Portland Bill

[Guest]

Hello, I know this is no big deal for all you serious sailors but in June we will be sailing our Hillyard 9t from Brixham back to Chichester. Does anyone have any thoughts on rounding Portland Bill, or indeed any other tips.
Thanks.

 

[tony_brighton]

The Shell Channel Pilot covers it quite nicely. Approaching from the West after crossing Lyme Bay, you cannot guarantee to arrive for the inshore passage at the right time (there is a narrow window). Best to aim for 3-4 miles offshore with the tide in your favour (more if the weather is strong).

 

[Col]

There is a shallow area 1ml? S.E. of the light, beware of overfalls.

 

[jamesjermain]

If you don't know the inshore passage, would go at least five miles south in anything other than a calm and 15 miles in winds of Force 5 or more, specially if the wind was in the east. Time your approach to pick up the new flood while you are still an hour or two west of the Bill. This will give you a good sling-shot passed the point and on past Anvil before the next turn. Then you have to decide whether to go north or south of the Island.

I would tend to take the south route, specially if there was any danger of breaking sea over the Bridge off the Needles, and also if I was starting from 15 miles south of Portland. The Solent at night can be trying on the nerves if you don't know the buoys.

Have a good passage

JJ

 

[rogerroger]

It tends to be a little more tricky going this way as you've got the long haul across Lyme Bay from Brixham first - you'll be against the tide leaving Brixham so make sure you take this into account.

You could break the journey with a stop in Lyme Regis if you can take the ground or have a shallow enough draft to use the visitors buoys (and the stomach to handle the swell!).

I'd say if you've got any doubts, motor sail just to get round it as soon as possible, staying at least 5 miles off shore.

I did it last year in my little 27 footer so you should have no probs.

If you're going straight to Chi then you might want to stay south of the IOW to avoid the Needles Channel which can be tricky - but then you'll miss out on Yarmouth, Lymington, Cowes etc which are all good places to stop.

... and make sure you say hi once you arrive at Chi !

Roger Holden
www.first-magnitude.co.uk

 

[Twister_Ken]

Almost certainly inshore passage.

Every time I've been around it from the west it's been close enough to see the features on the faces of the anglers on the beach.

Do it with the tide under you. Coming from the west, don't aim for the lighthouses, but for a point about half way along the 'island' until the last ten minutes or so. The southerly set along the Chesil will lift you out to the Bill anyway. There's smoothish water for a good couple of hundred yards off the beach.

Only in wind over tide (force 4 plus) would I bother with the offshore passage - unless of course there are other reasons for being offshore. But as I have generally wanted to get into Weymouth for the night, after leaving Dartmouth or Torbay in the morning, there aren't usually passage planning reasons for me to be further offshore.

The other good reason for this is that you'll have contra-tide for a good part of the trip, and the currents in Lyme Bay are generally less fierce than further out in the channel.

Good luck with the trip

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Twister_Ken on Thu Feb 14 10:31:58 2002 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[rogerroger]

Re: Almost certainly inshore passage.

what about the dreaded lobster pots ? are they as numerous as some say on the inshore passage?

is there a depth contour to follow to know you're the right distance off

Roger Holden
www.first-magnitude.co.uk

 

[Twister_Ken]

Re: Almost certainly inshore passage.

As the pot bobbers are dragged under, who knows?

The beach is a pretty good depth contour - it goes down very steeply, although there are some very substantial bricks just off it. Roughly speaking I work on the principle that if I'm far enough off for boys on the beach not to hit me when they throw stones, that's about right.

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Twister_Ken on Thu Feb 14 11:11:08 2002 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[oldharry]

Re: Almost certainly inshore passage.

First time I rounded the Bill via the inshore passage - all battened down, harnesses, life lines, kids wedged in their bunks etc; got there - flat calm, and some old boy swanning around in a rowing boat. Dads stock as a Skipper took a downturn that day.

Last time I took the IP (heading in for Weymouth), we came across from Lyme , arriving much too soon as the wind had huffed up to a solid SW 5 (f/cast promised 2 - 3), and had to hang around for ages waiting for the tidal 'window'. We were mighty glad we did wait as on the west side we met a vicious sea, which appeared to be full of deep holes that the boat kept falling into! ' Now I don't think you want to do that....'

Problem is, having committed ourselves to the inshore passage, it would have been a long hard haul to beat back out round the western edge of the race and round outside. Wisdom after the event dictates next time I will set a course to do that if the weather shows any signs of misbehaviour.

