Rocna Anchors acquired by Canada Metal Pacific

[misterg]

Sorry but I paid for 800, not 620.

Just to keep things straight (ha ha!) the relevant figures for Bisplate 80 are 690MPa Min / 720MPa typical. The '800' relates to UTS which isn't the issue here.

So you paid for 690, not 620.

I fully understand the sentiment, though!

Andy

 

[youen]

As you can see the Smith's are back on the forum on another thread with pictures of their boat in Falklands showing proudly beautiful Rocna in the bowroller.But Craigh dont reply to my question about where theses anchors where made and from which steel.

 

[youen]

Does somebody know which steel is used on the anchors built by CMP recently

 

[Twister_Ken]

Has CMP actually made any anchors yet? If it has, I suspect it is in China, maybe using Bambury's contacts. I wouldn't rush out to buy one.

 

[GrantKing]

Has CMP actually made any anchors yet? If it has, I suspect it is in China, maybe using Bambury's contacts. I wouldn't rush out to buy one.

They are still being made in the same facility by the same manufacturer using the same metals.

If you read the original "memorandums" from CMP you will notice that they state that QC will be handled at their own facility in Ningbo , not the manufacturing.

My Chinese contacts inform me that production carries as normal with 620.

 

[Rigger Mortice]

As you can see the Smith's are back on the forum on another thread with pictures of their boat in Falklands showing proudly beautiful Rocna in the bowroller.But Craigh dont reply to my question about where theses anchors where made and from which steel.

A bit thick skinned of him isn't it? He's presumably testing the water to judge reaction.
They keep that boat going on the royalty payments of sub-standard anchors.

 

[Storyline]

I share the amazement expressed by Grant King and Neeves that some people are happy to use an anchor which is built with materials that are of significantly lower strength than the designer specified. The designer pointed out that the thickness of the shank was kept to a minimum for the best weight balance and a high spec metal (bisplate 80) was essential to compensate for this.

To have a nagging doubt about my main bower anchor would make a real difference to my sailing. Take the situation of a F7 occasionally F8 forecast (common where I sail in NW Scotland) and a choice of a sheltered anchorage with known good holding vs a marina or harbour with moorings. With a trusted anchor then I will quite often choose the anchorage. With a suspect anchor I think I would choose the marina or a mooring.

I have been stuck at anchor in many gales and I really enjoy the feeling of snugness knowing that the anchor is well on and the boat is safe.

If I had a Chinese made Rocna I would have absolutely no choice but to return it. I just could not put to sea with an anchor that had a huge question mark hanging over it.

 

[Storyline]

A bit thick skinned of him isn't it? He's presumably testing the water to judge reaction.
They keep that boat going on the royalty payments of sub-standard anchors.

Youen has asked whether the Rocca on board is a tuned NZ model or a Chinese made one. I wonder if he will get a reply .....

I have this sneaking suspicion it may well be a an NZ one but it would be interesting to challenge Peter Smith to put his boat where his mouth is and ask him to swop to a Chinese made Rocna for his onward voyage from the Falklands - especially one made of 400 or 420 MPa steel.

 

[Conachair]

I have been stuck at anchor in many gales and I really enjoy the feeling of snugness knowing that the anchor is well on and the boat is safe.

Sounds like a very dangerous feeling, about something you can never know.

 

[Storyline]

Sounds like a very dangerous feeling, about something you can never know.

I think the feeling of being snug grows with experience. I will never forget the first gale we experienced at anchor which was in Canna harbour. That first night was tense to say the least. Since then we have ridden out many gales at anchor and each time brings increased confidence (and I hope, improved technique!). We now carry 70m of 3/8 chain and nearly always dig the anchor in with full revs astern. You get to know when you are really 'on'. I know you can never be 100% certain (such is sailing and life) but I really get a sense of satisfaction, security and snugness when I consider the boat is in a safe situation in wild winds. We do not go out looking for gales obviously but cruising the West coast of Scotland each summer means you have to be able to anchor safely as there is quite often no other option available. I have never experienced sustained winds of more than the top end of a F9 but as long as you have good holding, loads of heavy chain out attached to a reliable anchor that is well 'snubbed' and shelter to prevent any sea building then it is suprising how happy the boat is while all around is spray and spume. It is a bit like the feeling of being cosy in bed at home when the wind outside is rattling the window panes - but more so.

For many years we had a CQR but for the last 3 have used a Rocna(NZ). I consider the Rocna an amazing anchor (with the exception of use in mud) and I think this is why this whole sad story has upset so many people. Greed and deceipt has ruined the reputation of one of the very best anchors available.

If it is true that the Chinese factory was instructed to use 420 MPa metal for the shank when production was moved from NZ then it is a story of epic proportions and I just hope no one has their life put in jeopardy by the wilful actions of the previous license holder.

 

[youen]

I think we can thank Craigh to get this thread alived ...Perhaps the web dont reach him in the Falklands where I hope he is not moored on a 400 shank chinese anchor.Before he was very quick to reply.

 

[evm1024]

Just to keep things straight (ha ha!) the relevant figures for Bisplate 80 are 690MPa Min / 720MPa typical. The '800' relates to UTS which isn't the issue here.

So you paid for 690, not 620.

I fully understand the sentiment, though!

Andy

Let's not try to confuse the issue here. The Min yield strength is indeed 690 but typical is 750. I'm sure you know statistics and know that the yield strength follows a bell curve centered on the "typical" value. 690 is the lower limit before rejecting the batch.

For every one under 750 there is one above (more or less for you nitpickers).

When someone says they paid for 800 they mean that they paid to get Bisplate 80 shanks.

Here is the spec by the way: http://www.bisalloy.com.au/files/specs/Bisplate80.pdf

RFegards

 

[Storyline]

I think we can thank Craigh to get this thread alived ...Perhaps the web dont reach him in the Falklands where I hope he is not moored on a 400 shank chinese anchor.Before he was very quick to reply.

Do not worry youen, his Dad is not stupid. Remember, he designed one of the best anchors the world has ever seen. He is extremely unlikely to trust his or his son's life to a 400 MPa version.

 

[GrantKing]

The anchor on Smith's boat was handmade in New Zealand using Bis80.

 

[youen]

Perhaps Peter or Craigh can reply as they were used to do before, when the rocna anchors were made by Holdfast

 

[youen]

Or perhaps they become deaf and dumb?

 

[Twister_Ken]

Perhaps Peter or Craigh can reply as they were used to do before, when the rocna anchors were made by Holdfast

FFS no. We have had enough flak from the Smiths over the years. It's great to have anchor threads without the relentless spin emanating from CS.

 

[Rigger Mortice]

FFS no. We have had enough flak from the Smiths over the years. It's great to have anchor threads without the relentless spin emanating from CS.

+1, a thousand times over

 

[macd]

FFS no. We have had enough flak from the Smiths over the years.

Quite so, but who can forget those memorable recordings?
"Stop Me If You Think You've Heard This One Before"
"Bigmouth Strikes Again"
"What Difference Does It Make?"
"Heaven Knows I'm Miserable Now"
And finally, and perhaps presciently, just before the band's break-up:
"Strangeways, Here We Come"

 

[misterg]

Let's not try to confuse the issue here.

Hear, hear.

We are comparing the specified minimum yield strength of 2 materials. The 'typical' figure isn't available for the Q620 steel, although someone posted a typical test result a few pages ago.

If one is referring to "620", then the corresponding figure for Bisplate 80 is "690".

I posted the specs for both materials a while ago if you care to actually read the thread

Simply trying to keep the facts in the debate.

Andy