mick
Well-Known Member
Just watched the video on the Rocna website. Strikes me it's possible I might have trouble lifting the thing if it's buried like the one in the clip. Anyone have experience of this?
Rocna? (Sorry!!)
- Thread starter mick
- Start date
Chris_Robb
Well-Known Member
I would prefer it to be buried than another make of anchor which would you have to try setting 2 or 3 times before you have success.
If you are looking for a new anchor also try the Manson Supreme. My first season with it this year - bloody marvelous - no anchoring technique reqired apart from correct scope of chain - just chuck it over - reverse - job done! I have not yet had a failed first time set.
If you are looking for a new anchor also try the Manson Supreme. My first season with it this year - bloody marvelous - no anchoring technique reqired apart from correct scope of chain - just chuck it over - reverse - job done! I have not yet had a failed first time set.
bluedragon
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Just watched the video on the Rocna website. Strikes me it's possible I might have trouble lifting the thing if it's buried like the one in the clip. Anyone have experience of this?
[/ QUOTE ]
You know, this bothers me as well. With no windlass I want an anchor that breaks out easily when you need it to, and really holds when it's supposed to. There's a lot of focus in these forums on holding power, but for those of us that use muscle, the ease of breaking out with a building wind and sea and you want to get the hell out of somewhere quick, seems to be dismissed!! Perhaps it's just not feasible to have both characteristics in any one anchor?
Just watched the video on the Rocna website. Strikes me it's possible I might have trouble lifting the thing if it's buried like the one in the clip. Anyone have experience of this?
[/ QUOTE ]
You know, this bothers me as well. With no windlass I want an anchor that breaks out easily when you need it to, and really holds when it's supposed to. There's a lot of focus in these forums on holding power, but for those of us that use muscle, the ease of breaking out with a building wind and sea and you want to get the hell out of somewhere quick, seems to be dismissed!! Perhaps it's just not feasible to have both characteristics in any one anchor?
Malish
Well-Known Member
I wonderd about this and I asked the crew after a couple of months of Rocna use and they tell me that in mud it is no harder to extract than a CQR. In both instances the trick seems to be to get the chain reasonably tight and vertical and then wait a minute or so before trying to extract. Admittadly this is with a small S-L Hyspeed winch but I'm sure the same approach can be achieved with a manual lift by cleating the chain off (and I'll echo the other posters - the Rocna sets good & firm)
Richard10002
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Just watched the video on the Rocna website. Strikes me it's possible I might have trouble lifting the thing if it's buried like the one in the clip. Anyone have experience of this?
[/ QUOTE ]
Firstly why "Sorry"? just because some people get a bit uptight about these modern anchors doesnt mean any discussions are taboo.
I guess it's the fact that Craig is almost always "selling", although less so these days.... but I have found most of what he says to be useful and informative - and lots of what he says is not Rocna specific.
I guess you cant have your cake and eat it ..... if you want to be solid as a rock for a good nights sleep, or solid as a rock in 50kt winds, it needs to be well dug in. I think I would rather be well dug in, than easy to pull out.
Some people have said that you get the chain up and down, (but probably not bar tight), then have a cup of tea whilst the motion of the boat jiggles it out. I guess if you want a quick getaway you might need to get close to bar tight for a quicker jiggle - but if things are that serious that 15 minutes will make the difference, you wont be too worried about stressing a bit of kit at the bow.
Alternatively, if you are well dug in, you may not feel the need for a quick get away, and decide to ride it out - which you might not do on another anchor??? Who knows?
Just watched the video on the Rocna website. Strikes me it's possible I might have trouble lifting the thing if it's buried like the one in the clip. Anyone have experience of this?
[/ QUOTE ]
Firstly why "Sorry"? just because some people get a bit uptight about these modern anchors doesnt mean any discussions are taboo.
I guess it's the fact that Craig is almost always "selling", although less so these days.... but I have found most of what he says to be useful and informative - and lots of what he says is not Rocna specific.
I guess you cant have your cake and eat it ..... if you want to be solid as a rock for a good nights sleep, or solid as a rock in 50kt winds, it needs to be well dug in. I think I would rather be well dug in, than easy to pull out.
Some people have said that you get the chain up and down, (but probably not bar tight), then have a cup of tea whilst the motion of the boat jiggles it out. I guess if you want a quick getaway you might need to get close to bar tight for a quicker jiggle - but if things are that serious that 15 minutes will make the difference, you wont be too worried about stressing a bit of kit at the bow.
Alternatively, if you are well dug in, you may not feel the need for a quick get away, and decide to ride it out - which you might not do on another anchor??? Who knows?
Talbot
Well-Known Member
The incident that convinced me to get a windlass rather than continue to strain my back was after an anchoring during the Fleet revue. At one time I had two big ribs attached and the combination of the 3 vessels, 2 knots tide plus 20+ kts of wind was an anchor that was beyond my strength.
