starboard
Well-Known Member
P.S. All the stupid statements on this forum today have come from a SMIFFY100 and a SHORN100.........!!!!!!!!! very strange, why do you not just call yourself Chief of Operations RNLI???????
RNLI
- Thread starter Pasarell
- Start date
[ QUOTE ]
Singlehanding over those distances - I presume you are sailing - is putting others and yourself into danger. I think you are bordering on being highly irresponsible...
if this is the way you sail since you are highly likely to need their help.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well first thing, the people most able to rationally judge the risk are my insurance underwriters. I have a letter authorizing nighttime single handed sailing.
But what concerns me more is your obvious lack of knowledge of the type of incidents that call on the maritime emergency services. I have listened to 1000's of hours of channel 16 and so can confidently state that the primary reasons for Maydays/PanPans and RNLI/SAR callout involving leisure craft are:
0 – Diver emergency.
1 - Medical emergency with visitor/guest crew.
2 - Medical emergency with crew participating in corporate sailing event.
3 - Racing crew pushing their luck and having a mishap.
4 - Mechanical failure on aging boat.
5 - Navigational error by charter crew.
6 - Medical alert involving child misadventure.
7 - Crew with minimum age over 70 getting overwhelmed in heavy conditions.
8 - Prat rowing converted beer barrel or similar around the UK
9 - Inexperienced adventurers who read the book and just went for it.
10 – Late night drunks having a lark with the DSC alert button.
11 – Onshore pranksters reporting a fictitious event.
A singlehanded sailor presents little concern to the RNLI or other users at sea. The insurance companies of other nearby moored boats might disagree but I have not triggered a claim yet.
Singlehanding over those distances - I presume you are sailing - is putting others and yourself into danger. I think you are bordering on being highly irresponsible...
if this is the way you sail since you are highly likely to need their help.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well first thing, the people most able to rationally judge the risk are my insurance underwriters. I have a letter authorizing nighttime single handed sailing.
But what concerns me more is your obvious lack of knowledge of the type of incidents that call on the maritime emergency services. I have listened to 1000's of hours of channel 16 and so can confidently state that the primary reasons for Maydays/PanPans and RNLI/SAR callout involving leisure craft are:
0 – Diver emergency.
1 - Medical emergency with visitor/guest crew.
2 - Medical emergency with crew participating in corporate sailing event.
3 - Racing crew pushing their luck and having a mishap.
4 - Mechanical failure on aging boat.
5 - Navigational error by charter crew.
6 - Medical alert involving child misadventure.
7 - Crew with minimum age over 70 getting overwhelmed in heavy conditions.
8 - Prat rowing converted beer barrel or similar around the UK
9 - Inexperienced adventurers who read the book and just went for it.
10 – Late night drunks having a lark with the DSC alert button.
11 – Onshore pranksters reporting a fictitious event.
A singlehanded sailor presents little concern to the RNLI or other users at sea. The insurance companies of other nearby moored boats might disagree but I have not triggered a claim yet.
l'escargot
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
P.S. All the stupid statements on this forum today have come from a SMIFFY100 and a SHORN100.........!!!!!!!!! very strange, why do you not just call yourself Chief of Operations RNLI???????
[/ QUOTE ]
Shorn100 has made 7 posts in 5 years - 6 of those promoting RNLI "services".
What is it these days? It used to be that you didn't even know the local RNLI crews unless you saw a launch or drank in certain pubs. Now you can spot them in the high street wearing labelled sweatshirts and sporting bleepers like a badge of honour. The real heroes used to go quietly about their business.
P.S. All the stupid statements on this forum today have come from a SMIFFY100 and a SHORN100.........!!!!!!!!! very strange, why do you not just call yourself Chief of Operations RNLI???????
[/ QUOTE ]
Shorn100 has made 7 posts in 5 years - 6 of those promoting RNLI "services".
What is it these days? It used to be that you didn't even know the local RNLI crews unless you saw a launch or drank in certain pubs. Now you can spot them in the high street wearing labelled sweatshirts and sporting bleepers like a badge of honour. The real heroes used to go quietly about their business.
fireball
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
The real heroes used to go quietly about their business.
[/ QUOTE ]
and many of them still do ....
The real heroes used to go quietly about their business.
