purplerobbie
Well-Known Member
Would it be possible to fiberglass over the leaky teak decks on my boat?
Or would you have to rip them all off?
Rob
Or would you have to rip them all off?
Rob
Possible to fiberglass over teak decks?
- Thread starter purplerobbie
- Start date
oldsaltoz
Well-Known Member
G'day Robert,
Yes you can glass teak, however it must be dry and oil free, then there is the risk of water ingress later.
Removing it should not be too big a job with the right equipment though.
Let us know what you decide to do and we have some more advice.
Avagoodweekend......
Yes you can glass teak, however it must be dry and oil free, then there is the risk of water ingress later.
Removing it should not be too big a job with the right equipment though.
Let us know what you decide to do and we have some more advice.
Avagoodweekend......
purplerobbie
Well-Known Member
I know the ply under the teak is going to be rotten thats why i thought it might be easier to just glass over the lot?
If i was to take the teak off which dosent look to bad i'm sure i would have to take the ply off then i would probably end mauling with the the beams and beam shelf.
This picture was taken when i was refitting the screw plugs
If i take all the teak off i would then have to refit all the hatches and the wood work around them inside. It would be far eaiser to glass over the whole lot.
Rob
If i was to take the teak off which dosent look to bad i'm sure i would have to take the ply off then i would probably end mauling with the the beams and beam shelf.
This picture was taken when i was refitting the screw plugs
If i take all the teak off i would then have to refit all the hatches and the wood work around them inside. It would be far eaiser to glass over the whole lot.
Rob
BAtoo
Well-Known Member
Its possible but difficult to achieve good seal; wont cure the rot, cost and weight alot & I suspect will look pretty awful.. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
ccscott49
Well-Known Member
Dont do it, the teak will move, crack the fibreglass and ypou will still have the lkeaks, if theres rot there, all you will achieve is encapsulating the rot and it will still continue underneath, it all needs to come off if you want ply and glassed decks.
ctelfer38
Well-Known Member
How leaky? Your picture seems to show a deck which is more than serviceable. How thick is the teak? Strikes me that locating the leaks and dealing with them would be far less work than your plan to lay fibreglass. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
Csail
N/A
Or overlay with Tekdeck or whatever its called?
purplerobbie
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
How leaky? Your picture seems to show a deck which is more than serviceable. How thick is the teak? Strikes me that locating the leaks and dealing with them would be far less work than your plan to lay fibreglass. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
Quite leaky. i think most of the problems are under the teak and i have been told it is more or less impossible to lift it repair whats under it then put it back down.
If i was to rip it all off and start again instead of using ply could you use that nylon stuff they make chopping boards out of?
Could you get that in big enough sheets? It would have to last better than ply?
Rob
How leaky? Your picture seems to show a deck which is more than serviceable. How thick is the teak? Strikes me that locating the leaks and dealing with them would be far less work than your plan to lay fibreglass. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
Quite leaky. i think most of the problems are under the teak and i have been told it is more or less impossible to lift it repair whats under it then put it back down.
If i was to rip it all off and start again instead of using ply could you use that nylon stuff they make chopping boards out of?
Could you get that in big enough sheets? It would have to last better than ply?
Rob
tillergirl
Well-Known Member
I have been in exactly your situation. 1" teak over 1/4" ply. Recaulking the seams lasted no time at all. In the end I bit the bullet and lifted the deck. I was very glad I did as there was substantial unseen damage to beams and gunn'le. If I had left it, TG would eventually have died. As it is a new deck - high quality sapele marine ply glassed over has both stiffened her up and made her dry.
Whilst I respect the advice of oldsaltoz who is immensly knowledgeable and I would say he is right, you can do it, I would be advising caution saying you can do it if you get all exactly right. However, having experienced TG with her new deck, I am certain that it has stiffened her up considerably (and that hasn't been a problem) which suggests to me that with the old teak deck she was very flexible. And that flexibility will not help what is always going to be a difficult adherence twix glass and teak - simply because of the qualities of the teak. My teak - some of it still in the shed is still oily after 44 years. Why was she flexible and why did repeated re-caulking of the old deck fail? Because the deck was fastener back in the 60's with steel screws. Over the years with water ingress some had failed providing further access for water and increased opportunity for the seams to work.