I had further problems anyway because I was on my own, surrounded by other boats. Every time I motored up to the anchor to relieve the strain on the cable, by the time I had got up on the focsle, the boat had drifted back onto her cable again - very frustrating. Eventually the boat ahead of me floated a line down and I was able to get myself nearly over the anchor and retrieve the chain. However all the previous attempts had buried the anchor even further, and no way was it going to come up under muscle power. I eventually cleated off as vertical as possible and then motored her free (making sure I was heading into deeper water!)
Thanks Dragonslayer!
One (of the many) advantages of a cat is that you can motor along with the anchor in the water to clean it off! I think it brought up half the solent with it. Always been very happy with my Danforth KLI plus 10mm chain.
I had further problems anyway because I was on my own, surrounded by other boats. Every time I motored up to the anchor to relieve the strain on the cable, by the time I had got up on the focsle, the boat had drifted back onto her cable again - very frustrating. Eventually the boat ahead of me floated a line down and I was able to get myself nearly over the anchor and retrieve the chain. However all the previous attempts had buried the anchor even further, and no way was it going to come up under muscle power. I eventually cleated off as vertical as possible and then motored her free (making sure I was heading into deeper water!)
Thanks Dragonslayer!
One (of the many) advantages of a cat is that you can motor along with the anchor in the water to clean it off! I think it brought up half the solent with it. Always been very happy with my Danforth KLI plus 10mm chain.
whipper_snapper
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Some people have said that you get the chain up and down, (but probably not bar tight), then have a cup of tea whilst the motion of the boat jiggles it out. I guess if you want a quick getaway you might need to get close to bar tight for a quicker jiggle - but if things are that serious that 15 minutes will make the difference, you wont be too worried about stressing a bit of kit at the bow.
[/ QUOTE ]
I would agree, and without meaning to teach anyone to suck eggs: Sailing recently with a novice crew, I found that in all anchor handling procedures I was always saying 'slow down, relax'. There is no doubt that there is an urge to heave when it is often better to wait, giving the boat time to come round to the anchor and going very slowly from straight up and down to broken out seems to be the key to minimal back/windlass strain. And I have always found that simply cleating it off tight, wandering to back of the boat, then wandering forward and bringing in another 6 inches, will break it out easily and reasonably quickly.
Some people have said that you get the chain up and down, (but probably not bar tight), then have a cup of tea whilst the motion of the boat jiggles it out. I guess if you want a quick getaway you might need to get close to bar tight for a quicker jiggle - but if things are that serious that 15 minutes will make the difference, you wont be too worried about stressing a bit of kit at the bow.
[/ QUOTE ]
I would agree, and without meaning to teach anyone to suck eggs: Sailing recently with a novice crew, I found that in all anchor handling procedures I was always saying 'slow down, relax'. There is no doubt that there is an urge to heave when it is often better to wait, giving the boat time to come round to the anchor and going very slowly from straight up and down to broken out seems to be the key to minimal back/windlass strain. And I have always found that simply cleating it off tight, wandering to back of the boat, then wandering forward and bringing in another 6 inches, will break it out easily and reasonably quickly.
bluedragon
Well-Known Member
The problem is that nearly all anchor threads seem to assume the worst case scenarios. For blue water live-aboards with poor or non-existent weather forecasts I can understand that (and I'd also choose my gear accordingly), but for the rest of us we anchor in sheltered coastal bays with good forecasts and marinas or harbours within easy escape distance. Anchor handling and break-out is for me just as important as holding power, but it's rarely discussed as a characteristic in either the forum or comparative tests. I doubt the designers even think about it!
craigsmith
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Just watched the video on the Rocna website. Strikes me it's possible I might have trouble lifting the thing if it's buried like the one in the clip. Anyone have experience of this?
[/ QUOTE ]Concern with ability to recover the anchor is not unique, which is something that has surprised us. Put simply, the better any anchor holds, the harder it is to retrieve – an inescapable connection. However, our video shows Peter laboring to recover a Rocna 10 after testing, which raises this question frequently.
With regards to the instance shown in our video, one must realize that...
<ul type="square">[*]this is after over a tonne of force has been applied to the anchor. This is not at all normal, as usually the force applied by the boat would be much less. It will therefore normally be easier to recover, and if a tonne ever is applied to it, the user will not be bothered if it gets a bit stuck as they will have other things on their mind!
[*]this is a 10Kg (22lb) anchor which is rated for a boat of up to 10m (33') – such a boat would have little problem pulling it out. Even if it was this stuck, the user would simply pull the rode in as far as possible, then let the boat work the anchor out over a few mins, or power it out backward.[/list]A trip line can be used if retrieval is a serious concern.
Just watched the video on the Rocna website. Strikes me it's possible I might have trouble lifting the thing if it's buried like the one in the clip. Anyone have experience of this?
[/ QUOTE ]Concern with ability to recover the anchor is not unique, which is something that has surprised us. Put simply, the better any anchor holds, the harder it is to retrieve – an inescapable connection. However, our video shows Peter laboring to recover a Rocna 10 after testing, which raises this question frequently.