Going round outside the I.O.W you need also to ensure you can make it clear north of Bembridge Ledge before the tide turns - there is a hefty current running south and west round the outside, both ways, and the area round St Catherines can kick up quite a nasty sea - just as the Needles Channel does on a foul tide.

Bear in mind the option of entering the Solent by the North Channel close under Hurst Spit as a rough weather alternative to the Needles Channel. Still requires care, but generally easier going than coming in past the Bridge. But read up on 'The Trap' just off Hurst Castle - you can get very wet indeed just there (voice of experience).

Also further west, remember that St Albans can give you a quite lively time when you neither want nor expect it to. Hillaire Belloc in 'The Cruise of the Nona' wrote: 'When you have just been through Portland you hardly notice St Albans.... But off St Albans Head you run into a piece of water which has no rules' 'St Albans race is a sentient thing. It knows all about you, and whether in its heart it only desires to play, or whether it has a wickeder mind, a mind it certainly has.'

'....(just as) we thought to have thus escaped, even as we thought we had passed it, (italics) the thing ran at us ... just like a lot of dogs running up to play. It was abominably conscious and alive. It has said here is a boat that thinks it can escape me... so it galloped up all in a rush and swarmed all around us , and we were in for an hour of it'

However he concludes 'in truth it is only an annoyance'

Like Hillaire, I have learned the hard way to pay respect to that stretch of water so that nowadays it usually lets me pass unhindered.

But not always!

But a mind of its own it most certainly has, unlike Portland which clearly is obeying the greater forces of wind and tide.

 

[Guest]

When I was in the Portland Frigate flotilla, we used to have to go to the assistance of quite a few yachts caught in the race. generally, if you do not have any local knowledge and you are on a long passage, stay well out, a good 15 nm. It adds very little to a passage up channel and it gives you a quieter and mor relaxing ride.

If you wish to go into Weymouth Bay, pass close inshore off the |Bill and take the passage inside the Shambles. In fine weather that is.

William Cooper

 

[LadyInBed]

Re: Kens good advice

Kens advice is very good.
Going W to E and into Weymouth, aim to get to PB at HW Dover +5. (that’s slack water) (The W going slack on the Bill is HW Dover –1)

For passage purposes forget local HW/LW.

If you are more than throwing distance off then you are too far off.

The only rock to watch for is off Grove Point (that’s the farthest E point on Portland).

If its blowing >4/5 from the East, depending on bottle, take the long way around.

You will be OK with stronger W /SW winds, as you will soon be in the lee of the Bill. You might get a big following swell, but that is just character building!

 

[rogerroger]

St Albans

Interesting stuff, I think I'll copy that, stick it in Word, print it and stick it in my pilot book - if that's OK with you !

Interesting what you write about St Albans - chart reads no overfalls on west-going tide, and last year went straight over it no probs.

On the way back though was aiming inshore when the wind swung right on the nose and I couldn't make any headway under power. So had to come off the wind and had no choice but to ride right through the middle of it.

I have to admit I was a bit scared - of the unknown. But it was actually good fun - like a fairground ride !! I had my girlfriend with me who calls a F2 a hurricane and she, strangely seemed to enjoy it too!!

But - I would still go well round it or inshore next time !

Roger Holden
www.first-magnitude.co.uk

 

[rogerroger]

what happens to yachts \"caught\" in the race ?

I've only ever gone offshore - between 4.5 and 6 miles and in good weather. Looking across to the Bill the race looks nothing and you sit there wondering why you're going the long way round (from Weymouth).

What actually happens to a yacht that you'd have gone to the assistance of ? Can you not ride through it if you can handle the discomfort ?

Roger Holden
www.first-magnitude.co.uk

 

[LadyInBed]

Re: \"caught\" in the race

I once took a friend out from Weymouth in my 22’ M/S. It was a lovely day SW3, so we went out to just N of E Shambles Buoy, hove to for lunch and I pointed out to him the white water over the shambles bank. I had just finished washing up, glanced out of the window and noticed E Shambles Buoy was quite a bit closer. Set sail and turned the head to the N, COG SW, engine on (7.5 Yanmar) COG SW. We were now going up and down like a yoyo. Tried heading NE with full revs. COG W. So turned head NNW and rode the roller coaster to the W Shambles Buoy where we popped out like the proverbial cork out of a bottle. During the ‘passage’ we could see flat calm water 100 mtrs ahead of us, a row boat (with seagull engine) fishing to the W of the Shambles, (I didn’t dare look behind, probably a big brown slick on the water).
All ended well, I learnt a lot which stood me in good stead (knowing which end of the Shambles bank to aim for when coming back from a cross channel trip). Funny, come to think of it, the chap who came out with me didn’t come out again, I think he moved house as well.

