Reefing downhaul

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insomniac

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Ok I have set up a jiffy reefing system on my Swanson 28. The problem I have is that my main tracks onto the mast using slugs - this means that when I tighten the downhaul, the cringle goes as it should to down level to the boom, but because of the slugs, that small portion of the sail in front of the cringle can't reach the boom - the slugs of the sail act as stoppers - and about 10-15cm of the luff upwards of cringle level remain above the boom instead of reaching the boom. This means the sail kind of "bunches" at the downhaul point, putting an awful lot of tension on that point of the sail (from the downhaul cringle radiating out and along to each of the slugs), which I imagine is most undesirable and could result in tearing the sail. With the 2nd reef the result is even worse (because of the extra slugs). I know I could go up to the mast and hook the cringle onto the gooseneck horn - but I want to stay in the cockpit. Any recommendations to solve this problem (I cant change over to bolt rope luff either)? TIA
 
Remove the relevant mast slide permanently (just above the reef cringle), this should allow you to put in the reef without having to go forward.
On my new Hood main sail the slides are missing at these points. I can put in each of the 3 reefs without having to go forward.
 
On my sail the slides are well either side of the reef cringles, so I can easily pull the cringle down onto the reefing hook without removing any slides.

I'm trying to visualise how that would work with a downhaul line. Your downhaul must come up on one side of the boom and the slides, then pull down on the other side. Is that correct? So when the downhaul is tensioned it "traps" a group of slides under the line.

How about leading the downhaul up and down the same side of the sliders. For example lead it on the port side of the boom, then up the starboard side of all the slugs, then through the cringle headling port back to starboard, then back down on the starboard side again. That should be able to pull the cringle right down to the boom past the stacked sliders.

Does that make sense?
 
Presumably you have a gate or a pin to stop the sliders coming out of the trackwhen you lower the sail. This will mean that when you reef the sliders of the redundant sail remain in the track and so stop the tack from being pulled down to the boom.
You have 2 choices. One is to open the gate or remove the stopper so the slugs of the redundant sail can be set free from the mast track. You have to remember to put them back in and close the gate before lowering the sail or...
Remove the slugs from the parotion of the sail which will be redundant when reefed. If you go in for deep reefs this could leave a lot of luff without slugs.or a combination of the above 2.
I don't think Gandy_Goose prop-osal will help at all if the system is as I imagine e the same as mine but I use a bolt rope. olewill
 
Hope I'm not hijacking this thread but I am interested in the replies which state that they have a bolt rope. I am intending to convert from a roller reefing boom to slab reefing. I have found some sail slugs which would fit into the bolt rope slot which I inted to attach to my sail. Is it possible that I don't need to do this and can keep the normal method of bending on the sail with the bolt rope ? I would have thought that there would be too much friction for the sail to fall under its own weight ?
 
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Hope I'm not hijacking this thread

[/ QUOTE ] To late youv'e done it!
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Is it possible that I don't need to do this and can keep the normal method of bending on the sail with the bolt rope ?

[/ QUOTE ] I converted my main to slab reefing ages ago but kept the bolt rope. I have considered slugs but not in connection with the reefing system. I think whether to have slugs or a bolt rope is down to personal preference. It does seem to fall OK under its own weight.

Convert to slab reefing but do not change to slugs. You can always do that at a later date if you feel it is necessary or desirable
 
The comments about removing slugs from the mast track, to allow the downhaul to work sound a bit defeatist. If you have to go to the mast to pop the sliders out as you lower the sail to reef, why not hook the cringle onto the boom while you're there?

Anyone with working two-line reefing have an answer?
 
Maybe I am not understanding correctly.
I passed the reefing lines through blocks at deck level,through the cringle and backdown onto the gooseneck horn.

This works fine on my boat and my previous.

Going forward to remove slugs from the track sounds odd!!


Tony.
 
One advantage I can see of converting from bolt rope to slides is that when you lower the sail it does not land in a heap on the deck. It's still neatly attached to the mast so no large amounts of flogging sail to contend with when reefing.....just a thought...
 
I have two line reefing on three reefs + Cunningham and they all work fine without any need to remove slugs. My new main (this year) has spectacles fitted to the luff cringles and all my luff reefing pennants go up and down the port side to these. As others have said, it is important not to have a slug fastened to the sail too close to a cringle. With my arrangement I have the opposite problem; if I just keep pulling a luff pennant without looking at what's happening it's possible to pull the sail down below boom level! I know, mark the pennants / haliard but I haven't got round to doing this yet...

With my previous sail I led the pennants up the starboard side, through the cringles and down the port side. This worked fine too, or better even since simply hauling till the pennants got tight brought the cringles down correctly positioned on the top of the boom. Again, no slugs too close, so no problem in pulling the cringle down below the level of the slug stack.
 
Bolt rope is fine for reefing. As the original thread suggests slugs present a problem when reefing. basically the slugs allow the luff to stay attached to the mast track even when the sail is down so making flaking the sail very easy.
However by holding the slugs in the track above the gooseneck the slugs stop the tack from being pulled down to the boom when reefing.
The beauty of the bolt rope is that it comes out without any action when reefing.
You asked about friction. The bolt rope should not present so much friction but must be large enough to not be pulled out of the track when under pressure. A well aligned gooseneck tack attachment and tack down haul ropes will minimise pressure on the bolt rope.
The biggest problem with bolt rope is to get it into the track when hoisting the sail (or unreefinng). You need a feeder or guide of some sort.
I have settled on a device made from 3/16 SS rod about 10cms long welded across a flat piece of SS about 10mm wide 40mm long 1mm thick.
The flat plate is rivetted at each end into the bottom of the track moulding of Al mast. This area of the track will have been cut away for feeding in the sail.
The ends of the rod are tightly curled to make a loop on the ends. The rod comes out of the welded attachment to the plate aft and outwards then is bent back in toward the mast to a point where the loops of the end are about 5mm apart and in far enough to amatch the start of the track. So the loops press on the sail just inside the bolt rope and guide the bolt rope into the track smoothly.
Sorry it is a bit hard to describe. The metal rod is easy enough to bend to get it all to work well. Using this on a big main on 21fter I can hoist the main and after feeding the head of the sail through the guide can haul it up only by the halyard.

So the only disadvantage of using bolt rope is that it is much easier to flajke the main onto the boom with 2 people although one can do it but not very well. The other advantage is that the sail stows flat on the boom without that characteristic heaap of sial up the mast hich is more difficult to cover. olewill
 
Thanks for the feedback - will remove the slugs, though a fair few will have to come out if I want the second reef to work as well. Just wondering whether this will have a detrimental effect on the the sail at the mast. Cheers all for suggestions.
 
Insomniac .. are your reef cringles placed half-way between slugs? Or do they have slugs very nearby? Maybe all you need to do is remove the slugs nearest to the cringles, not all those below them.

On my rig the slugs don't prevent the tack cringle being pulled down, or put any strain on the sail. There is sufficient distance from the cringle to the nearest slugs above and below, so that the cringle can be pulled down to the boom with all slugs still in the track.
 
GG i'm going down to the boat this morning (I'm in Sydney Aust) to service the engine - so I'll take a note of the no. of slugs and distance from cringles. From memory I v'e got slugs roughly every six inches or so (but I could be very wrong). Will check and get back. Thanks!
 
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