Proud owner of a new yacht need some help please

FFS! Start with the hull you have. If built from drawings there will be rig details included. Change them at your peril if are not expert.

There should be a pad on the coachroof where the mast is meant to go, there should also be strong point at the bow & at each side of the hull exactly in line with where the mast goes and another (possibly two) at the stern. They will define the basic fixing points for your rig - again THESE MUST NOT BE CHANGED unless you are an expert.

If you have no drawings, you can use these dimensions to help you select possible used rigs. BUT, you have to get the balance right between the jib & main if using Bermudian, so you will need to research & understand rig design. Even if you get something close, you will need to identify lee & weather helm & know how to correct them.

You still haven't said what her keel design or ballast ratio is & they can have a big impact on the rig design. An outboard could cost you 4k, the rig another 4 plus another 4k for sails & fittings. Your budget is extremely tight.
 
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Searush said:
there should also be strong point at the bow & at each side of the hull exactly in line with where the mast goes and another (possibly two) at the stern.
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Being a lightweight 19 footer, it could well be a three-wire dinghy-style rig.

Pete
 
prv said:
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Being a lightweight 19 footer, it could well be a three-wire dinghy-style rig.

Pete
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True, but OP has given no info about keel/ ballast, and anyway there is no way anyone can advise on a rig until the relevant hull design details are known. It could even be set up for an unstayed wing rig or freedom rig.

He could try a kite or a windmill to prop arrangement too. :cool:

Plenty of choices, he just needs to find out the facts doesn't he?
 
Rig design

If I were in your position I would speak to a reputable sailmaker (preferably several) a good sailmaker who will understand power, balance, aerodynamics etc. will be able to help you with the rig design much better than a rigger who specializes more in the structural aspects. You are going to be spending quite a bit so will need to find the right adviser, you are unlikely to get all the expertise you will need from the forum???
You will need sails anyway so an enthusiastic sailmaker will enjoy starting from basics with the rig design, he should also be able to recommend suitable standard components which you might get secondhand, though there are a lot more mastless sailboats than boatless masts in sound condition.
 
Any chance of a photo or two of this boat, next time you get your hands on it?

Might help people here give useful suggestions (not that those so far haven't been!)

Pete
 
Rigging a 19ft boat

I love my fractional rig on my 21fter. The mast is just under 27ft and the boom is about 10ft. So extrapolate down. (that is a large rig for boat size)
I would suggest you go for fractional rig. This means that the mast is more forward than a mast head rig and so the jib is smaller while main is bigger. You will of course need a mast support in the cabin to take the loads of the mast. With much more design involved you might benefit by a horseshoe shaped support under the mast so access is easier to the forecabin down the middle but remember mast down loads are huge.
A fractional rig means no inner forestay (or baby stay) which makes tacking much easier. It does require that you have stout aft swept spreaders and chain plates for the cap shrouds and intermediate stays that are well aft of abeam the mast. You will need a backstay which is adjustable for mast bend.
Don't be fooled by those who say they don't want to race. A boat that performs well will be a joy to cruise regardless.
You will need a mast step on the cabin top to facilitate mast raising and lowering. Don't even think about climbing the mast of a small boat.
I would suggest that you start searching for second hand mast and sails. A rig off a large dinghy could be very suitable. Sails can be fairly easily cut down to fit the mast. The choice of boom should depend on the mainsail you get. A tapered mast can reduce weight aloft looks sharp and can be made to bend easily.
The actual area of the sails and height of the rig is a variable thing. For good performance in light winds you want a tall large rig. However that means that as soon as the wind comes up you must be reefing and reducing jib area. (I would not buy a furler for the jib but I know I am in the minority here) Just get an old dinghy jib of suitable size for stronger winds. For a really seaworthy boat shorter rig smaller sails will be much easier though you will still want good reefing. Do buy new rigging wire though. It dies of old age.

As said much depends on the ballast and keel arrangements as to what sized rig you need. A light boat = smaller rig. It all seems like a fun project to an experienced sailer. So ask lots of people and keep your eyes out for second hand gear. Some dinghy sailors replace gear and sails every season. Others like Sydney 18ft skiff sailors have 3 rigs (sails mast boom etc) chosen on the day according to wind strength. good luck olewill
 
Not exactly on your doorstep but the Chandlery Barge at Bursledon keeps a good deal of used and new, but superceded chandlery ;nuts ,bolts, and ropes at prices less than full for the new items. Used to be called Aladdins Cave chandlery barge. You may also find a mast or two that would be suitable and the rigging shop at Deacons but a stone's throw away, as are the full chandleries of Yachtmaill and Force4. No connection with any of these but found all of them handy to compare prices and alternatives.
I'd check the chandleries first for fittings, then go to the barge to compare the prices.

Oh and the pub is handy too.!

For secondhand sails Seateach have a good reputation and selection, and Crusader for quality and price/delvery on new ones, even some of the Chinese firms but you'll need accurate measurements to be taken,and detailed requirements,batten type foot type(loose or slotted in the boom,reefing points and cringles with pendants, type of jib furler and luff length etc etc.

