QHM Portsmouth Requiring Risk Assessments from Sailing Clubs.

DJE

DJE

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Have any other clubs received an email from QHM recently referring to this notice.

https://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/qhm/portsmouth/leisure/events

QHM definition of “event": any vessel/s, craft or person/s participating in an organised gathering and/ or scheduled activity that may affect the safety of navigation or impact directly or indirectly on any other waterway users on the Dockyard Port of Portsmouth.

The risk assessment template is 17 pages long and looks a bit heavy for a bunch of kids sailing round the buoys in Toppers - or half a dozen yachts on a rally to Lymington for that matter.
 
DJE said:
...The risk assessment template is 17 pages long and looks a bit heavy for a bunch of kids sailing round the buoys in Toppers - or half a dozen yachts on a rally to Lymington for that matter.
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Apart from the length, the layout is appalling. Is that really the best they can do?
 
I wonder if the owners of Bembridge Harbour realise that their waters within the confines of the harbour have now been included in the DPoP which they never have been to my knowledge. I can also see the members of the Seaview Yacht Club jumping up and down at having to submit a RA for every sailing event they organise (not to mention all other sailing clubs in the Eastern Solent).
 
The reality is any club organising an event should carry out a risk assessment, it is common sense. I think the big problem with QHMs form is that it is expected to cover every type of event from the smallest to the biggest. Perhaps the Pompey clubs need to be sensible and get together with QHM and come up with one or two purpose made forms that cover the types of event they will host. That way QHM will get adequate risk assesments, club effort will be optimised and every one
 
maxi77 said:
The reality is any club organising an event should carry out a risk assessment, it is common sense. I think the big problem with QHMs form is that it is expected to cover every type of event from the smallest to the biggest. Perhaps the Pompey clubs need to be sensible and get together with QHM and come up with one or two purpose made forms that cover the types of event they will host. That way QHM will get adequate risk assesments, club effort will be optimised and every one
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This was happening 10 years ago at least.
 
maxi77 said:
The reality is any club organising an event should carry out a risk assessment, it is common sense.
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Yep, we've done that. But I don't see how we will make anything safer by doing it again on QHM's form. Though to be fair he does say that "other formats may be used".
 
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DJE said:
Yep, we've done that. But I don't see how we will make anything safer by doing it again on QHM's form. Though to be fair he does say that "other formats may be used".
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Well for clubs who already do it no it wont make it any safer but poor old QHM has the responsibility of making sure it is done within the Queens Harbour. Way back when I was involved with regatta planning I am sure that we were asked for risk assessments by various organisations over the years. We simply submitted our own form which was always accepted.
 
So the lunatics have now completely taken over the asylum.

'Risk assessment and Method Statement' the most ridiculous phrase of the English language ever conjured up, and a delight to over zealous idiots masquerading as acting in the 'Safe' interests of others, normally to the detriment of any actual enjoyment of any pastime, be it professional or amateur.

Awaiting incoming (from said zealots no doubt !).
 
superheat6k said:
So the lunatics have now completely taken over the asylum.

'Risk assessment and Method Statement' the most ridiculous phrase of the English language ever conjured up, and a delight to over zealous idiots masquerading as acting in the 'Safe' interests of others, normally to the detriment of any actual enjoyment of any pastime, be it professional or amateur.

Awaiting incoming (from said zealots no doubt !).
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+100
 
DJE said:
Yep, we've done that. But I don't see how we will make anything safer by doing it again on QHM's form.
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Don't, then. Assuming yours is reasonably competently done it ought to satisfy their actual need. Just email them a copy of what you're already doing.

Pete
 
Form seems to fail the Hawaiin Dancing Girl Skirt Test. i.e. It should be long enough to cover the essential facts but short enough to be interesting. Otherwise it is just gobbledygook and officious nonsense.
Of course risk assessments to ensure common sense and safety prevail are a requirement that will need to be assessed and recorded but this form seems to indicate to me that there is overemployment in the QHM office if someone has the time to put together 17 pages for a relatively simple task.
 
