Retired and fit - looking for a boat. Advice?

[Kukri]

That would not be the model that I would recommend for the OP’s purpose.?

 

[neptis]

With a budget of £50K, you should definitely get a good Fulmar and have plenty of money to improve it further. As a Fulmar owner who has been getting Concerto just right over the past 6 years and nearly completed, I suggest you have a look at the PowerPoint presentation I made to a RYA conferencein January year.
https://wiki.westerly-owners.co.uk/images/3/3f/Concerto.pdf
This video may give you an idea of how a Fulmar sails.

Then check out the other videos I have on YouTube.

The best advice I can give is to buy a boat, possibly not a Fulmar, in the best condition you can find, even if it costs more, and avoid a fixer upper as this will cost you a lot more in money and time in the long run besides it reduces your sailing. Your first year of ownership should be mainly sailing locally with a few longer trips. You will find what needs to be changed or improved, along with learning better sailing skills. It is a steep learning curve running a boat.

If you decide that a Fulmar is your choice of boat, I would be happy to advise privately on which Fulmar to buy. If you are near Chatham I am happy to show you Concerto and possibly take you out for a sail.

My plans for this year include a 2 week cruise on the East Coast and then later down to the Solent to be the Westerly Owners Association boat at the Southampton Boat Show - all provided Covid does not disrupt things. Next year I am sailing singlehanded round the UK including the Orkneys and Shetland. This is a major trip and the boat must be ready to for all weathers.

What a fantastic bit of advice. I’m in North London so Chatham quite local. I’ll do a bit of digging and may we’ll take you up on the offer.

 

[Concerto]

That would not be the model that I would recommend for the OP’s purpose.?

I agree, but someone suggested it.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

Now I really like the idea of a Vancouver. What’s the difference?

The V274 is a 4 berth version closed of forepeak with double berth which in the traditional V27 was given over to the heads and storage. V27s have circumnavigated they are not fast but not slow passage plan at 4.5 kits and you won't be disappointed but if you are going to £50K then a V32 is possible. They are all getting on a bit now but in general will have been looked after.
Not everyones cup of tea but I wouldn't hesitate to buy one again, I have sailed a lot of miles in V274s, V32s and a V34.

 

[Topcat47]

As a recent retiree, I'd recommend something with a lowish freeboard. A lot of more modern stuff is quite a step down from the deck to a marina berth or into a dinghy. It's not going to be a problem for a fit 55 year old but you'll appreciate it if you're closer to 65. I'm biased but a Nicholson 30,32 or 36 depending on your ability and budget. If money really is no object, Rustler.

 

[neptis]

As a recent retiree, I'd recommend something with a lowish freeboard. A lot of more modern stuff is quite a step down from the deck to a marina berth or into a dinghy. It's not going to be a problem for a fit 55 year old but you'll appreciate it if you're closer to 65. I'm biased but a Nicholson 30,32 or 36 depending on your ability and budget. If money really is no object, Rustler.

Rustler. I’ll look.

 

[ashtead]

You might have to up the budget for a nice Rustler but do let us know what you find-Red Ensign might be a suitable broker.

 

[Kukri]

Rustler. I’ll look.

The original Rustler is now called the Rustler 31 and is essentially a glass North Sea 24 or, to put it another way a big Twister. There is a very elegant counter stern version called the Northney 34 but they are quite rare, not because they are bad boats but because the moulds were lost in a fire.

Later Rustlers are larger; the 37 was the choice of most of those who finished the Golden Globe Race and I think HRH the Princess Royal now has a 44 having traded up from a 37.

There is also a 57... but the freeboard is a bit higher...

 

[bitbaltic]

This post has all the qualities of a troll but I think/hope it’s not.

with a budget of 50k you couldn’t have spent two minutes on yachtworld without challenging your assumptions about centaurs and all sorts of other vintage boats (of all qualities) mentioned.

you can circumnavigate the U.K., and cruise to Holland and France to boot, in everything mentioned and almost everything else conceivable for that matter between 5k and 50k.

the answer is not to but some old boat for half the budget and sit in port doing it up for years and years and consuming the rest of the budget without sailing but supposing it to be a great investment in a hardy vessel. The answer is to buy the best 50k boat you can find for comfortable coastal cruising and that is likely to boil down to a huge amount of choice amongst roughly 20 year old AWBs.

As usual the wide goalposts have allowed the forum to slip into standard mode of recommending the boats we have/approaches we took which is the forum’s favourite and default position. ‘Advice is a form of nostalgia’; caveat emptor.