[/ QUOTE ]
and many of them still do ....
Lakesailor
Well-Known Member
I have met Brian Bevan a few times and have been out on the Humber Lifeboat when he was Cox.
I'm sure he would (in a nice way) punch the lights out of any RNLI man who drove like a loony to get to a shout and I'm also sure he would be upset that some of the gobby forumites on this thread had fallen down the boarding steps and hurt their faces when they hit his forehead.
I'm not suggesting for a moment he would be given to a show of unrestrained aggression as he is a very mild-mannered man, but he wouldn't like what has being promoted on here.
Maybe there is a difference between hardened seamen doing rescue work and inshore heroes, but hell, they are all trying to save lives (and property).
I can't see the correlation between a sailor who is able to single-hand and gets into a bad situation and a bunch or drunk kids in an old ski boat with a dicky engine. I know who I would prefer to help.
I'm sure he would (in a nice way) punch the lights out of any RNLI man who drove like a loony to get to a shout and I'm also sure he would be upset that some of the gobby forumites on this thread had fallen down the boarding steps and hurt their faces when they hit his forehead.
I'm not suggesting for a moment he would be given to a show of unrestrained aggression as he is a very mild-mannered man, but he wouldn't like what has being promoted on here.
Maybe there is a difference between hardened seamen doing rescue work and inshore heroes, but hell, they are all trying to save lives (and property).
I can't see the correlation between a sailor who is able to single-hand and gets into a bad situation and a bunch or drunk kids in an old ski boat with a dicky engine. I know who I would prefer to help.
Shorn100
Well-Known Member
What charming gentlemen you are. I think I made a valid point about singlehanding over long distances and all I received was abuse - I think Smiffy raises a good point in that you do not read the posting.
I would remind you of Colregs Rule 5 and would suggest that if you are sailing long distances over protracted hours that keeping a proper look out is not possible particularly when sailing across the busiest waterway in the world.
Every year there are several instances where singlehanders go missing and the rescue services spend hours and hours searching for a body. There was one case this year I think where a singlehander went over the side with his harness on - managed to get a partial Mayday out using his h/h VHF but drowned strapped to his boat before the rescue services could find him.
There was another chap that fell off when anchoring his boat, I think, near Falmouth, it wasn't until his wife phoned in to say that he was missing that they found his boat without him aboard.
North Sea last year - boat found sailing with no crew, another singlehander gone missing. Big search made but body never found.
Jonjo at a lecture by the RNLI I was told that the number one reason, both for sailing boats and motorboats, for call outs was mechanical failure - divers were at the bottom of the list. Your perceptions of risk and who gets into trouble is wrong.
L'escargot - No I am not a RNLI crew member but I do support the RNLI. There was no veiled threat in what I was saying. I'm sure the RNLI would rescue anybody even those that appear to enjoy knocking one of the most professional organisations of its type in the world.
Starboard, I have tremendous admiration for the Lifeboat crew but check your profile - their was no ARRun class lifeboat it's spelt Arun - maybe if you had learnt to spell the name you might have become a full coxswain /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Only joking! I'm sure you did a great job.
I also use other names on this site to make postings. In fact, I've been involved with ybw.com for over 10 years.
Finally, I would say gentlemen that you are the easiest people to wind up. Me thinks you take yourselves too seriously - perhaps it's not me that needs to get a life.
I would remind you of Colregs Rule 5 and would suggest that if you are sailing long distances over protracted hours that keeping a proper look out is not possible particularly when sailing across the busiest waterway in the world.
Every year there are several instances where singlehanders go missing and the rescue services spend hours and hours searching for a body. There was one case this year I think where a singlehander went over the side with his harness on - managed to get a partial Mayday out using his h/h VHF but drowned strapped to his boat before the rescue services could find him.
There was another chap that fell off when anchoring his boat, I think, near Falmouth, it wasn't until his wife phoned in to say that he was missing that they found his boat without him aboard.
North Sea last year - boat found sailing with no crew, another singlehander gone missing. Big search made but body never found.
Jonjo at a lecture by the RNLI I was told that the number one reason, both for sailing boats and motorboats, for call outs was mechanical failure - divers were at the bottom of the list. Your perceptions of risk and who gets into trouble is wrong.
