Raymarine Display Intigration

[Kristoria]

Hi, I'm not the best sparks in the business but I can hold my own with most. BUT can anyone help on Raymarine display integration because Raymarine are foxing me with their phraseology and description and I'm sure they know what they are talking about - don't they?
They say that dual position can only be obtained by using the horrendously expensive 'E' Series screens but I have a hunch that I could install a 'C' Series screen at the Nav desk and a simple chart plotter like the Raychart 435 or an even cheaper Garmin 172C at the helm integrating existing ST60 stuff existing at the helm.
1] Am I right to assume it would work or would I still need an 'E' Series screen.
2] I am puzzled by the mapping at the helm, for instance would this say Garmin mapping be reflected at the NavDesk on the 'C' Series screen or would I have to have another set of mapping running the 'C' Series screen as well as the nav desk?
3] If it was a Raymarine plotter at the helm would that mapping function on the 'C' Series screen?
4] Or is my thinking completely muddled and another way would be far simpler and cheaper?

Cheers,
Kristoria

 

[Duffer]

Re: Raymarine Display Integration

The C screen is a stand alone product and cannot be networked. It can of course receive data from GPS etc via Seatalk/NMEA.

 

[Pinnacle]

Duffer is correct. Only E series can be networked.

So, why not have a C series at nav station and put whatever else you like at wheel(s)? You will need two cards ( one for each) but the upside is you have duplicate systems. You can link your vhf/radar and ST 60 instruments to the C series.

Hope this makes sense.

 

[sunquest]

In the case of a flybridge mobo, can you not have an E series on the flybridge and when you want to helm from the saloon transfer it using parallel wiring? Geoff.

 

[fireball]

If you want the 2 chart plotters to mirror each other (eg so a change of waypoint on one is changed on the other) then you will need the networkable display - ie the E series. I believe I right in saying you'd only need one map card for the whole network. It will also integrate data from the seatalk bus (ST instrumentation)

If you just want chart plotting available both at the nav station and cockpit then you can use independent chart plotters - but both would need individual map cards. Both could take information from the NMEA or Seatalk bus.
It is (generally) possible to transfer waypoints, routes & Marks, but this would be a manual process.


So - pretty much what was said above!

 

[peteandthira]

Pinnacle

Your duplication idea is exactly why we didn't bother going for the E series. If your "second" plotter is compatible with the same charts as your C series, you can do all your planning at the main screen, transfer your routes and waypoints using a cable, then whip the chart cartridge out of the main screen and use it at the helm in, say, the very good Raymarine RC400.

Your autopilot should still work because the waypoints and boat position are still active, but you then have the luxury of the "picture" at the helm too.

Obviously, some of the ageing luddites watching will be holding their foreheads and groaning by now!

No, I don't rely on it all honestly! I CAN navigate properly your esteemed worthinesses! I just like the toys!

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Pops

 

[tome]

The E series is the only one which can be networked with a single chart cartridge. We have this setup - an E80 at the chart table and an E120 in the cockpit which allows radar and charting to be accessed from either position

If you want a good deal on E series displays contact Raymarine Service Admin on 02392 693611 ext 2029. They will sell you refurbished E80 for £1227.88 inc vat, E120 £1761.03 inc vat. They come with a 6 month guarantee and are mostly ex demo etc. This brings them within reach of the C series

 

[Duffer]

Re: Raymarine Display Integration

A more considered reply. You can of course have two seperate chartplotters if you want. I would put the better one in the cockpit (especially if you are shorthanded) where it will be more useful with a bigger, brighter screen. You will need two lots of charts and won't be able to network radar or plotting, only instruments if everything is connected via NMEA or e.g. Seatalk.

Cheaper than 2 E screens (or 1 E and 1 C) is to have 1 E and network it to a flatpanel TV/monitor below. It won't be waterproof or daylight visible but it doesn't need to be. You could then view charts, radar etc below but note that this could be quite power hungry if the screen is 15" or more. You can probably network the E screen to a laptop/PC down below but it might be tricky - anyone tried this?

I thought you might find a reply I posted a year ago useful.

"We fitted a fully interfaced suite of Raymarine instruments to our new 35 footer last year. (I looked at getting cheaper stand alone units but it wasn't much cheaper and would have had a lot less functionality.) We fitted a C70 screen interfaced with radar, autohelm, rate gyro and course computer, speed, depth and wind. All are cockpit mounted except for a Raynav 300 fixed GPS over the chart table which provides GPS to the C Screen and also repeats all instrument data (even wind) via Seatalk at the chart table.