Kurrawong_Kid said:
there is overemployment in the QHM office if someone has the time to put together 17 pages for a relatively simple task.
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I haven't read it, but it's probably copied and pasted from various other sources, and made longer by throwing in every possible thing that occurred to those involved.

Properly designing an appropriate form (or set of forms for different purposes) would have taken more time than a long one, not less.

Pete
 
prv said:
I haven't read it, but it's probably copied and pasted from various other sources, and made longer by throwing in every possible thing that occurred to those involved.

Properly designing an appropriate form (or set of forms for different purposes) would have taken more time than a long one, not less.

Pete
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Clearly in a port where shipping is regularly active those participating in any sport need to know what to do if sailing in the vicinity of any shipping. The club needs to advise its members & the safety boat crews on a sensible procedure. This is more important in the case of a minor emergency which can soon turn into a tragedy if not dealt with properly. It can only be right that the port checks that clubs are doing this. The only way they can do this is ask for risk assessments. How else can they check?

However, one has to be very careful about " throwing in every possible thing".
If an accident did occur, one of the first thing that happens is that the club would asked for the risk assessment. If they had some thing like ( just a silly example) one safety boat per 2 dinghies & each safety boat manned with 4 people each with a hand held radio & binoculars, then the club would be asked if that did take place & if not why not.

Having prepared the risk assessment the club then has a duty to make sure that all involved knows about it & understands it. That is the hard bit. Just posting a copy on a wall in the safety boat shed or in the secs office is not considered good enough.

So the whole thing goes from being a simple straight forward sport enjoyed by many, that has gone on for years, to a whole can of worms designed to catch the unwary. But you cannot really blame it on the jobsworth in the office.
 
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Try writing a risk assessment on writing a risk assessment, involves using a long sharp instrument, may poke oneself in the eye. Far too dangerous to consider!!!
 
Daydream believer said:
One has to be very careful about " throwing in every possible thing".
If an accident did occur, one of the first thing that happens is that the club would asked for the risk assessment. If they had some thing like ( just a silly example) one safety boat per 2 dinghies & each safety boat manned with 4 people each with a hand held radio & binoculars, then the club would be asked if that did take place & if not why not.

Having prepared the risk assessment the club then has a duty to make sure that all involved knows about it & understands it. That is the hard bit. Just posting a copy on a wall in the safety boat shed or in the secs office is not considered good enough.

So the whole thing goes from being a simple straight forward sport enjoyed by many, that has gone on for years, to a whole can of worms designed to catch the unwary-- for what ???? To justify an income for some jobsworth in an office
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Precisely! Or perhaps to enable insurance companies to find reasons why they should not pay out; and for people to pass the buck or protect their own backsides.
Cans of worms like this or the new data protection legislation will make voluntary Club organisations even more difficult to sustain without themselves employing such penpushers (or should I write keyboard tappers!)..
 
Writing a risk assessment is not difficult, if one applies one's mind to the activities involved. One only has to show that the perceived risks have been considered & assessed in importance. Then state how each risk is to be managed.
Risk assessment is not unreasonable & generally most clubs do it anyway, but have not thought about putting it into prose.
Where they might fall down is conveying that to everyone involved in such a way that everyone acts in a structured manner; rather than run around, each with their own agenda
Provided the assessment is done sensibly, in the event of an accident, a risk that could not have been foreseen will not result in the club being unfairly penalised
 
Writing a risk assessment is not difficult, if one applies one's mind to the activities involved. One only has to show that the perceived risks have been considered & assessed in importance. Then state how each risk is to be managed.
Risk assessment is not unreasonable & generally most clubs do it anyway, but have not thought about putting it into prose.
Where they might fall down is conveying that to everyone involved in such a way that everyone acts in a structured manner; rather than run around, each with their own agenda
Provided the assessment is done sensibly, in the event of an accident, a risk that could not have been foreseen will not result in the club being unfairly penalised
 
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