Questioned by RNLI re not wearing lifejacket.

longjohnsilver

longjohnsilver

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Came ashore from our mooring in Dartmouth in our 2.8m RIB and was immediately accosted by local RNLI chap who asked why I wasn't wearing a lifejacket? Was initially somewhat taken aback but answered that it was my choice not to wear one, he countered with did I know about the shock of falling into cold water, didn't like to say that the water in October is warmer than any other time of year. Explained that as a diver I am well aware of water temperatures. With that he then questioned my partner in the same accusatory fashion.
Is this common place? I appreciate all the arguments for wearing a lifejacket but I choose not to and I don't expect to be accosted by the local RNLI. I wasn't sure how I felt as he walked away muttering something or other, not really angry but a little annoyed to be questioned in a fairly aggressive manner. Has not happened to me in 25 odd years of boating, still in 2 minds as to whether he was being a bit of a pr@t or actually trying to help. After speaking to us he didn't hang around to speak to other dinghy crews.
 
We all like to think we have superhuman powers and if we fell in the water we would swim ashore in a macho manner or whatever but the reality is that quite a few of us would die.
 
puddock said:
He obviously didn't instantly recognise you as an experienced diver and seadog.
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Although LJS was on a RIB, which might be a clue that he had some interest and understanding of boating and the issues surrounding boating?

EdBeynon said:
We all like to think we have superhuman powers and if we fell in the water we would swim ashore in a macho manner or whatever but the reality is that quite a few of us would die.
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See this vid. 8 minutes in the RNLI actually suggest a woman jumps in with no thermal protection. Far from strugging she actually talks coherantly to camera.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00vdlt3/Bang_Goes_the_Theory_Series_3_Episode_6/
 
I would assume he's pulled some stiffs out of the water recently who fell in and drowned, not that that excuses him being a rude arse.
 
penfold said:
I would assume he's pulled some stiffs out of the water recently who fell in and drowned
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Remind, me. Nationwide, how many people have died of drowning after falling off pleasure boats in recent years? The odds against this RNLI guy having recovered any stiffs who fell of pleasure boats or even seeing any first hand in future are astronomical.

Perhaps the RNLI should try a few New Years Eve charity swims...
 
EdBeynon said:
We all like to think we have superhuman powers and if we fell in the water we would swim ashore in a macho manner or whatever but the reality is that quite a few of us would die.
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I think thats a fair point and peronally would wear LJ in Dinghy in most circumstances. That said I'm afraid that boating is infested with a group of self important little hittlers - be they safety boat drivers, club committee members or in this case RNLI.

I have to say that I have now got to the stge with this particular rude group of people (in whatever walk of life) of just being equally rude back to them. If I'm not breaking the law then what business is it of any busy body what the hell i do and I can make there experience of sticking their nose in so unpleasant that they don't try and humiliate someone else then I consider it a success.

I'm all for public education of the risks but the RNLI et al need to tread carefully - train their people to be polite and discrete and they might get better results. Obviously I wasn't there but if that chap had said very pleasantly - excuse me but you obviously use boats, can I interest you in a free sea safety session - handed over a leaflet etc he could have got a trained person to spend 1/2 hour talking safety with someone who the RNLI chap felt to be a risk. Far more effective than a dressing down by an ex military type who can't comprehend that someone else may have assessed therisks differently to them.
 
Rescue opt out?

longjohnsilver said:
C I appreciate all the arguments for wearing a lifejacket but I choose not to
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I don't condone the RNLI guy speaking aggressively, but I guess he is inviting you to opt out of being rescued without one?

I, too, wear one sometimes, not all the time, but the message the RNLI transmits these days has struck a chord with me and when out in my boat I wear the LJ more frequently than I once did.

Odd to choose, really, because in my sea-going professional life I'd never have dreamed of ever going afloat in anything under 10 tons without one.

I fear the law will reach us all if we don't volunteer ......
 
The club I sail from (on the lower, tidal Thames), 99% of us wear LJs whenever afloat. The other end of the prom is the rowing club, 99%of whose members don't. The lifeboat station is 50 yards from them. Funny old life.
 
I wear bouancy on my sailing dinks & canoes because I expect to get wet - altho I do try to avoid it mostly these days, but I seldom feel the need on Sea Rush. For foredeck, or at mast work, in bad weather - yes, and with a harness, for rough water (or strong current) dinghy trips, also yes. But most of the time in a nice cosy centre cockpit, or very calm water dinghy trips - I really don't see the need.

As far as I can tell, the vast majority of dangerous falling in/ capsizing incidents happen when people have had a little too much to drink, or are in tiny boats in bad conditions. OK, some are MoB situations often in bad weather or sail handling - but I would probably be wearing one then. In 30 years of sailing I've not yet fallen in except from sailing dinks & kayaks - where it is an occupational hazzard. Would you wear a LJ for walking back to the boat in a marina after a night at the pub? Coz that's where the main risks appear to be.
 
