Replacement of Stuffing Box with Dripless Seal

Tranona said:
You clearly have a very strange view of "simplicity". Multiple materials, moving parts, requirement for a water feed or vent and a critical set up regime compared with no moving parts and 2 screws to do up.
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Somewhat overstated, surely? Multiple materials but less than a packed gland has. The moving part is a disc attached to the shaft. The water vent overcomes the biggest drawback of the Volvo seal in an extremely simple way. The critical setup requires a mark to be made on the shaft with a pencil, then move the disc 3/4 inch (for a 1 inch shaft) and it makes little difference if it's 1/4 inch either way.
 
vyv_cox said:
Somewhat overstated, surely? Multiple materials but less than a packed gland has. The moving part is a disc attached to the shaft. The water vent overcomes the biggest drawback of the Volvo seal in an extremely simple way. The critical setup requires a mark to be made on the shaft with a pencil, then move the disc 3/4 inch (for a 1 inch shaft) and it makes little difference if it's 1/4 inch either way.
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Perhaps, and abit tongue in cheek - just responding to an assertion that the Volvo has 5 component parts which as you know it does not! (and that somehow you can buy a PSS for $68). But you do still have bellows, two clamps, two housings and two material faces. Burping a Volvo seal is only a potential drawback if you are on a drying mooring and can be a nuisance if you do not have good access, but for most people it is a once a year job - and it soon lets you know if you have not done it, without doing any damage.
 
Tranona said:
Perhaps, and abit tongue in cheek - just responding to an assertion that the Volvo has 5 component parts which as you know it does not! (and that somehow you can buy a PSS for $68). But you do still have bellows, two clamps, two housings and two material faces. Burping a Volvo seal is only a potential drawback if you are on a drying mooring and can be a nuisance if you do not have good access, but for most people it is a once a year job - and it soon lets you know if you have not done it, without doing any damage.
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Not for me on mine. I got considerable amounts of air out of my Volvo seal after every few hours of motoring.

If you've not done so already, try burping it again after a bit of use.
 
CaptainBob said:
Not for me on mine. I got considerable amounts of air out of my Volvo seal after every few hours of motoring.

If you've not done so already, try burping it again after a bit of use.
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If I remember rightly you replaced yours because it was leaking. If the seals are worn it may let air in. I have had mine for nearly 15 years and only ever burp it when launching - and have only forgottten once, which is why I know it makes an awful noise, which disappears when you burp it . The noise is the rubber flutes running dry.
 
This thread seems to illustrate the forum at its best and worst at the same time.

People arguing over whether three parts or five parts makes a thing complicated seems a little OTT?

From my limited experience of using boats with all sorts of stern glands here's my two pennyworth.

Traditional stuffing boxes are ok - but we have always replaced them with modern seals. Why have the hassle of remembering to grease the thing, the mess of the grease and the drips of water when you can have simple clean and hassle free alternatives at reasonable cost?

We have fitted PSS seals to two of our boats and never had a problem. Simple to fit and not very critical to adjust. I sealed off the vent on the current one and just burp it when I remember to. Even when I forget it never gives any trouble.

The boat came with a Volvo lip seal which leaked. The engine wasn't set up very well and the seal had worn oval. Not the fault of the product and I know that the Volvo seal has an outstanding reputation. We just changed to something we were familiar with with a similarly good reputation.

I find it hard to understand the price difference between £70 and £200 being that significant for such a safety critical and yet long lived item. Compared to ongoing cost of many things associated with boating it's insignificant over the lifetime of the boat.

What I am really trying to say is that there is no killer argument to differentuate between the two products, and that if you want an alternative to a stuffing box then fit the one that you can get into the space and setup on your boat!
 
Tranona said:
If I remember rightly you replaced yours because it was leaking. If the seals are worn it may let air in. I have had mine for nearly 15 years and only ever burp it when launching - and have only forgottten once, which is why I know it makes an awful noise, which disappears when you burp it . The noise is the rubber flutes running dry.
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We did replace it, but the new one also needed burping often, and it never dripped a drop, in 100s of hours of both motoring or sailing.

Perhaps the shape of our hull and the cavity around the shaft outside made ours more prone to catching bubbles.
 
john_morris_uk said:
What I am really trying to say is that there is no killer argument to differentuate between the two products, and that if you want an alternative to a stuffing box then fit the one that you can get into the space and setup on your boat!
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Nothing wrong with debating the relative merits of different products. However, suggesting that a product can be bought for $68 when the current price is at least 3 times that is stretching things. As is claiming that a product has only 5 components, when the maintenance kit alone contains 16 items (plus a key to assemble it) shows real imagination! The total number of components in the complete item is more than 20. The other item has a maximum of 6 - 1 moulding, 1 clamp and two sets of screws and locknuts.