So off came the deck. I intended to remove the teak for refixing but discovering that a single screw removal without damaging the teak took nearly two hours a screw, I realised that I could not continue that way and had to remove the teak by using a hole saw to drill out each screw. Once I had done that the damage to ply substrate beam shelf and half beams was apparent. I have the awful pictures to show.
It was immensely depressing to replace the deck and I miss the quality of a real one but I am sure that the high quality ply deck is a much better proposition for me. I could go on but I think you are beginging to come to the same conclusion. The deck has to be lifted! Took me a year but it was well worth doing it.
Whilst I respect the advice of oldsaltoz who is immensly knowledgeable and I would say he is right, you can do it, I would be advising caution saying you can do it if you get all exactly right. However, having experienced TG with her new deck, I am certain that it has stiffened her up considerably (and that hasn't been a problem) which suggests to me that with the old teak deck she was very flexible. And that flexibility will not help what is always going to be a difficult adherence twix glass and teak - simply because of the qualities of the teak. My teak - some of it still in the shed is still oily after 44 years. Why was she flexible and why did repeated re-caulking of the old deck fail? Because the deck was fastener back in the 60's with steel screws. Over the years with water ingress some had failed providing further access for water and increased opportunity for the seams to work.
So off came the deck. I intended to remove the teak for refixing but discovering that a single screw removal without damaging the teak took nearly two hours a screw, I realised that I could not continue that way and had to remove the teak by using a hole saw to drill out each screw. Once I had done that the damage to ply substrate beam shelf and half beams was apparent. I have the awful pictures to show.
It was immensely depressing to replace the deck and I miss the quality of a real one but I am sure that the high quality ply deck is a much better proposition for me. I could go on but I think you are beginging to come to the same conclusion. The deck has to be lifted! Took me a year but it was well worth doing it.
pcatterall
Well-Known Member
I think you have to bite the bullet!! If the subdeck is gone and there is rot starting in any beams you will just be covering it up. Any flexing under the teak may weaken the adhesion of the grp skin.
I was able to lift my teak, fit a new epoxied ply subdeck repair the small structural problems ( glad I did it then!!) and relay the teak. One mistake was too rescrew the teak, I should have epoxied it down.
Like me you may be able to do the job in bits, I did the foredeck first so that the only overlap was at the sides of the coach house. Then I did the afterdeck.
My forededeck took 8 days of solid work spread over a couple of winter months.
Good luck!! but wouldnt that teak look good especially in the knowledge that it was stuck down over a completly waterproof sub deck and on good solid beams??
I was able to lift my teak, fit a new epoxied ply subdeck repair the small structural problems ( glad I did it then!!) and relay the teak. One mistake was too rescrew the teak, I should have epoxied it down.
Like me you may be able to do the job in bits, I did the foredeck first so that the only overlap was at the sides of the coach house. Then I did the afterdeck.
My forededeck took 8 days of solid work spread over a couple of winter months.
Good luck!! but wouldnt that teak look good especially in the knowledge that it was stuck down over a completly waterproof sub deck and on good solid beams??
rogerdog
Well-Known Member
Teak looks lovely -but take you point regarding leaks etc. My advice would have to be in the pull it off and repair it properly camp. If thee is rot present in the ply -what other rot may also be starting.
Just encasing it in fibreglass would give a quick fix COSMETIC solution, but would not be any repair at all. Any moisture trapped (and the chance of a 100% waterproof seal around everything is unlikely) will just cause the wood under the glass fibre to rot like mad in a nice, poorly ventilated, moist area.
Bite the bullet and do the job properly.
Just encasing it in fibreglass would give a quick fix COSMETIC solution, but would not be any repair at all. Any moisture trapped (and the chance of a 100% waterproof seal around everything is unlikely) will just cause the wood under the glass fibre to rot like mad in a nice, poorly ventilated, moist area.
Bite the bullet and do the job properly.
Scarron
Well-Known Member
Why not try Coelan?
Rather than glassing it all in, why not sand it all well then Coelan over the lot, they claim it is ideal for going over decks, waterproof, breathable, long lasting, repairable, non slip etc.
I have only used it so far on mast, grabrails etc but am impressed so far. It easily outperformed the other finishes in a recent classic boat test and although expensive would be much cheaper in labour terms etc. there are also new alternatives appearing.
Depends I suppose, if the ply underneath is still structurally sound or not. could perhaps buy you 5-10 years with the upside of having a super looking teak deck.
