Recommendations for a single handed crusier-racer

Phideaux

Phideaux

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Recommendations for a single handed cruiser-racer

I'm looking to acquire a 'project' to work on over the next 9 months (initially) to make seaworthy and I'm looking to short-list boats that most closely meet my desires and pocket. I realise that there will probably need to be significant compromises.

I have £5-7k for the boat before refitting. I’m prepared to spend another £5-7k on essential equipment for coastal sailing and plan to add things for the longer trips (self-steering etc) as funds become available.

I’m competent at woodworking, electrics, plumbing, engine maintenance and have more power tools than Handy Andy. I’m also OK with lathes, milling machines and other engineering workshop kit.

• 70% sailing will be solo and 20% with one other (10% when friends come out for a day).

• 50% will be overnight weekenders with several 5-10 day 'holidays'.

• I'm competitive, so something that could enter events such as Round the Island and would be fun, is more important than sedately cruising.

• I want to get some 'ocean' time, not just coastal hops, as I have an ambition to take a sabbatical from work to sail down to the Falklands (and back) in about 3-5 years time.

• I want to build-in comfort for me (+ occasional girlfriend) so room for decent stove, fridge, heater, hot shower, storage etc and I'm willing to sacrifice berths to get it.

• I’m thinking not less than 30’ and probably not more than 36’.

Possible short-list at the moment includes:
• Dufour Arpege
• Elizabethan 31 or 33
• Pioneer 9
• Trintella 1
• Hustler 30 or 35
• Kingfisher 30s

And yes, I would love to try them all out, done up and rigged for single-handed or short-handed crew, but I suspect these are in short supply.

Should I remove any of the above as not being ocean-worthy or fast/comfortable?

Any additions?

Anybody need a willing hand to work on their boat while I’m looking for my own?
 
Last edited:
On your list there, the odd one out might be the Kingfisher which, from memory, is not as spritely as the rest, mostly steady bilge keelers as I recall.
You might find a reasonable Morgan Giles 30, a fair number where made. Rather more exotic, but a very nice boat, the Kings Cruiser 29 might suit but would be a little on the small side.
On the whole I would look into as many small yards/boat club car parks as I could and evaluate all prospects. After all what matters is not the name of the boat but how it suits you. Example of an out of the way yard which often has a more affordable range:
http://www.boatingworldsw.co.uk/
Alas, I think the Trintella there has sold. I know the boat and it would have suited your brief.
 
The Nicholson 1/2 tonner would be high on my lists of fast boats that would probably be ok offshore.

http://www.yachtsnet.co.uk/archives/nicholson-half-tonner/half-tonner.htm

alternatively, the Sigma 33 - won the last OSTAR however may be a little out of budget

alternatively there is SJ30 on apollo duck at the moment - over buget a £16,500 but may be able to haggle the price down.

Might be worth looking at the Petit bateau website for single handed racing
http://racingatpetitbateau.googlepages.com/racingatpetitbateau for more information...

all the best
 
Phideaux said:
I'm looking to acquire a 'project' to work on over the next 9 months (initially) to make seaworthy and I'm looking to short-list boats that most closely meet my desires and pocket. I realise that there will probably need to be significant compromises.

I have £5-7k for the boat before refitting. I’m prepared to spend another £5-7k on essential equipment for coastal sailing and plan to add things for the longer trips (self-steering etc) as funds become available.

I’m competent at woodworking, electrics, plumbing, engine maintenance and have more power tools than Handy Andy. I’m also OK with lathes, milling machines and other engineering workshop kit.

• 70% sailing will be solo and 20% with one other (10% when friends come out for a day).

• 50% will be overnight weekenders with several 5-10 day 'holidays'.

• I'm competitive, so something that could enter events such as Round the Island and would be fun, is more important than sedately cruising.

• I want to get some 'ocean' time, not just coastal hops, as I have an ambition to take a sabbatical from work to sail down to the Falklands (and back) in about 3-5 years time.

• I want to build-in comfort for me (+ occasional girlfriend) so room for decent stove, fridge, heater, hot shower, storage etc and I'm willing to sacrifice berths to get it.

• I’m thinking not less than 30’ and probably not more than 36’.

Possible short-list at the moment includes:
• Dufour Arpege
• Elizabethan 31 or 33
• Pioneer 9
• Trintella 1
• Hustler 30 or 35
• Kingfisher 30s

And yes, I would love to try them all out, done up and rigged for single-handed or short-handed crew, but I suspect these are in short supply.

Should I remove any of the above as not being ocean-worthy or fast/comfortable?

Any additions?

Anybody need a willing hand to work on their boat while I’m looking for my own?
Click to expand...


I did exactly the same thing but my size criteria was 26-28'. I think your budget may be on the ambitious side for a 30+ footer. That said it is certainly possible to get a 30+ footer ready for a jaunt to the Falklands on 14k me thinks, as long as the boat is a bargain.

My boat (27 footer) cost £9000 and it had a brand new diesel engine with (only 8 hours on it), the rest of the boat was pretty ratted out and I spent about £10000 on her over 12 months, and did all the work myself, the boat was outside my house! That £10,000 included a new paint job, four new sails, self-steering gear, complete rewire (new batteries, everything), all deck hardware renewed (winches, cleats, hatches, tracks and so on), all external joinery replaced. Basically every nut and bolt replaced and kitted out with new GPS and minimal instrumentation (vhf/depth/log/GPS repeater/wind/tiller pilot), new internal woodwork in areas and new upholstery.

So this should give you an idea of costs for renewal, it's expensive and slightly daft, but completely worth it, because you know exactly what's what on your boat. That said it's far cheaper to buy a boat that someone else has done all this work on, because the money spent is never recovered in the selling price of older smallish boats. So if you get a bargain, say a nearly completed project, then you're on.

For your offshore dreams you could easily spend 1500 quid on safety stuff like clothing and liferafts, and EPIRBs and building in redundancy, but you could acquire them over the proving years of coastal sailing.
 
Singlehanded possibles

Your research seems to have produced a pretty reasonable list of possibles, all will have pros and cons. The Pioneer you will find is an excellent seaboat, it is very easy to rig for single handed sailing and certainly well within your budget. The downside will be work required to provide habitability. Certainly most of your list can be achieved but any shower may not be as 'female friendly' as you may wish. PM me if you want more specific info.

Yoda
 
doug748 said:
On your list there, the odd one out might be the Kingfisher which, from memory, is not as spritely as the rest, mostly steady bilge keelers as I recall.
You might find a reasonable Morgan Giles 30, a fair number where made. Rather more exotic, but a very nice boat, the Kings Cruiser 29 might suit but would be a little on the small side.
On the whole I would look into as many small yards/boat club car parks as I could and evaluate all prospects. After all what matters is not the name of the boat but how it suits you. Example of an out of the way yard which often has a more affordable range:
http://www.boatingworldsw.co.uk/
Alas, I think the Trintella there has sold. I know the boat and it would have suited your brief.
Click to expand...

The Kingfisher is a bilge keel and the K30s was designed with increased sail area and 20% more ballast than the standard. Dytiscus III was sailed by Chay Blyth and I understand Dytiscus Rubra (on this forum) is a fine example but I've never seen one in the flesh.

Checked your link to boating world (thanks) and there was no Trintella but there was a nice Legend 34 with a lot of work already done that sold for <£15,000 however can't find much technical data on the Legend 34 - why is it so difficult to get specifications and drawings for yacht makes and models?! I have seen an advert for a Trintella 1 that's been in barn storage for the last 12 years with an asking price of £4.5k
 
Lee_Shaw said:
I did exactly the same thing but my size criteria was 26-28'. I think your budget may be on the ambitious side for a 30+ footer. That said it is certainly possible to get a 30+ footer ready for a jaunt to the Falklands on 14k me thinks, as long as the boat is a bargain.

My boat (27 footer) cost £9000 and it had a brand new diesel engine with (only 8 hours on it), the rest of the boat was pretty ratted out and I spent about £10000 on her over 12 months, and did all the work myself, the boat was outside my house! That £10,000 included a new paint job, four new sails, self-steering gear, complete rewire (new batteries, everything), all deck hardware renewed (winches, cleats, hatches, tracks and so on), all external joinery replaced. Basically every nut and bolt replaced and kitted out with new GPS and minimal instrumentation (vhf/depth/log/GPS repeater/wind/tiller pilot), new internal woodwork in areas and new upholstery.

So this should give you an idea of costs for renewal, it's expensive and slightly daft, but completely worth it, because you know exactly what's what on your boat. That said it's far cheaper to buy a boat that someone else has done all this work on, because the money spent is never recovered in the selling price of older smallish boats. So if you get a bargain, say a nearly completed project, then you're on.

For your offshore dreams you could easily spend 1500 quid on safety stuff like clothing and liferafts, and EPIRBs and building in redundancy, but you could acquire them over the proving years of coastal sailing.
Click to expand...