 

[rogerroger]

Re: "caught" in the race

LOL re: your mate !

But will have to look at the chart to remind myself of the areas you're referring to...

The Shambles is the area that shallows to about 4 / 5 m CD between the Cardinals ?

Roger Holden
www.first-magnitude.co.uk

 

[Guest]

\"caught\" in the race II

Comming back from a great week in Dartmouth, I miss read the tide tables, came round the "Bill" at the end of the flood and straigh into the Race. We had a C&N 1/2 Tonner at the time a well found boat with a good solid rig and well up to big hard seas. There was no wind and no matter what I did we were pushed in to the standing waves just to the north east of the light house. This is the start of the ebb and the tides flows south for some 9 hours out of every 12 at this point. The waves were so big that I was scared to try to turn round and motor out to the west. I tried slowing down and ferry gliding out backwards, the waves are so big that you just do not have enough control to stop a surf/ broach with out the engine pushing you hard (Volvo 2001 9HP).
We had the VHF on and heard Portlanf CG asking if any one could see the "Yacht caught in the Race"! Karen got on the VHF and said that we though they were talking about us. At this time a hugh Naval Vessel "Black Rover" also came on the air and offered to create a lee in the tidal stream so that we would be able to turn and get out of the race. I did not like the sound of this and asked that as we had lots of Diesel we should be OK where we were.
As I am speaking I can here what sounds like a "Roger Bleeb" coming over the VHF. I have never heard the VHF do this before and I do not worry to much about (enough other things going on here). At the back of my mind something is ticking, I have read about this bloody bleeping noise some where!!! Damn it is the engine over heat warning! THe waves are so steep that the engine cooling water in take is being lifted out of the sea as we are lifted by each wave, we have now been in the race for about 2 hours and have not mamaged to move more that a couple of hundred yards. We can see the end of the standing waves, but cannot get to it.
Karen gets back on the VHF and reports to Portland CG that we now have an over heating engine and that we are going to have to turn around. Portland CG arange for the Navy to send out a rib to guide us throughthe inshore passage. I wait untill I see what I think are two waves that are smaller that the norm, kick the throttle wide open and throw the tiller hard across. We spoop down the face of the waveturn in the trough and climb up the face of the following wave. 10 waves later and we are met by a small green rib and guided to the inshore passage. This passage is so close inshore that a small stone thrown from the cliff landed in the cockpit!
I have crossed the Atlantic and this is the most scared I have ever been, We became Govenors of the RNLI and sent a barrel of beer to both the RN RIB team and to the Portland CG.

I can now find the inshore passage, but as a rule I go 7 to 10 miles out and sleep soundly.

Best of luck

Simes

 

[Guest]

Re: Portland Bill Fascinating reading

For a man stuck in the middle of the black country and not a lot of places to go to for advice on sailing this forum has again been excellent. Thanks to everyone, excellent postings, really interesting reading.
We plan to make the trip on the first subday in june. I think we need to get to the Bill about 16.30 and I hope to break the journey in Weymouth. It is half term week so I should imagine it will be plenty busy. Our Hillyard is at Galmpton creek at the moment which is an excellent place to work on your boat. I hope to meet up with some of you come the summer.
Cheers.

 

[rogerroger]

Weymouth ... town quay

don't know if you know Weymouth - the marina is good if you want good showers etc - but to enter it you'll need to go through the bridge that only lifts every 2 hours.

The town quay on the other hand is much cheaper (of course!) and much more of a laugh. You can step ashore to pubs and get going whenever you want (well, unless you're on the inside of a 6 deep raft!

(Oh, and you can use the showers in the sailing club which are v. good)

Roger Holden
www.first-magnitude.co.uk

 

[Twister_Ken]

Re: Weymouth ... town quay

Or the municipal showers which are part of the Harbour Master's domain (Harbour Mistress last time I was there, and very nice too!)

 

[tony_brighton]

Re: Almost certainly inshore passage.

pot bobbers can be numerous on the inshore passage - fit a rope cutter and keep a good eye out!

The inshore passage really is close in shore - you aim to be within about 50-100m. I've done it several times in my last boat - 26' - without trouble.