With regards to the instance shown in our video, one must realize that...
<ul type="square">[*]this is after over a tonne of force has been applied to the anchor. This is not at all normal, as usually the force applied by the boat would be much less. It will therefore normally be easier to recover, and if a tonne ever is applied to it, the user will not be bothered if it gets a bit stuck as they will have other things on their mind!
[*]this is a 10Kg (22lb) anchor which is rated for a boat of up to 10m (33') – such a boat would have little problem pulling it out. Even if it was this stuck, the user would simply pull the rode in as far as possible, then let the boat work the anchor out over a few mins, or power it out backward.[/list]A trip line can be used if retrieval is a serious concern.
TiggerToo
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
'slow down, relax'. .... cleating it off tight, wandering to back of the boat, then wandering forward and bringing in another 6 inches, will break it out easily and reasonably quickly.
[/ QUOTE ]
yes, indeed. This works very well with our Rocna as well. Let the boat do the back breaking job. It will work except in the deadest of calms. In fact the anchor held each time tight, and then cam up with no probs once the chain was more or less vertical and the yawing of the bows pulled it up.
'slow down, relax'. .... cleating it off tight, wandering to back of the boat, then wandering forward and bringing in another 6 inches, will break it out easily and reasonably quickly.
[/ QUOTE ]
yes, indeed. This works very well with our Rocna as well. Let the boat do the back breaking job. It will work except in the deadest of calms. In fact the anchor held each time tight, and then cam up with no probs once the chain was more or less vertical and the yawing of the bows pulled it up.
jimbaerselman
Well-Known Member
Unless an anchor is snagged on something, it's always easy to break it out. First, get it straight up and down (by hand or winch). Next (best if you've got a chain snubber) lock the chain, wander back to the cockpit and put the boat in ahead. The anchor will break out.
Think twice before doing this vigourousy with a winch - you don't want a torsional fracture of the drive shaft - so take the chain strain with a rolling hitch first.
Using this technique I was able to bend my old CQR shank thru 30 degrees - oops - wedged in a rock clump in Bayona.
Think twice before doing this vigourousy with a winch - you don't want a torsional fracture of the drive shaft - so take the chain strain with a rolling hitch first.
Using this technique I was able to bend my old CQR shank thru 30 degrees - oops - wedged in a rock clump in Bayona.
Allan
Well-Known Member
I recently used my Delta (oversized for the boat) in the sand off Minehead. I was bored so played around reversing to dig it in as far as I could. After lunch and a sunbathe I started to lift it and it was well stuck in. Remembering the idea of letting the boat do the work, I pulled up the chain and put the kettle on. SWMBO did not agree to my suggestion of a way to make the boat move up and down, so I just sat and waited for the tide to do it's stuff. 5 mins later the GPS alarm went off and I brought the anchor on board.
Allan
Allan
bluedragon
Well-Known Member
Hey, I like the idea of getting the tide to do the work!! So long as it's rising that is. Pity there isn't a means of the tide winding the chain in as well /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
mick
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I recently used my Delta (oversized for the boat) in the sand off Minehead. I was bored so played around reversing to dig it in as far as I could. After lunch and a sunbathe I started to lift it and it was well stuck in. Remembering the idea of letting the boat do the work, I pulled up the chain and put the kettle on. SWMBO did not agree to my suggestion of a way to make the boat move up and down, so I just sat and waited for the tide to do it's stuff. 5 mins later the GPS alarm went off and I brought the anchor on board.
Allan
[/ QUOTE ]
How big is your Delta? (Forgive the intrusive questioning.)
I recently used my Delta (oversized for the boat) in the sand off Minehead. I was bored so played around reversing to dig it in as far as I could. After lunch and a sunbathe I started to lift it and it was well stuck in. Remembering the idea of letting the boat do the work, I pulled up the chain and put the kettle on. SWMBO did not agree to my suggestion of a way to make the boat move up and down, so I just sat and waited for the tide to do it's stuff. 5 mins later the GPS alarm went off and I brought the anchor on board.
Allan
[/ QUOTE ]
How big is your Delta? (Forgive the intrusive questioning.)
Allan
Well-Known Member
Not on the boat at present so can't check. When I looked it up some years ago it was the recommended size for 24 to 27 feet. My boat is 22 feet. I think during most of our lunch stops we are held by the anchor and a pile of chain sitting on the bottom.
Allan
Allan
Amari
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
. SWMBO did not agree to my suggestion of a way to make the boat move up and down,
Allan
[/ QUOTE ]
However, what a good idea, to rock the anchor out! Far better than a cup of tea. Might have to set the GPS alarm in case you drifted across to France. Do let us know if you discover a fool proof recipe for getting SHMBO to oblige
. SWMBO did not agree to my suggestion of a way to make the boat move up and down,
Allan
[/ QUOTE ]
However, what a good idea, to rock the anchor out! Far better than a cup of tea. Might have to set the GPS alarm in case you drifted across to France. Do let us know if you discover a fool proof recipe for getting SHMBO to oblige