L'escargot - No I am not a RNLI crew member but I do support the RNLI. There was no veiled threat in what I was saying. I'm sure the RNLI would rescue anybody even those that appear to enjoy knocking one of the most professional organisations of its type in the world.
Starboard, I have tremendous admiration for the Lifeboat crew but check your profile - their was no ARRun class lifeboat it's spelt Arun - maybe if you had learnt to spell the name you might have become a full coxswain /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Only joking! I'm sure you did a great job.
I also use other names on this site to make postings. In fact, I've been involved with ybw.com for over 10 years.
Finally, I would say gentlemen that you are the easiest people to wind up. Me thinks you take yourselves too seriously - perhaps it's not me that needs to get a life.
Lakesailor
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I also use other names on this site to make postings.
[/ QUOTE ]
You don't agree with the rules then?
I also use other names on this site to make postings.
[/ QUOTE ]
You don't agree with the rules then?
Sixpence
Well-Known Member
I noticed that too
Come along Shorn 100 , who else do you purport to be ?
Come along Shorn 100 , who else do you purport to be ?
l'escargot
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
....L'escargot - No I am not a RNLI crew member but I do support the RNLI. There was no veiled threat in what I was saying. I'm sure the RNLI would rescue anybody even those that appear to enjoy knocking one of the most professional organisations of its type in the world...
[/ QUOTE ]
Don't see ant mention of you being a crew member, or veiled threat, or knocking of the RNLI as an organisation in my post.
[ QUOTE ]
I also use other names on this site to make postings. In fact, I've been involved with ybw.com for over 10 years.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well it was either that or you couldn't post because you spent about a 4 stretch inside - so you also know about multiple usernames being unacceptable. And I am sure that by using the term "involved" you are trying to give an impression that doesn't stand scrutiny.
[ QUOTE ]
Finally, I would say gentlemen that you are the easiest people to wind up. Me thinks you take yourselves too seriously - perhaps it's not me that needs to get a life.
[/ QUOTE ]
Time to get back in your box - you are self winding and obviously have little to occupy your life if the pinnacle is more than one identity/persona in a sailing forum. I think perhaps you are the only one taking yourself too seriously around here.
....L'escargot - No I am not a RNLI crew member but I do support the RNLI. There was no veiled threat in what I was saying. I'm sure the RNLI would rescue anybody even those that appear to enjoy knocking one of the most professional organisations of its type in the world...
[/ QUOTE ]
Don't see ant mention of you being a crew member, or veiled threat, or knocking of the RNLI as an organisation in my post.
[ QUOTE ]
I also use other names on this site to make postings. In fact, I've been involved with ybw.com for over 10 years.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well it was either that or you couldn't post because you spent about a 4 stretch inside - so you also know about multiple usernames being unacceptable. And I am sure that by using the term "involved" you are trying to give an impression that doesn't stand scrutiny.
[ QUOTE ]
Finally, I would say gentlemen that you are the easiest people to wind up. Me thinks you take yourselves too seriously - perhaps it's not me that needs to get a life.
[/ QUOTE ]
Time to get back in your box - you are self winding and obviously have little to occupy your life if the pinnacle is more than one identity/persona in a sailing forum. I think perhaps you are the only one taking yourself too seriously around here.
Keen_Ed
Well-Known Member
"spouted by a bunch of keyboard sailors"
1530 posts in one year?
1530 posts in one year?
PilotWolf
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I have met Brian Bevan a few times and have been out on the Humber Lifeboat when he was Cox.
I'm sure he would (in a nice way) punch the lights out of any RNLI man who drove like a loony to get to a shout and I'm also sure he would be upset that some of the gobby forumites on this thread had fallen down the boarding steps and hurt their faces when they hit his forehead.
I'm not suggesting for a moment he would be given to a show of unrestrained aggression as he is a very mild-mannered man, but he wouldn't like what has being promoted on here.
Maybe there is a difference between hardened seamen doing rescue work and inshore heroes, but hell, they are all trying to save lives (and property).
I can't see the correlation between a sailor who is able to single-hand and gets into a bad situation and a bunch or drunk kids in an old ski boat with a dicky engine. I know who I would prefer to help.
[/ QUOTE ]
Isn't it ironic you chose the (ex)cox from probably the only station in the country that doesn't have to drive to shouts, being full time? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
W.