Rather than glassing it all in, why not sand it all well then Coelan over the lot, they claim it is ideal for going over decks, waterproof, breathable, long lasting, repairable, non slip etc.
I have only used it so far on mast, grabrails etc but am impressed so far. It easily outperformed the other finishes in a recent classic boat test and although expensive would be much cheaper in labour terms etc. there are also new alternatives appearing.
Depends I suppose, if the ply underneath is still structurally sound or not. could perhaps buy you 5-10 years with the upside of having a super looking teak deck.
ccscott49
Well-Known Member
Are you serious? Plastic chopping board material? This is a troll surely. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
bigwow
Well-Known Member
Vetus sell something similar to this as an alternative to marine ply.
purplerobbie
Well-Known Member
No Really.
I was given some as backing material for a skin fitting by dickies of bangor. It wont absorb water it will last more or less forever and it is very easy to work with.
Anything i fit now i use this stuff but i dont know if it is available in large sheets?
If i was going to pull off the decks and the ply i'll be looking towards using this stuff. It is heavy but a couple of thin layers or even one thick layer has to weight less than the teak and soggy ply.
I couple of thin layers of cloth over the top and you could get a really good finish. Dont know how well epoxy would stick to it though?
Rob
I was given some as backing material for a skin fitting by dickies of bangor. It wont absorb water it will last more or less forever and it is very easy to work with.
Anything i fit now i use this stuff but i dont know if it is available in large sheets?
If i was going to pull off the decks and the ply i'll be looking towards using this stuff. It is heavy but a couple of thin layers or even one thick layer has to weight less than the teak and soggy ply.
I couple of thin layers of cloth over the top and you could get a really good finish. Dont know how well epoxy would stick to it though?
Rob
oldsaltoz
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
No Really.
I was given some as backing material for a skin fitting by dickies of bangor. It wont absorb water it will last more or less forever and it is very easy to work with.
Anything i fit now i use this stuff but i dont know if it is available in large sheets?
If i was going to pull off the decks and the ply i'll be looking towards using this stuff. It is heavy but a couple of thin layers or even one thick layer has to weight less than the teak and soggy ply.
I couple of thin layers of cloth over the top and you could get a really good finish. Dont know how well epoxy would stick to it though?
Rob
[/ QUOTE ]
No epoxy will not to it.
No Really.
I was given some as backing material for a skin fitting by dickies of bangor. It wont absorb water it will last more or less forever and it is very easy to work with.
Anything i fit now i use this stuff but i dont know if it is available in large sheets?
If i was going to pull off the decks and the ply i'll be looking towards using this stuff. It is heavy but a couple of thin layers or even one thick layer has to weight less than the teak and soggy ply.
I couple of thin layers of cloth over the top and you could get a really good finish. Dont know how well epoxy would stick to it though?
Rob
[/ QUOTE ]
No epoxy will not to it.
purplerobbie
Well-Known Member
Why?
Rob
Rob
bigwow
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Why?
Rob
[/ QUOTE ]
Epoxy will not key to it. Vetus sell special adhesive for use with the plastic boards they sell.
Why?
Rob
[/ QUOTE ]
Epoxy will not key to it. Vetus sell special adhesive for use with the plastic boards they sell.
purplerobbie
Well-Known Member
probably wouldnt be any better than what i have if i couldnt seal it?
Rob
Rob
oldsaltoz
Well-Known Member
G'day again Rob,
Why not pick the area with the worst leak under it (or a section of soft deck), pull the teak off and have a look at just how much ply has been damaged. It may be just a case or replacing a few small sections of ply, not the whole deck.
It would seem to me that you are going to have to remove some if not all of the teak if only to find out what the extent of the damage is.
As others have said, making the deck watertight now is throwing money away, because the rotting will continue and the deck will get worse.
Don't forget the deck is part of the vessels integral strength, if compromised you may have a major structural failure to deal with.
Avagoodweekend......
Why not pick the area with the worst leak under it (or a section of soft deck), pull the teak off and have a look at just how much ply has been damaged. It may be just a case or replacing a few small sections of ply, not the whole deck.
It would seem to me that you are going to have to remove some if not all of the teak if only to find out what the extent of the damage is.
As others have said, making the deck watertight now is throwing money away, because the rotting will continue and the deck will get worse.
Don't forget the deck is part of the vessels integral strength, if compromised you may have a major structural failure to deal with.
Avagoodweekend......