Retire and live aboard

[Retired in Crete]

I am astounded by the cost figures being talked about!

I have a two bedroom house with sea views and a swimming pool on a 1,200 sq.m plot, a 29ft Beneteau First in the local marina (mooring fee’s 1,200 Euro p.a.) and drive a 4 year old car. We eat out, in local tavernas, a couple of times a week at an average cost of around 20 Euros for two.

My income is the UK govt state pension (with SERPS top up) and a small private pension.

It is obvious from previous posts that I live in abject poverty! All I can say is that poverty never tasted so good!

John

 

[duncan99210]

We lived on board for five years. Our income was about £40 k before tax and that supported us comfortably. We now spend six months on the boat and six months in UK. We find that the same money keeps us comfortable. Life styles change: for example, on the boat we will eat out two or three times a week, in UK much less frequently.
Hence my earlier post.....

 

[Daydream believer]

I met a couple who had lived on a yacht in the med for 10 years.
When they felt age was becoming a problem they bought an ex charter french canal boat ( very cheaply) & a small car ( fiat 500 I think)& a moped. They would move around the french canals & then go & get the car by moped ( which they towed behind car on a trailer) they used the car to return to UK 2 X a year to see family & deal with any other matters.
They also did a bit of driving around the various areas. When they did not have the car nearby the moped dealt with shopping trips ( I suppose an electric bike would have done a similar job if they did not move too far from the car)
They had got another 10 years of living aboard & had no major worries about old age & they were both approaching 80 years. They say they had virtually just got lost in the canal system

 

[GrahamM376]

Reading this thread makes me feel like a right pauper. Most people seem to be 'surviving' as liveaboards on income that is more than what I have now. But that means that I won't feel the cutbacks when time comes to jump aboard and sail away!

So many varying lifestyles, just as there are at home. Some will say they can't do without their £1m+ house and Rolls Royce, the vast majority live a cheaper life style. I took the decision to give up the Beemers and RangeRovers many years ago. I sold the business, downsized house and retired at 53 (69 now) and guess what - I don't miss them. We usually spend up to 9 months on the boat and a couple of visits back to check the empty house is still standing. Air fares cheap £51 for both to go back to Faro next month.

Owners of big boats in south coast marinas judge "how much it would cost" based on their expenses which bear no relationship to Mr Average out in the sticks with a smaller boat and maybe a mooring costing £8-10k p.a.less. We have never in 20+ years been marina based, I'm now fortunate in having my own mooring with not even harbour dues to pay and only use marinas infrequently when out and about for summer cruise, we anchor when possible because we like to. Choice of marina has a big influence on costs for many, <12m a night in a SW Spanish marina for 31 euro, or Algarve for around 47 or, a month in Leixioes on the west coast for euro 125.

I wish the armchair sailors would stop telling those of us who are doing it, that we can't possibly exist on the figures we quote.

 

[Sybarite]

Humm, would seem to me that reading most comments on this subject that the effect of ageing are perhaps not being properly taken into account. For instance, would one be able to sail a yacht with advancing age, if not then the cost of maintaining sails etc are irrelevant so one might be better off with a motor boat, much more manageable with limited mobility and strength, much lower maintainence costs,easier moorings option, as no keel etc. Perhaps a river based mooring with a motorboat might be cheaper and certainly easier with advancing age related issues. Also a better interior layout with higher headroom and facilities on board.
Hell might also consider a canal narrowboat for a live aboard, made for the job.
Of course,might not be the answer for the sailing folk, but then when all considered just how long can sailing folk carry on sailing in advancing age?

Yet another argument for Amels as the whole idea is not to require physical strength for anything. Henri Amel used to solo sail his 53' Super Maramu well into his 80's.

 

[jonic]

We left with 12k savings and two very small incomes from rented mortgaged property expecting to last for a year.

Came back 8 years later having lived like kings. Anchoring everywhere in the Caribbean and ICW in the USA.

Anchoring everywhere and earning in sterling but spending in dollars was the key.

The ridiculous banking Ponzi scheme and absurd UK property bubbles did the rest.

 

[basic]

Read 'Voyaging on a Small Income' by Annie Hill.