I have met Brian Bevan a few times and have been out on the Humber Lifeboat when he was Cox.
I'm sure he would (in a nice way) punch the lights out of any RNLI man who drove like a loony to get to a shout and I'm also sure he would be upset that some of the gobby forumites on this thread had fallen down the boarding steps and hurt their faces when they hit his forehead.
I'm not suggesting for a moment he would be given to a show of unrestrained aggression as he is a very mild-mannered man, but he wouldn't like what has being promoted on here.
Maybe there is a difference between hardened seamen doing rescue work and inshore heroes, but hell, they are all trying to save lives (and property).
I can't see the correlation between a sailor who is able to single-hand and gets into a bad situation and a bunch or drunk kids in an old ski boat with a dicky engine. I know who I would prefer to help.
[/ QUOTE ]
Isn't it ironic you chose the (ex)cox from probably the only station in the country that doesn't have to drive to shouts, being full time? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
W.
gandy
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
... I have listened to 1000's of hours of channel 16 and so can confidently state that the primary reasons for Maydays/PanPans and RNLI/SAR callout involving leisure craft are:
...
4 - Mechanical failure on aging boat.
...
[/ QUOTE ]Hi ..
do you really detect such a big difference in failures on "aging" boats compared to newer ones? I find that a little surprising because an old boat could easily be 30 or more years old, but much of the critical equipment is likely to have been replaced during that time. It would be interesting to see correlation between boat age and mechanical failure rates.
... I have listened to 1000's of hours of channel 16 and so can confidently state that the primary reasons for Maydays/PanPans and RNLI/SAR callout involving leisure craft are:
...
4 - Mechanical failure on aging boat.
...
[/ QUOTE ]Hi ..
do you really detect such a big difference in failures on "aging" boats compared to newer ones? I find that a little surprising because an old boat could easily be 30 or more years old, but much of the critical equipment is likely to have been replaced during that time. It would be interesting to see correlation between boat age and mechanical failure rates.
Lakesailor
Well-Known Member
True. But I didn't have a choice. That's where he was.
The points are still valid.
(Actually when the Spurn Head spit was breached they operated from Grimsby, so getting to the boat was an issue. However as that boat is crewed on a shift basis there isn't fighting over who gets to go)
The points are still valid.
(Actually when the Spurn Head spit was breached they operated from Grimsby, so getting to the boat was an issue. However as that boat is crewed on a shift basis there isn't fighting over who gets to go)
starboard
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Starboard, I have tremendous admiration for the Lifeboat crew but check your profile - their was no ARRun class lifeboat it's spelt Arun - maybe if you had learnt to spell the name you might have become a full coxswain /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Only joking! I'm sure you did a great job.
[/ QUOTE ]
Aye lad my bluddy fingers are too thick for this typing lark RR ......guess from sorting out pratts like you......as for the making of a full time Cox not easy when I already had a full time job, as for doing a good job it was good enough to recieve a gallantry award!!!
Starboard, I have tremendous admiration for the Lifeboat crew but check your profile - their was no ARRun class lifeboat it's spelt Arun - maybe if you had learnt to spell the name you might have become a full coxswain /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Only joking! I'm sure you did a great job.
[/ QUOTE ]
Aye lad my bluddy fingers are too thick for this typing lark RR ......guess from sorting out pratts like you......as for the making of a full time Cox not easy when I already had a full time job, as for doing a good job it was good enough to recieve a gallantry award!!!
[ QUOTE ]
I would remind you of Colregs Rule 5 and would suggest that if you are sailing long distances over protracted hours that keeping a proper look out is not possible particularly when sailing across the busiest waterway in the world.
[/ QUOTE ]
Lyme Bay is surprisingly empty at night, just two fishing boats came within a mile. I would not contemplate doing two consecutive solo nights at sea but I can get through one night based on a 15 minute sleep/get-up/scan horizon routine that meets Rule 5.
Thanks for the other singlehanded data, food for thought. I seem to recall that 2 of those indicents involved elderly singlehanded sailors.
[ QUOTE ]
Jonjo at a lecture by the RNLI I was told that the number one reason, both for sailing boats and motorboats, for call outs was mechanical failure - divers were at the bottom of the list.