You'll also need money or another wealthy friend.





ianat182
 
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19ft Boat

Just a further thought. The boat itself needs to be seaworthy for long voyages as in cross channel. You haven't said but it must have a sealed cockpit and the ability to self drain quickly. In other words you need to be able to lay the mast in the water (heeled over) with no water entering the hull and water entering the cockpit able to drain away quickly.
Many traditional wooden boats were essentially open in that water into he cockpit went into the bilges. Whilst many remarkable long voyages were made in these boats. Times and safety expectations have changed. (life is more precious)
You will find that well designed and built the boat will withstand almost any storm. The problem is that the crew are usually not so tough and a smaller boat is hard to survive in. Anyway hopefully you will get experience slowly and find your own limitations regarding time in rough seas.
Regarding mast and rigging. A little 18ft boat near mine has what might be described as a fractioanl rig but more like a masthead rig. The cap shrouds and forestay go to near the mast top (about 1ft down) There is a backstay to the top and both cap shrouds and intermediate shrouds go to near square to the mast base.
This means there is no support for the middle of the mast in the fore and aft direction(no inner forestay) however due to short mast and largish mast section in the fore and aft dimension the mast seems OK.
Support for the middle in the fore and aft direction will however make the while rig more robust.
good luck olewill
 
Thanks for all the info, just so everyone knows I'm not a novice sailor and know what im doing (well most of the time ;) ) so im not someone who has gone out been given a yacht and have no clue what im doing and going to crash into everything out there :D I may be slightly mad but I try not to question my sanity too often :o but I must say having never owned my own yacht and only ever being crew its a bit of a step up. Cheers all
 
William_H said:
Regarding mast and rigging. A little 18ft boat near mine has what might be described as a fractioanl rig but more like a masthead rig. The cap shrouds and forestay go to near the mast top (about 1ft down) There is a backstay to the top and both cap shrouds and intermediate shrouds go to near square to the mast base.
This means there is no support for the middle of the mast in the fore and aft direction(no inner forestay) however due to short mast and largish mast section in the fore and aft dimension the mast seems OK.
Support for the middle in the fore and aft direction will however make the while rig more robust.
good luck olewill
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Interesting.

I know very little about the different forms of rigging, but my little 18ft 6" boat only has a single forestay and backstay from the top of it's (approximately) 22 ft mast. Are you saying this is wrong? as far as I know that''s how it's been since it was built.
 
If it's a one off design you may find that putting the mast in the correct place for getting her balanced whilst sailing, the biggest challenge.
Many boats have had minor changes in their early days of production. The Twister for one, had a few mast and boom legths during it's years to try and improve things.
I have a masthead rig nearly a metre taller than the early Twisters yet only a small amount taller than the most common of the later rigs. I know of only one Twister with a fractional rig which sails very well.
The most critical position to get right I reckon, is that in relation to fore and aft.
You are likely to get too much of either lee helm or weather helm if you get it wrong.
Therefore, to compensate, the taller mast would allow you to reef the main to compensate if it needs it, or a roller reefed 150% genoa would give you the flexibilty to get that right.
 
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Right been over to my yacht today, found out she is designed for a 7/8th rig. 8 foot beam, 18 foot length. Daggerboard will weigh 250 ish pounds (if that is what you are after?) I can make it heavier or lighter, need to work it all out. As Im not racing maybe heavier will be better?
 
If they know it's 7/8ths (a performance rather than cruising rig) then there will be full dimensions for the sails, mast & boom. There will be drawings showing stay & shroud locations & lengths.

You will need all this even if you decide to buy a second hand rig as it will still need to approximate the designed rig if it is to sail reasonanbly well.
 
Searush, is there anyway I can go for a cruising rig instead or do I have to stick to the design parameters? Thanks for all your help and everyone else's help :)
 
Foster's said:
Right been over to my yacht today, found out she is designed for a 7/8th rig. 8 foot beam, 18 foot length. Daggerboard will weigh 250 ish pounds (if that is what you are after?) I can make it heavier or lighter, need to work it all out. As Im not racing maybe heavier will be better?
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If it's any help to you, that sounds very similar in size to my boat which is:
LOA 18ft 6"
LWL 16ft
Beam 8ft
Draft 1ft 8" (keel up)
Displacement 1450 lbs
Ballast 525lbs (lead lifting keel)

My boat has a mast approximately 22ft tall, and was specified as having a sail area of 150 square feet.

I don't know enough about rigging to give mine the correct technical term, but it has a forestay, a backstay and two shrouds (via spreaders) from the top of the mast, and two further shrouds from just below the spreaders straight down.

I'm not saying that is how your boat should be set up, but will give you a guide.
 
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ProDave said:
If it's any help to you, that sounds very similar in size to my boat which is:
LOA 18ft 6"
LWL 16ft
Beam 8ft
Draft 1ft 8" (keel up)
Displacement 1450 lbs
Ballast 525lbs (lead lifting keel)

My boat has a mast approximately 22ft tall, and was specified as having a sail area of 150 square feet.

I don't know enough about rigging to give mine the correct technical term, but it has a forestay, a backstay and two shrouds (via spreaders) from the top of the mast, and two further shrouds from just below the spreaders straight down.

I'm not saying that is how your boat should be set up, but will give you a guide.
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That's a masthead rig rather than 7/8ths. and sail area is likely (tho not definitely) to be for cruising. His biggest issue is the balance between the jib/genoa and the main which will affect the mast mount position & boom length. Get that wrong & the boat may have dangerous lee helm or be so hard headed it can't be steered in winds over F3. He NEEDS the design measurements to get it even close.

Or he can use the designers' drawings to work out the Centre of Linear resistance (CLR) for the hull & then design a rig that, for a similar sail area to yours, has a mast position that fits the strong points in the hull design & has a Centre of Effort (CE) slightly leading the hull CLR.
 
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