argue with me that tidal stream/current would affect the direction of approach one made to pick up a MOB. (Not in some esoteric way in which wind over tide would affect wave shape...) I suspect this thread demonstrates how idiocy and pomposity have no respect for 'qualifications'.

 

[Uricanejack]

Well said above.