I am really confused on this topic. I wear a life jacket when I feel like I need one. That is not all the time, and it would be spurious to go into what the actual circumstances are when I feel the need, but I like the idea that it is my choice.

On the other hand, I never used to wear a seat belt in my car, and then some time in the 80's I think it was, it was made mandatory. Now I fell naked and irresponsible without one.

If I choose not to wear a lifejacket then someone will suggest that the RNLI should refuse to save me. Will this same group follow through and withold cancer treatment to smokers and heart surgery to those of us with over-voracious appetites?

On balance I am for freedom of personal choice. Tell the RNLI to preach elsewhere.
 
jac said:
I'm all for public education of the risks but the RNLI et al need to tread carefully - train their people to be polite and discrete and they might get better results. Obviously I wasn't there but if that chap had said very pleasantly - excuse me but you obviously use boats, can I interest you in a free sea safety session - handed over a leaflet etc he could have got a trained person to spend 1/2 hour talking safety with someone who the RNLI chap felt to be a risk. Far more effective than a dressing down by an ex military type who can't comprehend that someone else may have assessed therisks differently to them.
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That's probably the approach I'd have expected, not quite sure why this chap decided to speak to us. He wasn't rude but it should have been quickly obvious to him that his interest was not wanted. My partner definitely felt that she'd been "told off", not really acceptable when we were just minding our own business.

And to other posters yes there was a case of a skipper falling overboard his new boat in Darthaven Marina some time ago. Sadly he perished, don't know whether he was wearing a lifejacket or not, and if he wasn't, whether wearing one would have changed whether he survived or not. However I still choose not to wear a lifejacket but wouldn;t wish to persuade others to follow my example.
 
SolentBoy said:
I am really confused on this topic. I wear a life jacket when I feel like I need one. That is not all the time, and it would be spurious to go into what the actual circumstances are when I feel the need, but I like the idea that it is my choice.

On the other hand, I never used to wear a seat belt in my car, and then some time in the 80's I think it was, it was made mandatory. Now I fell naked and irresponsible without one.

If I choose not to wear a lifejacket then someone will suggest that the RNLI should refuse to save me. Will this same group follow through and withold cancer treatment to smokers and heart surgery to those of us with over-voracious appetites?

On balance I am for freedom of personal choice. Tell the RNLI to preach elsewhere.
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Very thought provoking and rings true throughout. I am a fan of the RNLI but often choose not to wear a life jacket. I reserve the right to carry out my own, un-written risk assessment and I also reserve the right to get it wrong. Just glad that I have not been spoken to in that way. Granted that if my life was saved by the RNLI then I would worship them, but I haven't put myself in that position yet.

Wish the OP would say where and when it occured.
 
Motoring down the Upper Tamar from the Boat Jumble at Cotehele, last Saturday afternoon, I passed two gigs in succession ( t'other way ).

I paid rather more attention to the second gig, 'Cream of Cornwall', p'rhaps 'cos it was crewed entirely by girlies.

Not one of them was wearing a lifejacket. Mind you, not one of them looked as if she'd ever need one.....

:D
 
I suspect that many of those who have posted here have not een the effect of coldwater shock. I have, I was casing officer on one of Her Majesty's black messengers of death and we had just secured to a buoy in Rothesay bay and a sailor cocked up opening the battery out board vent, a quite large full diving depth thingy. As a result he as Neddy Seagoon said 'fell in de water'. Within no more than 30 seconds, the time it took to get a safety line round my waist the lad was past fighting and by the time I reached him, less than 60 seconds from him falling in he was fading fast. A salutary lesson for me in the impact of going overboard, and for him in how you open that particular vent.

The clear message is don't go overboard, and in case you do wear a decent lifejacket. Now I don't always wear a lifejacket when in the cockpit on our boat, though I do tend to when on night watch on my own, and I never leave the cockpit at sea without clipping on and work on the basis of always one hand for me and perhaps the other hand for the boat.

Yes it is a personal choice, but in the long run there is a danger that not taking sensible precautions may be fatal. My choice is to limit the risk of me becoming another statistic.
 
Commercially we/I have a risk assessment when a LJ is required to be worn.

I don't always lead by example but rightly or wrongly that is the Skipper's privilege.

However both myself and the engineer/deckie prefer the floatation coats - have the same buoyancy as a lifejacket but far more user friendly.

W.
 
Would you wear a LJ in the Dartmouth water Taxi? A 2.8m RIB is not a tippy tender and LJS is not a doddery newbie, nor was this a rough water trip back from an exposed beach.

Sorry RNLI, I'm a member and have been for over 30 years but if one of your sanctimonious staff said that to me I would be thinking hard about cancelling my subscription.
 
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