 

[Tranona]

Can get dual UK / EU nationality which helps.
Budget probably under 50k to start but if the advice is get a centaur / fulmar and re- engine and re / rig. Then it’s all in range.

With that sort of budget you should really be looking at a more modern boat in the 32-34' range. Essentially any cruising boat can do round Britain. The question is how do you want to do it. At one end of the scale you can rush round as fast as you can in a sporty 26' like a friend did in an MG 27 in 4 months, or you can take your time and day sail staying at different places to explore, perhaps even taking 2 years to do it - what's the rush? If you are toward that end of the continuum then you will spend 80% of your time in harbour and only sail when conditions are right. For that you don't need one of those offshore heavyweights some have suggested, but a boat that has good accommodation, light and airy, all mod cons and easy to handle. It is not an assault course battling the weather come what may.

Not a lot on the market at the moment, but take the rest of this year looking at as many types of boat as you can in your price range. Just a few examples - Bavaria 32 or 34, Jeanneau 32, 34, 36, Beneteau 331 323 351, Hanse 342. All of these, and other similar from the late 90s early 2000s are available in the £30-50k range depending on year and condition.

 

[Kukri]

The age doesn’t matter as long as the boat has been kept up. (As I said a page or two ago!?)

A twenty year old boat with original electrics, plumbing, upholstery, and with old and tired sails, rigging, winches, windlass, etc is not going to be a bargain unless she was built to a very high standard in the first place, in which case she won’t be for sale at £30-50k.

 

[Chae_73]

This post has all the qualities of a troll but I think/hope it’s not.

with a budget of 50k you couldn’t have spent two minutes on yachtworld without challenging your assumptions about centaurs and all sorts of other vintage boats (of all qualities) mentioned.

you can circumnavigate the U.K., and cruise to Holland and France to boot, in everything mentioned and almost everything else conceivable for that matter between 5k and 50k.

the answer is not to but some old boat for half the budget and sit in port doing it up for years and years and consuming the rest of the budget without sailing but supposing it to be a great investment in a hardy vessel. The answer is to buy the best 50k boat you can find for comfortable coastal cruising and that is likely to boil down to a huge amount of choice amongst roughly 20 year old AWBs.

As usual the wide goalposts have allowed the forum to slip into standard mode of recommending the boats we have/approaches we took which is the forum’s favourite and default position. ‘Advice is a form of nostalgia’; caveat emptor.

This post has all the qualities of a troll but I think/hope it’s not.

with a budget of 50k you couldn’t have spent two minutes on yachtworld without challenging your assumptions about centaurs and all sorts of other vintage boats (of all qualities) mentioned.

you can circumnavigate the U.K., and cruise to Holland and France to boot, in everything mentioned and almost everything else conceivable for that matter between 5k and 50k.

the answer is not to but some old boat for half the budget and sit in port doing it up for years and years and consuming the rest of the budget without sailing but supposing it to be a great investment in a hardy vessel. The answer is to buy the best 50k boat you can find for comfortable coastal cruising and that is likely to boil down to a huge amount of choice amongst roughly 20 year old AWBs.

As usual the wide goalposts have allowed the forum to slip into standard mode of recommending the boats we have/approaches we took which is the forum’s favourite and default position. ‘Advice is a form of nostalgia’; caveat emptor.

I half agree with you and personally have no issue with more modern boats, but I don't have sufficient experience of them to recommend any in particular.

The part that I disagree with, is that you may well spend £50k on a 15-20 year old AWB and still find that it needs standing rigging, engine, sails, electronics etc replaced and then you are well over budget.

I also don't agree that having to attend to these items means spending years in port. No reason why you can't get all this stuff done over one winter, or if it ain't totally broke, do it as you go along.

 

[bitbaltic]

The part that I disagree with, is that you may well spend £50k on a 15-20 year old AWB and still find that it needs standing rigging, engine, sails, electronics etc replaced and then you are well over budget.

the purpose of knowing what you are doing is to price those things into your offer so you do not make an offer at your top budget. You suggest that these issues could come as a nasty surprise after purchase. Competent and diligent viewing of a boat (a viewing should take many hours) means that this is not an issue.

put more simply, anybody who spends 50k on any boat on the basis that it is seaworthy and worth 50k as it lies and then finds it needs a new engine would have only himself to blame.

I also don't agree that having to attend to these items means spending years in port. No reason why you can't get all this stuff done over one winter, or if it ain't totally broke, do it as you go along.

see above point. Your offer for a boat should include whatever works you think are reasonable and since we agree that prolonged works would be unreasonable the answer is always to reject any boat requiring prolonged works and, in the OP case, use his good judgment and excellent budget to avoid this.

 

[Tranona]

I half agree with you and personally have no issue with more modern boats, but I don't have sufficient experience of them to recommend any in particular.

The part that I disagree with, is that you may well spend £50k on a 15-20 year old AWB and still find that it needs standing rigging, engine, sails, electronics etc replaced and then you are well over budget.

I also don't agree that having to attend to these items means spending years in port. No reason why you can't get all this stuff done over one winter, or if it ain't totally broke, do it as you go along.

Suggest you have a look at some of the AWBs suggested - they really do not conform to the stereotypes often given.

You have to treat your budget as being the limit for a ready to go boat and look at what you can get within that budget. The thing with 15-20 year old boats is that they really do not need new engines and electronics from the period (mostly Raymarine ) are still usable as you can convert to latest instruments quite easily. Also because of their lower basic costs most were fully equipped with electric windlasses, shorepower, fridges, heating and so on which just did not really exist in the previous generation boats. All of these sort of things are much more useful for a retiree coastal cruising than the sort of qualities offered by older heavyweight boats.

 

[Concerto]

The original Rustler is now called the Rustler 31 and is essentially a glass North Sea 24 or, to put it another way a big Twister. There is a very elegant counter stern version called the Northney 34 but they are quite rare, not because they are bad boats but because the moulds were lost in a fire.

Later Rustlers are larger; the 37 was the choice of most of those who finished the Golden Globe Race and I think HRH the Princess Royal now has a 44 having traded up from a 37.

There is also a 57... but the freeboard is a bit higher...

What is the chance of this happening. Before the Nicholson 30 I mentioned earlier, my parents owned a Northerny 34. The major difference is it is a long keel which means trying to reverse in a marina is highly unpredictable. They are quite narrow by modern standards and most are now over 50 years old. They sail easily and if kept on a mooring, rather than in a marina, would be quite a good boat for a beginner provided they are happy with higher maintenance.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Why on Earth would someone with a £50k budget be looking at Centaurs or Fulmars ? Absolutely nuts.

If you have a £15-£20K budget, sure, a Fulmar might be a good choice, but £50K opens up a ton of late 90's early 2000s AWBs.

If you can actually find anything for sale at the moment.

 

[John the kiwi]

So as we all know, buying a boat is one thing and berthing and maintaining it another thing again.
Lets say the OP buys a 50k boat that is in good /excellent condition: Say a 32 ft AWB.

1. What range of annual costs for moorings? mud berth to upmarket marina?
2. what allowance for annual maintenance to keep the boat in same fine state as when purchased - average say over a 10 year period allowing for once a decade cost of standing rigging etc?

A bit of thread drift perhaps but probably relevant to OP..

 

[Babylon]

As usual the wide goalposts have allowed the forum to slip into standard mode of recommending the boats we have/approaches we took which is the forum’s favourite and default position. ‘Advice is a form of nostalgia’; caveat emptor.

To be fair the OP asked a specific question about - for example - the difference between two slightly different models of the same yacht design, which I happen to have fourteen years' experience of. I indulged myself in answering him, giving a terse but essential summary of the design - but made no recommendations.

If I was starting now with £50k, I'd look for the youngest, best maintained, well-regarded, roomiest 30-32 footer I could find for £40k, keeping the remaining 20% in reserve for unexpected expenses, upgrades etc.

Personally I like heavier, longer-keeled, well-constructed types - but that's as much a romantic inclination as a practical one.

 

[Tranona]

To be fair the OP asked a specific question about - for example - the difference between two slightly different models of the same yacht design, which I happen to have fourteen years' experience of. I indulged myself in answering him, giving a terse but essential summary of the design - but made no recommendations.

If I was starting now with £50k, I'd look for the youngest, best maintained, well-regarded, roomiest 30-32 footer I could find for £40k, keeping the remaining 20% in reserve for unexpected expenses, upgrades etc.

Personally I like heavier, longer-keeled, well-constructed types - but that's as much a romantic inclination as a practical one.

Yes, that is the problem with these sort of threads. They start with one question and people pitch in with their own preferences but as more information comes in from the OP the question actually becomes very different.

So if the first question had been "I have £50 k for a retirement boat for coastal cruising and perhaps round Britain" it would not have been p3 before sensible suggestions started to come!

 

[neptis]

Now we are narrowing choices to older UK type boats no doubt rustlers, Barbican’s and bowmans will be on your list . You might find with some research that some existing Storm owners have cruised round the Uk in manner proposed -might be worth a post on westerly owners website to see if any are members.

There are some nice option but I’m not limiting myself to UK type boats.