 

[GHA]

I also thought I was quite well off by liveaboard standards round the atlantic, with the fun company I ended up with anyway. Turns out it was consistent abject poverty!
Anyway, back to the real world. Cos it's fantastic

 

[EU_Cruiser]

I met a couple who had lived on a yacht in the med for 10 years.
When they felt age was becoming a problem they bought an ex charter french canal boat ( very cheaply) & a small car ( fiat 500 I think)& a moped. They would move around the french canals & then go & get the car by moped ( which they towed behind car on a trailer) they used the car to return to UK 2 X a year to see family & deal with any other matters.
They also did a bit of driving around the various areas. When they did not have the car nearby the moped dealt with shopping trips ( I suppose an electric bike would have done a similar job if they did not move too far from the car)
They had got another 10 years of living aboard & had no major worries about old age & they were both approaching 80 years. They say they had virtually just got lost in the canal system

Love it! Working on getting there and then taking a pill.

 

[[2574]]

The only thing that I would add is that the solution to retiring early and having some fun sailing, or doing whatever is your bag, comes from a blend of actions and sources. I had done the sums many times - the normal thing "x income at y yield requires z capital" and that calculation always seems to lead to an improbable capital sum requirement. However I then one day took a different tack and blended together a little consultancy work, the new pensions freedoms, cutting our cloth, sorting housing arrangements etcetera and thoroughly surprised myself that our objective was absolutely achievable. We packed in "proper" work last march and are enjoying having our lives back after thirty-five years at the desk.

It is thoroughly my view now that several "ducks" need lining up to achieve the right blend of income, lifestyle, security and future prospects (and those are entirely personal of course and need thinking through) but that it can be done in this manner. It isn't a single solution, think in three dimensions!

We're all a long time dead.

Rob

 

[roblpm]

The only thing that I would add is that the solution to retiring early and having some fun sailing, or doing whatever is your bag, comes from a blend of actions and sources. I had done the sums many times - the normal thing "x income at y yield requires z capital" and that calculation always seems to lead to an improbable capital sum requirement. However I then one day took a different tack and blended together a little consultancy work, the new pensions freedoms, cutting our cloth, sorting housing arrangements etcetera and thoroughly surprised myself that our objective was absolutely achievable. We packed in "proper" work last march and are enjoying having our lives back after thirty-five years at the desk.

It is thoroughly my view now that several "ducks" need lining up to achieve the right blend of income, lifestyle, security and future prospects (and those are entirely personal of course and need thinking through) but that it can be done in this manner. It isn't a single solution, think in three dimensions!

We're all a long time dead.

Rob

Couldn't agree more though I am not there yet.

If you look at annuity rates for joint life 50%2 , 3% increase year you get 2.7% at 55. So if i had a million quid in my pension i would get a huge 27k a year. Not going to happen.

However if you hop over to firecalc and start putting in your current pension fund, 10 years contributions, the state pension, a bit of work you can get a lot further! The old fashioned idea of retirement is going out the window for a lot of people i think.

My definition of retirement will be doing what i want when i want. But that will include doing non stressful, interesting, useful part time work of some description.

 

[[2574]]

My definition of retirement will be doing what i want when i want. But that will include doing non stressful, interesting, useful part time work of some description.

Spot on. I should add that the State Pension has a part to play but now needs to be seen differently to how it was in the past. Now it is a later-in-retirement nice little addition to one's own pension provision. It's not a bad pension if it is seen like that. My state pension forecast is for £150/wk and if that is seen in terms of fund value it equates to a significant capital value of maybe £150k and for working couples its double that. If that is factored in to one's overall pension "solution" it starts to make sense.

 

[Tranona]

Spot on. I should add that the State Pension has a part to play but now needs to be seen differently to how it was in the past. Now it is a later-in-retirement nice little addition to one's own pension provision. It's not a bad pension if it is seen like that. My state pension forecast is for £150/wk and if that is seen in terms of fund value it equates to a significant capital value of maybe £150k and for working couples its double that. If that is factored in to one's overall pension "solution" it starts to make sense.

Agree. I retired from full time at 62, did 2 years part time and a further 3 years oh and off consultancy. combination of (good) teachers pension and state for both of us with no mortgage is more than comfortable. Amazing how much you spend while working and in the company of others, and how far you can stretch money for the good things in life.

 

[LadyInBed]

My State Pension goes into a seperate bank account named Boat Fund

 

[Wansworth]

Sounding out the wife on this subject....... as long as she can have a hot shower every day the rest is detail....... now my Albino Vega..