We fitted the C screen flush in the cockpit bulkhead under the sprayhood where you get some protection from wind, rain and sun and can sit down while SWMBO or George the autohelm steers. The screen can still be seen from the helm and I would personally NOT fit it on a hoop immediately behind the wheel because:

(a) radar functions in particular are quite fiddly (even though MARPA and chart overlay functions are excellent and simple to use) and the helmsman cannot reliably concentrate on this and avoid lobster pots etc at the same time

(b) it is awkward to reach through/round the wheel to operate the screen

(c) the C screen is not easy to see in direct bright sunlight - under the sprayhood you are more likely to be working in its or your own shadow

(d) you can sit down out of wind and rain

(e) the screen is not vulnerable to being carried away, hoop and all, in a crash gibe if your mainsheet is cockpit mounted.

Note that the screen resolution on the C70 and C80 is the same so unless you want to see it a long way away you can save £400 and have the slightly smaller screen. Having been to the Scillies (twice), the Channel Islands and North and South Brittany since fitting it I am very pleased with our setup. I am particularly pleased we did not fit the C screen below decks as we find it much more useful to have it in the cockpit where we can see it (also why have a small waterproof unit down below instead of e.g. a larger, probably cheaper PC based setup)? We use a Yeoman Plotter with our printed charts down below (connected to a handheld GPS) for the bigger picture and as backup. If it is not practical to flush mount a plotter in the bulkhead my second choice would be on a bracket under the sprayhood though it is a little more vulnerable there.

So (1) radar/plotters preferably with MARPA and chart overlay are excellent and easy to use (and while pricey are much less than they used to be 2 or 3 years ago), (2) IMHO let into the bulkhead or under the spray hood is the best place to mount them on an average sized boat."

Hope this helps.

 

[jwilson]

I'm trying to do exactly the same thing. I want to add a chartplotter display to the helm position of my boat, which already has a Raymarine C70 at the chart table, and a standard set of Raymarine wind/speed/depth/autopilot instruments on a binnacle console. I'd prefer just to have the position overlaid on a chart at the helm, and to continue to set up waypoints and initiate routes at the chart table unit.

Raymarine tell me the C-series is not capable of feeding a second chartplotter, but on opening the GRP moulded console that holds the helm instruments it looks as though I can get NMEA output from the back of the Raymarine ST60 'graphic display', which is fed data via the Seatalk cables.

What I have in mind is to use a small non-Raymarine colour chartplotter with another map cartridge, and use the Raymarine NMEA data to display position, rather than the GPS input from it's own receiver? I'm looking at Standard CP180, Lowrance 3500 etc types - as PBO reviewed recently.

The ideal would be to have a chartplotter at the helm that could be switched between its own GPS receiver and the Raymarine-generated NMEA data, then you could choose between working entirely at the helm, or just using the helm display to show position on a chart, with data input below.

I've spent quite a time trawling the web for answers, and not found anything conclusive.... Given unlimited money I'd just change the Raymarine C70 to a pair of E-series, which do support two displays, but that is just too expensive a luxury.

 

[pvb]

Don\'t really understand...

I don't really understand what you're saying. When you say "What I have in mind is to use a small non-Raymarine colour chartplotter with another map cartridge, and use the Raymarine NMEA data to display position, rather than the GPS input from it's own receiver", whilst this is certainly possible, you wouldn't really expect to see any real difference in the position shown, would you? Similarly, you say "The ideal would be to have a chartplotter at the helm that could be switched between its own GPS receiver and the Raymarine-generated NMEA data, then you could choose between working entirely at the helm, or just using the helm display to show position on a chart, with data input below" - again, the 2 different GPS feeds would surely give an almost identical position, so what would you gain?

Although you can get an NMEA output from the ST60 display, and you can feed NMEA into, for example, a Lowrance 3500, I'm not sure that the Lowrance would show you anything other than position (in other words I don't think it would display waypoint and route information present on the SeaTalk network, even though this info is being outputted in NMEA).

 

[crisjones]

Re: Raymarine Display Integration

A bit more to add to duffer's details.