That's a relleif (up to a point). Obviously, I'd like to find something with a good hull and rigging so I can concentrate on the interior and fitting things like self-steering, wind/solar energy (the little luxuries will be power hungry), good instrumentation, satnav, satcoms etc. Some dead uncle's project that's been sitting under a tarp in the barn for the last 5 years would be good, or perhaps someone's who wants to recover some of their outlay on a project due to loss of interest/new wife/taxman etc.
 
Phideaux said:
The Kingfisher is a bilge keel and the K30s was designed with increased sail area and 20% more ballast than the standard. Dytiscus III was sailed by Chay Blyth and I understand Dytiscus Rubra (on this forum) is a fine example but I've never seen one in the flesh.

Checked your link to boating world (thanks) and there was no Trintella but there was a nice Legend 34 with a lot of work already done that sold for <£15,000 however can't find much technical data on the Legend 34 - why is it so difficult to get specifications and drawings for yacht makes and models?! I have seen an advert for a Trintella 1 that's been in barn storage for the last 12 years with an asking price of £4.5k
Click to expand...
Try yachtsnet for specs. If they've had a boat listed the specs remain on file.
 
Phideaux said:
That's a relleif (up to a point). Obviously, I'd like to find something with a good hull and rigging so I can concentrate on the interior and fitting things like self-steering, wind/solar energy (the little luxuries will be power hungry), good instrumentation, satnav, satcoms etc. Some dead uncle's project that's been sitting under a tarp in the barn for the last 5 years would be good, or perhaps someone's who wants to recover some of their outlay on a project due to loss of interest/new wife/taxman etc.
Click to expand...

A good suit of sails and some ne rigging added £3000 to my spend, I tend not to bother with fancy sat navs/comms, they're too expensive and break too easily but wind generators are great.

The best tip is to go for an unfashionable yet well regarded boat, the Elizabethans on your list would be my first choice, they are available for reasonable money and are proper boats that are worthy of your efforts, also Kingfisher 30 have a really good reputation and are usually reasonably priced.

Also, to keep spend down, if you aimed closer to the 30 foot mark rather than the 36, 36 footer costs loads more to maintain and get bits for than a 30 footer, 30-32 feet is just nice (probably even on the large side but given your longer term intentions a good size) for a first boat for single-handing, bear in mind that a 32 footer with a couterstern is probably just a 30 footer-transom with a bit of waterline added at the stern, I prefer a transom myself for simplicity.
 
Ludd said:
Try yachtsnet for specs. If they've had a boat listed the specs remain on file.
Click to expand...

I've been through the yachtnet archives but I can't find design drawings or layouts, just photos and brief descriptions. I've also looked for various owner's associations (such as the Elizabethan, Dufour, Kingfisher) but the details are surprisingly (to me anyway) sparse.
 
Lee_Shaw said:
Also, to keep spend down, if you aimed closer to the 30 foot mark rather than the 36, 36 footer costs loads more to maintain and get bits for than a 30 footer, 30-32 feet is just nice (probably even on the large side but given your longer term intentions a good size) for a first boat for single-handing, bear in mind that a 32 footer with a couterstern is probably just a 30 footer-transom with a bit of waterline added at the stern, I prefer a transom myself for simplicity.
Click to expand...

Yup, 30-32' was also my first thought, but I didn't want to constrain myself and rule out something larger if one should come along at a bargain price.

At the moment, going purely on what I've read, the Dufour Arpege looks favourite, but I understand that there are often problems with de-lamination of the decking from the core. I've also found a previous thread here http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170079
 
M33 said:
Have you looked at Project Boats in boatsandoutboards? See http://www.boatsandoutboards.co.uk/category/Other/Marine+Projects look like there are couple which may be suitable.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the suggestion and link. Unfortunately, the boats that you've seen there must have ben snapped up as I can't see anything in the 30-36' class, although there is a 40' professionally built steel Yacht- Brasser for £12k which I suspect would be outside my budget for completion and competence for single-handed sailing. Nevertheless, I have bookmarked the site for frequent visits to see what turns up.
 
Phideaux said:
I'd like to find something with a good hull and rigging so I can concentrate on the interior and fitting things like self-steering, wind/solar energy (the little luxuries will be power hungry), good instrumentation, satnav, satcoms etc. Some dead uncle's project that's been sitting under a tarp in the barn for the last 5 years would be good, or perhaps someone's who wants to recover some of their outlay on a project due to loss of interest/new wife/taxman etc.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't worry about 'good rigging' since in your situation I would definately replace all standing rigging anyway before doing serious sailing. IMHO.
 
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