Suggest the two adjectives of "simple" and "complex" are more than justified, whatever the functional pros and cons of each!
 
Tranona said:
Nothing wrong with debating the relative merits of different products. However, suggesting that a product can be bought for $68 when the current price is at least 3 times that is stretching things. As is claiming that a product has only 5 components, when the maintenance kit alone contains 16 items (plus a key to assemble it) shows real imagination! The total number of components in the complete item is more than 20. The other item has a maximum of 6 - 1 moulding, 1 clamp and two sets of screws and locknuts.

Suggest the two adjectives of "simple" and "complex" are more than justified, whatever the functional pros and cons of each!
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Hmm - I am trying to work out which item has twenty parts as you are not clear. I suppose if you start counting four jubilee clips, one flexible hose, one shaft collar, one bearing surface and two 'O' rings and four screws and a pipe inlet for cooling water (if in a high speed installation) as separate items it still doesn't make a parts count of 20 for the PSS seal and we are into silly arguments; counting each of the screws is perhaps being disingenuous. Having two lock screws onto the shaft each with a locking screw on top seems to be belt and braces and actually enhances the safety factor rather than reducing it which is what seems to be implied by a multiple parts count and 'complex device' tag.

I am still convinced that there is no killer argument either way. Both products are simple to fit, simple in operation and both are excellent as far as I can see and one should fit the one that fits...
 
charles_reed said:
I must agree, but have to admire Tranona for his passion.

For his delectation - I bought my PSS seal direct from the US in 1993, at that time they were just setting up an UK distributor.
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I bought things and did things in 1993 that I would like to do now - but not really relevant (much) to today's world!
 
Ok, I bought the seal (Volvo) off ebay, before the stern tube. I got a bit of a bargain and the seal is a 1". Bought a tube from Vetus, who had been previously non forthcoming about the o/d of their tubes. Slight missmatch on the Vetus tube which is 25mm bearing fitted, but the o/d is fine. I'm going to fit an aftermarket bearing and cut the 1000mm tube in half, so if anyone is interested in a grp 500mm stern tube with ready fitted bearing, PM me.

Does the VP need water supply?

If I were to fit one to the tube, which is quite thin walled, any suggestions as to reinforcement?
 
john_morris_uk said:
Hmm - I am trying to work out which item has twenty parts as you are not clear. I suppose if you start counting four jubilee clips, one flexible hose, one shaft collar, one bearing surface and two 'O' rings and four screws and a pipe inlet for cooling water (if in a high speed installation) as separate items it still doesn't make a parts count of 20 for the PSS seal and we are into silly arguments; counting each of the screws is perhaps being disingenuous. Having two lock screws onto the shaft each with a locking screw on top seems to be belt and braces and actually enhances the safety factor rather than reducing it which is what seems to be implied by a multiple parts count and 'complex device' tag.

I am still convinced that there is no killer argument either way. Both products are simple to fit, simple in operation and both are excellent as far as I can see and one should fit the one that fits...
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Have a look at the photo of the maintenance kit on the PSS manufacturer's website. 16 pieces there plus the the two collars plus the hose and it's clip and that is 20. And I think the bearing surface bit is two types of material, but I have not checked. It is a very well engineered bit of kit - it has to be to overcome the basic design constraints of trying to use face seals to seal a shaft going through a tube. Those of us with long memories of when this principle was first used in a "simple" and cheap way will never be happy using one despite the efforts that have gone into making them more secure.

What is so attractive about the Volvo and Radice designs - if it fits your application - simple and foolproof and lets you know if and when it does wear.
 
i know this thread is old, but I would really appreciate it if I could get confirmation on what the make is of that red stuffing box in the picture, because I have the same on on my boat and I need to repair it as it leaks everywhere. ive considered using a conventional one, but really im just going for cost effectiveness. if I can replace a nitrile ring or whatever ill just do that. is that a tides marine water seal? and is MOA the BMW motorcycle owners of America?
 
Capt Naufragio said:
i know this thread is old, but I would really appreciate it if I could get confirmation on what the make is of that red stuffing box in the picture, because I have the same on on my boat and I need to repair it as it leaks everywhere. ive considered using a conventional one, but really im just going for cost effectiveness. if I can replace a nitrile ring or whatever ill just do that. is that a tides marine water seal? and is MOA the BMW motorcycle owners of America?
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The text of the message says it is a Tides Marine seal.
This page from one of our esteemed posters describes several different type of stern seals... http://coxengineering.sharepoint.com/Pages/Sternglands.aspx
MOA is the Moody Owners Association.
 
[QUOTE..... and Radice (but only for metric shafts) 25mm £67[/QUOTE]

I've just purchased a 1 1/4" version at £65 +VAT. The Sillette website only shows the metric items but the (downloadable) booklet shows the imperial versions.

I regard it as a self burping, greasable Volvo seal.

Piddy.
 
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