[/ QUOTE ]
I think your facts are way out of date and reflect neither the big uptake of diving as a sport or new regulations that mandate declaration of diver emergencies no matter how vague the concern.
http://divesouthafrica.blogspot.com/2006/02/uk-diving-incidents-in-2005-highest.html
"Diving incidents in 2005 were the highest ever recorded"
"The current database goes back to 1998 and it contains 138 fatalities"
I would remind you of Colregs Rule 5 and would suggest that if you are sailing long distances over protracted hours that keeping a proper look out is not possible particularly when sailing across the busiest waterway in the world.
[/ QUOTE ]
Lyme Bay is surprisingly empty at night, just two fishing boats came within a mile. I would not contemplate doing two consecutive solo nights at sea but I can get through one night based on a 15 minute sleep/get-up/scan horizon routine that meets Rule 5.
Thanks for the other singlehanded data, food for thought. I seem to recall that 2 of those indicents involved elderly singlehanded sailors.
[ QUOTE ]
Jonjo at a lecture by the RNLI I was told that the number one reason, both for sailing boats and motorboats, for call outs was mechanical failure - divers were at the bottom of the list.
[/ QUOTE ]
I think your facts are way out of date and reflect neither the big uptake of diving as a sport or new regulations that mandate declaration of diver emergencies no matter how vague the concern.
http://divesouthafrica.blogspot.com/2006/02/uk-diving-incidents-in-2005-highest.html
"Diving incidents in 2005 were the highest ever recorded"
"The current database goes back to 1998 and it contains 138 fatalities"
rickp
Well-Known Member
Perhaps most of the diving incidents requires the Coastguard helicopter rather than the RNLI? I completely agree with your point that singlehanders are not the biggest users of the RNLI services though.
Rick
Rick
[ QUOTE ]
Hi .. do you really detect such a big difference in failures on "aging" boats compared to newer ones?
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes. Considering just the cases where I have been out on the water and thinking if I were 25 miles closer I would be in a position to help, then yes all the yachts were in the 15 to 30 year old bracket. Cataloging 10 incidents in my head half were engine failure in a tricky location, 2 were water ingress (shaft & engine cooling), 1 stuck gearbox and another involved smoking wiring powering a bow thruster (not the Haslar pontoon fire).
Hi .. do you really detect such a big difference in failures on "aging" boats compared to newer ones?
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes. Considering just the cases where I have been out on the water and thinking if I were 25 miles closer I would be in a position to help, then yes all the yachts were in the 15 to 30 year old bracket. Cataloging 10 incidents in my head half were engine failure in a tricky location, 2 were water ingress (shaft & engine cooling), 1 stuck gearbox and another involved smoking wiring powering a bow thruster (not the Haslar pontoon fire).
Twister_Ken
Well-Known Member
>do you really detect such a big difference in failures on "aging" boats compared to newer ones? I find that a little surprising because an old boat could easily be 30 or more years old, but much of the critical equipment is likely to have been replaced during that time. It would be interesting to see correlation between boat age and mechanical failure rates. <
Which reminds me - getting ready to leave Haslar Marina, sorting out the string etc, when a biggish newish Jeanneau backs out of his slot about 5 away, gets into the middle of the 'aisle' then stops there, accompanied by a electronic alarm noise. He slowly drifts down wind towards me, I catch his bow and hand him round onto the vacant berth next to me.
"Thanks", he says. "Quarter of a million quid and the f*cking engine don't work."
Which reminds me - getting ready to leave Haslar Marina, sorting out the string etc, when a biggish newish Jeanneau backs out of his slot about 5 away, gets into the middle of the 'aisle' then stops there, accompanied by a electronic alarm noise. He slowly drifts down wind towards me, I catch his bow and hand him round onto the vacant berth next to me.
"Thanks", he says. "Quarter of a million quid and the f*cking engine don't work."
gandy
Well-Known Member
Was that a failure, or "finger trouble" though? We assisted a brand-new boat recently, with engine failure, but that was a simple operator error that they sorted out fairly quickly once the situation was stabilised.
Twister_Ken
Well-Known Member
No idea. I puttered off a few minutes later. All I remember is that the guy said he took the boat out of astern, the engine stopped, and it wouldn't restart (not within the few minutes I was there, anyway).