Raymarine also do a remote keypad unit that can be interfaced into an E series network. This then gives you the possibility of fitting an E series at the helm / cockpit together with a flat screen monitor and this remote keypad at the chart table.

This then allows you to do your planning / waypoints etc at the chart table in the dry and warm. Probably not quite as easy to use as the E series display but certainly a hell of a lot cheaper.

The E series has a VGA (or maybe SVGA) output that you use to connect to the flat screen. Only downside is that the flat screen is merely a repeater so will only display the same as the E display - the keypad will allow you to alter the display but both screens will always show the same data. A network with 2 or more E series displays does allow you to display completey different info on each screen. I doubt this is likely to be a significant problem for most people.

It should also be fairly easy to integrate a laptop into the system - the E series will display PC info via the vga interface as well as the PC displaying E series info - but only one way at a time. So you could put a DVD in your laptop and watch it on the E series in the cockpit.

If you are going to LIBS then have a look at the Multihull World / Broadblue 385 on the pontoons, this has a very good integrated setup along these very lines.

Hope this helps, Chris

 

[Marsupial]

Hi

From what you say the C series Plotter and Radar I have networked on my boat dont work - which is strange because they do. They are connected with the raymarine HSB system which provides radar and chart plotting functions at two positions simultaneously with only one C map card, the ST60 data is also displayed on each position. My system is fed with GPS info via a seatalk GPS so a seatalk/nema interface was required to get nmea to the DSC VHF and Yeoman. It all works OK. In short I think the E series good though it is, is not the only solution.

It sounds like Raymarine are trying to get you to spend some extra cash.

 

[jwilson]

Re: Don\'t really understand...

All I want is display of position on a chart at the helm: I'd still set waypoints and routes at the main unit at the chart table, and I'm not expecting it to show waypoint and route information from the Seatalk network.

The reason for wanting this is that when singlehanded, or short-handed, just when you want to look at the chart (be it paper or electronic) for a few seconds, is exactly when the water around is infested with lobster pot buoys and I don't want to leave the helm to go to the chart table. I've thgought about moving the Raymarine C70 to the helm position, but I'm sure the display isn't truly bright enough for daylight viewing, and anyway I like to be able to set up routes at the chart table with a paper chart for overview, before putting waypoints into the plotter. I tend to set very conservative waypoints and then cut corners en-route if conditions are easy.

 

[pvb]

Still don\'t understand...

Sorry, probably being thick tonight, but I still don't understand why you'd want something which you could switch between its own GPS input and your Raymarine network GPS data. If all you want is the position, a standalone plotter will show you (although you'll need to buy a second set of chart cartridges).

 

[DaveNTL]

[ QUOTE ]
From what you say the C series Plotter and Radar I have networked on my boat dont work - which is strange because they do. They are connected with the raymarine HSB system which provides radar and chart plotting functions at two positions simultaneously with only one C map card, the ST60 data is also displayed on each position.

[/ QUOTE ]

Me too! /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[Kristoria]

So it seems that we agree it is possible - but you haven't given your opinion on economics!

 

[Kristoria]

/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gifYour mindset seems to be as mean and impecunious as my own and what seems apparent to me is that the GPS [nmea] part of the rig will circulate commonly to all. Now is it possible somebody can copy the CF., mapping so that the swapping of memory is not required - then by ipso facto we have as the old rhyme goes "Tom stuck in his thumb and pulled out a [the] plumb. Cheers /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[Kristoria]

Superb information - just what I'm looking for!! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[Kristoria]

Re: Raymarine Display Integration

Certainly does help, llamedos.
The main problem with Raymarine, in fact the only perceptible problem with Raymarine is that purchasing all their kit can prove seriously damaging to your financial health and in fact in many instances may well exceed the value of the boat!!!!!!!

 

[Kristoria]

Dear Marsupial
That is the definitive answer that I was looking for. I now feel that this forum has worked for me to the very best of it's authors intentions.
Raymarine themselves made me ask this question because with a little bit of Northern nouse you say to yourself wires carry current - carry messages therefore if one message or GPSR packet can carry then others must too. Raymarine also, if you care to read their catalogue carefully do not say anywhere it wont work and what they do say is that using the E series screens it will work and I have absolutely no doubt that if the scheme gets super complicated you probably need the E series but for a sailing vessel with ALL normal systems in duplication - ye don't need E series screens Mr., Raymarine. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif