Replace or Repair

[mickp]

My engine now needs a major overhaul rebuild and has to be removed. I have no previous history on the engine so expect the worst, it has already been found to have severe water damage from a faulty exhaust mixer. The cost will be about half to two thirds the price of a new replacement. I intend to keep the boat for at least 8 - 10 years.
Is it worth repairing or should i bite the bullet and talk nicely to the bank manager and fit new.

 

[gerryl]

Replace it! Would you ever really trust the thing if you got it rebuilt, you might need it to save your life one day... Get a shiny new one that you can learn to love and cherish and come to know inside out. You'll have more confidence, the boat and the wife will think you're really sensible, and she'll be worth more if you ever have to part company ( the boat, not the wife)

 

[oldharry]

This depends on the reliability of the mechanic doing the job. You would need to agree with them what they are actually going to do, and how far are they going to check the extent of damage.

If the engine is simply worn, but otherwise good, then replacement of the worn parts is a worthwhile saving over new.

If on the other hand the water damage you mention means that water has got in to the engine internals, then its probably not worth the time and cost involved in stripping and checking everything - and I mean everything - down to the last nut and bolt. The mechanic has only to miss one damaged component (and its not always easy to tell whether a component is still serviceable) or to miss a restricted oilway for example, for you to be buying ongoing trouble. Can you rely on your mechanics assesment of the long term serviceability of parts he is putting back in?

I have a sneaking suspicion that with a conscientious mechanic the cost would creep up to something approaching the new price - and in this one you MUSt have a conscientious mechanic..... or you will be making false economies.

Talk nicely to your Bank Man to fit new, and you will at least know that everything is starting off at specifications - with better comeback if things do go wrong.

 

[Chris_Stannard]

Unfortunately you do not say what the engine is or where you are.

If it is a Volvo, RK Marine at Burseldon and Powerplus at Cowes sometimes have rebuilt units at a very much less than new engines.

A friend of mine had his engine completely rebuilt in Cherbourg, again a Volvo, for about £1200. Of course he had to sail it over and leave it there for a week.

If you change your engine you may need modifications to the engine bed, shaft arrangements etc, so my thought would be to stick with what you have if you can get a good guaranteed rebuild.

Chris Stannard

 

[extravert]

A guideline I have heard for repair/replace is if the cost of repair is more than 40% the cost of replacement, then replace. You are talking of a ration well above that.

My head gasket blew last summer because of a corroded head. It cost £600 to repair, including a head skim. 6 months later I found out that I have gearbox problems, so now it is a replacement anyway.

 

[billmacfarlane]

You sound as if you've got 2 separate problems here . One is that you've got an unknown quantity on your hands as you don't know the history of the engine , and the second problem is the problem you're dealing with. If the cost is approximately half to two thirds at present you might that creeping up as the engine is stripped down and other unknown problems are discovered. At the end of it you might be paying a hell of a lot of money for what is effectively still an older engine. I personally would forget the engine strip/rebuild , cut my losses and buy a new one , getting it professionally installed. You'll know where you stand then. I don't agree that it might save your life though. I'm assuming it's a sailing boat and if that's the case then I'd never rely on an engine to get you out of trouble , that's what your sails are for.

 

[Rowana]

Replace is the ONLY option I would consider. If you have it repaired, and keep the boat another 8 - 10 years as you say, what age will your engine be then? Your brand-new shiny one that you put in now will be 8 -10 years old by then as well. You might manage to get a couple of quid for your old "lump", as there may be someone who is looking for something that he can use. Try your local press, as many of them give free adverts for small items.
I would also ensure that you renew the mountings at the same time, and ensure that your fuel tank is scrupulously clean. Also renew fuel filters (or upgrade primary filtration), as nothing will harm your new engine more than dirty fuel.
Also look at the other thread on this BB regarding looking after your engine.

Good Luck !

 

[graham]

A new engine will increase the desirability and resale value of your boat.

It is usually not possible to get an accurate costing for rebuilding an engine without spending money on removing it and stripping it down to assess the damage.

If it was me I would bite the bullet and go for new if possible.

 

[AndrewB]

The version of this rule I've heard (and used!) is to replace if the repair will cost more than 40% of the CURRENT VALUE (once repaired) of the item, not its replacement cost. That makes it more definite than ever that Mickp should replace.

 

[dickh]

It looks as though you will be better off fitting a new one. You will have a warranty to fall back on and if you get it professionally installed, you will have a guarantee on both the engine and installation - look carefully at the various different makes of engines and also backup and spares situation. Go for a naturally aspirated marinised industrial diesel engine - Nanni; Mitsubishi; Beta or Volvo Penta(although see previous threads re Volvo Penta...). I see from you profile you have a Moody 33, if it is a shaft drive, you might have to have new shaft/prop etc. Take the opportunity to upgrade your stern gland to a non-drip type - ie PPS or Deep Sea Seal. Get al least 3 quotes and compare carefully what each offers. You could save a lot if you can do all or some of the work youself, and you will get to know the engine intimately, always useful in the future - but check carefully warranty if you DIY - you might have to get the installation professionally checked to comply with engine warranties. Good Luck.

 

[Modulation]

Mick

I faced exactly your problem last autumn . I talked to loads of people, got conflicting advice and finally decided based on the advice from the yard (who would have made a packet in labour charges ) to replace. Main arguments were reliability, resale value, and most of all, that wonderful feeling you get from knowing your engine is new! 3 things to consider:
-replace like with like; if you dont labour charges will creep up
-keep the old engine as it will be a useful supply of spares
-you can save up to £1000 if your gearbox is ok by reusing it - I did.
Hopes this helps

Brendan
(

Brendan

 

[luckyjimbo]

I would say, if you decide to replace with a volvo, get your skates on because they will no longer offer a three year parts and labour warranty after end of August, they say they are "coming in line with europe" that probably means one year warranty.
Good luck
Regards
James

 

[jonjo]

As someone who is looking to buy a particular yacht design that will mean taking on ownership of a 25 to 30 year old boat, here is my engine valuation formula.

(1) Disregard any claim about an engine rebuild that is not fully documented.
(2) Documented rebuild in last 5 years = minor plus
(3) New engine last 1-5 years = strong plus
(4) New engine last 6 - 10 year = minor plus
(5) New engine last 11-15 years = natural
(6) Anything older = cost in imminent replacement.
(7) Add 5 years to valuation ranges for a 4-cylinder engine.

 

[mldpt]

All this talk of rebuilding, doesnt seem to have taken into account the condition of the Starter motor, alternator, water pumps, fuel pumps, etc, if your engine is 10 years old most lilely so are they, try buying a Volvo Starter motor, or Alternator, last time I was quoted for an alternator it was £500. and an exchange gearbox for volvo penta 2003 £2000 + vat exchange. On a new engine you get it complete with warranty.
Mike