 

[roblpm]

Agree. I retired from full time at 62, did 2 years part time and a further 3 years oh and off consultancy. combination of (good) teachers pension and state for both of us with no mortgage is more than comfortable. Amazing how much you spend while working and in the company of others, and how far you can stretch money for the good things in life.

I think a lot of people aren't going to be in this position though. If you work in the private sector now a lot of people are going to end up with woeful pensions. I don't know what teachers pensions are like now. Is it too late to retrain?!

In the private sector people are going to be spending down the capital in their pensions and hoping it doesn't run out. There is no other way with annuity rates at 3%.

Divide your annual pension by 0.03 and see what you would have had to accrue in a private pension.

Lets say its 20,000 a year, thats 666k in a private pension.

Us private sector types are doomed!

Not bemoaning decent public sector pensions by the way. Good on ya!

 

[[2574]]

In the private sector people are going to be spending down the capital in their pensions and hoping it doesn't run out. There is no other way with annuity rates at 3%.
!

That's an interesting comment. Yes, it does mean consuming capital from pension funds but that's exactly what happens with an annuity surely? The minute that one buys an annuity the capital is gone (there may be minimum pension payment periods but essentially the capital has gone). Unless passing on significant value to the children is vital then you need to consume capital - no point being the richest corpse in the cemetery! The key is forecasting longevity and drawdown in a prudent manner. If you plan for the fund to be near exhausted at 90 years that surely must be a prudent approach?

 

[pagoda]

That's an interesting comment. Yes, it does mean consuming capital from pension funds but that's exactly what happens with an annuity surely? The minute that one buys an annuity the capital is gone (there may be minimum pension payment periods but essentially the capital has gone). Unless passing on significant value to the children is vital then you need to consume capital - no point being the richest corpse in the cemetery! The key is forecasting longevity and drawdown in a prudent manner. If you plan for the fund to be near exhausted at 90 years that surely must be a prudent approach?

I think many traditional annuity level pensions were priced (by the pension companies ) to hold all the capital and pay out the minimum from income on the capital. If you go for an escalating pension - its a gamble, - you may get more by the time you are 80, but what will you want to do with it. Requirements for stuff/belongings tend to fade away once you are much over 70 ish. I have an employers DC pension, a SIPP and an old personal pension fund. Nothing yet converted, though drawdown looks sensible as I have 5 years to go before any state pension kicks in. I don't need much more than the annuity would offer, but I will control the capital, which I like the sound of. The old "kiss your pot goodbye" system is fortunately not the only way forward.

 

[Tranona]

I think a lot of people aren't going to be in this position though. If you work in the private sector now a lot of people are going to end up with woeful pensions. I don't know what teachers pensions are like now. Is it too late to retrain?!

In the private sector people are going to be spending down the capital in their pensions and hoping it doesn't run out. There is no other way with annuity rates at 3%.

Divide your annual pension by 0.03 and see what you would have had to accrue in a private pension.

Lets say its 20,000 a year, thats 666k in a private pension.

Us private sector types are doomed!

Not bemoaning decent public sector pensions by the way. Good on ya!

My point was not particularly about the level of pensions - I had only 22 years service at university, and the teachers pension scheme is still good even though the salaries still lag. I do agree that the future prospects are not as those of us who started working life in the 1960's.

The main point i was trying to make is that you shed a lot of expenditure when you no longer have to go to work - fuel, buying food out, cloths, socialising - or rather you have much more choice about how you spend your money.

As you have seen from this thread and many others like it, people manage on relatively small incomes and still achieve a good way of life. You only have to look at the waste in society to appreciate where money goes that could be spent on savings - but that is part of our consumer society.

 

[roblpm]

My point was not particularly about the level of pensions - I had only 22 years service at university, and the teachers pension scheme is still good even though the salaries still lag. I do agree that the future prospects are not as those of us who started working life in the 1960's.

The main point i was trying to make is that you shed a lot of expenditure when you no longer have to go to work - fuel, buying food out, cloths, socialising - or rather you have much more choice about how you spend your money.

As you have seen from this thread and many others like it, people manage on relatively small incomes and still achieve a good way of life. You only have to look at the waste in society to appreciate where money goes that could be spent on savings - but that is part of our consumer society.

Totally agree. I have already spent about £7 on coffees today just to get me through the day!!

Trouble is my wife doesn't see it that way......!