Poor customer service

[ip485]

Another thread prompted this one.

My experience is that the marine industry is truly dreadful at customer service or even doing a good job. I hear the same story from most people I speak to.

In my experience it is very difficult to find solid experts. Yes, there are some who can do the basic stuff, but anything more complicated and your chances of getting a good job done are poor. To make matters worse they will often claim they know how to tackle the job, whereas they have little or no idea. Then it seems to plague the industry that you are truly very lucky if anyone keeps you updated on where they are with a job, and eventually exactly what they have done. Is it so difficult to send the occasional email saying I will be starting tomorrow, I completed the work and my findings were etc.

Of course there are exceptions, and I have engaged some really excellent professionals, but often it involves them coming some distance and being hard found n the first place.

What is your experience?

Should we mention some of the experiences we have each had more often and if not why not?

Finally, what about the price. Again my experience is that some charge an unreasonable amount. When you see a job done you have a basis for how long it has taken. It seems to me there are some engine engineers for example who happily think they should charge considerably more per hour than a top of line car mechanic at a main dealer garage. Maybe they should?

 

[RupertW]

I've found good and bad over the years and when you find a good one - in other words they give good advice, will do the short term cheap job or the long term expensive one and explain your options, they will do it on time and with a good cost - then I've tended to stick with them.

In the last few years I would put Peter Leonard of Denton Island, Newhaven into that category, and for 3 years would have put Danese of Brindisi, Italy as the same. But did have some electrical work done and having met their off-yard electrician I can see why I should get everything but electrical fixing done there - nothing too wrong at all but just not tested so I had to finish off the jobs myself later in the season. So two good ones.

Now bad ones - I find it hard to know where to start. Most of the UK ones are out of business now but in Croatia and Greece I've found them almost universally useless if you are time poor and want to have a meeting with a boatyard person before flying home and hope that anything will be done ready for your return for your next week's sailing in perhaps a month. And even worse if you give them a stack of work which they agree to do over the Winter - after 4 months away there will be nothing done despite the flurry of emails near the beginning full of competence and optimism. I have learnt that we mostly have to do what we can ourselves and leave the rest for a decade until we retire and can watch them work.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I used to keep a boat in Plymouth and did find good tradespeople from Canvas work, woodwork through engineering installation and a fantastic GRP guy who sadly disappeared the only poor service I ever had was from a sailmaker. It helped being knowledgable in most fields and discussing in detail what I wanted. There were people that I saw working on other boats that definitely belonged to the Bodgit and Scarper fraternity though. Inevitably the good ones are in high demand and their rates are reflected in that.

 

[Wansworth]

Maybe we should have a. Page for services we can recommend,like word of mouth but modernized...

 

[lpdsn]

My experiences are more or less the same. A few very good, competent professionals. A few that are able to do as equally competent a job but are maybe lacking a bit in either customer-facing or time-management skills or the like. And a majority who are little more than bodgers and cowboys. The poor quality of the work of the latter is not telegraphed by the prices they charge which are often as high or higher than the good guys.

It really is buyer beware and you have to be almost good enough to do the job yourself to identify the competent professionals.

 

[Yealm]

I think I’ve been lucky in Plymouth over the years - good people and cheaper than Solent.

But one thing many seem to fail on is communication. I expect them to answer the phone, texts and emails same day - as an integral part of the job. And send regular photos/updates. Maybe I’m just high maintenance

My experiences are more or less the same. A few very good, competent professionals. A few that are able to do as equally competent a job but are maybe lacking a bit in either customer-facing or time-management skills or the like. And a majority who are little more than bodgers and cowboys. The poor quality of the work of the latter is not telegraphed by the prices they charge which are often as high or higher than the good guys.

It really is buyer beware and you have to be almost good enough to do the job yourself to identify the competent professionals.

 

[RichardS]

Since ownership of my boat transferred from the charter company to me over 4 years ago I have had occasion to email or telephone at least a dozen marine industry companies looking for information or advice about things on the boat which did not seem to be working perfectly or had components missing or damaged.

The majority of these contacts over the last 4 years have resulted in me receiving new parts without any charge at all, not even postage, even though I always say that I am happy to pay. It is hard to recall many times in the auto industry over the last 40 years when the level of service met this standard, although there have been occasions.

Richard

 

[prv]

Since ownership of my boat transferred from the charter company to me over 4 years ago I have had occasion to email or telephone at least a dozen marine industry companies looking for information or advice about things on the boat which did not seem to be working perfectly or had components missing or damaged.

The majority of these contacts over the last 4 years have resulted in me receiving new parts without any charge at all, not even postage, even though I always say that I am happy to pay. It is hard to recall many times in the auto industry over the last 40 years when the level of service met this standard, although there have been occasions.

Sounds like you're talking to equipment manufacturers, presumably reasonably large companies in most cases, whereas I think the earlier posts are about individual tradesmen or perhaps boatyards.

Pete

 

[RichardS]

Sounds like you're talking to equipment manufacturers, presumably reasonably large companies in most cases, whereas I think the earlier posts are about individual tradesmen or perhaps boatyards.

Pete

Possibly .... but the OP said "marine industry" and all the companies who have helped me fall into that category.

Richard

 

[prv]

Possibly .... but the OP said "marine industry" and all the companies who have helped me fall into that category.

Sure, your observations are perfectly valid and useful as well (and good to hear). Just suggesting why they might be so different from the others.

Pete

 

[wrr]

To be fair, my experience is different. I have had nothing but excellent service, and fair and balanced advice from my engine agents, shipwrights, riggers, yacht brokers, insurance broker, mooring contractor, surveyor, sailmaker, the yard where I lift out and even chandlers! Admittedly, I sail a classic and these people are carefully selected but I do not leave a vast amount of money with any of them. Some are to be avoided but the entire industry should not all be tarred with the same brush.

 

[CAPTAIN FANTASTIC]

My experience with the marine tradesmen over many years sailing the East, South and West coasts of the UK, is not very good. Overall, quotes are high, and when I ask them to describe how they propose to do the work, in most cases they are not very convincing. I therefore tend to break down the job into more manageable tasks e.g one company will fabricate a replacement tabernacle, another company, or I, will fit it. However, I always had great service from sail-makers; repairing sails, re-cutting genoas, new bespoke sails. In most cases, If I want a job done well, I will do it myself, but, unfortunately, I don't always have the time.

 

[Dutch01527]

Good and bad experiences. Larger companies seem to have too many naive customers who will pay prices and accept service that defy belief.

Large group in Cardiff quoted £450 plus vat plus parts to fix a engine stop cable problem and diagnose ( by observation not dismantle) a gearbox reverse issue. When I asked for a breakdown of estimated man hours and hourly rates they refused. A local independent Gareth Davis of Davis Marine did the jobs for less than £150 including parts within a week.

A large marine specialist upholstery company quoted £2,250 plus vat to replace sear covers on a motor boat. Local classic car specialist ( who had a million pound car being worked on in his workshop) did a great job for £850.

The rip off merchants do not deserve to stay in business.

 

[ip485]

My own experience is that it does depend very much where you are.

In the solent I think there are some really good people, and I am sure some not so good. In my experience everyone I have had based there has been first rate, but I have selected them on recommendation when others have been a let down.

I think in other areas there are often very few local people to start with. If the local chap happens to be poor there are then few alternatives. I would imagine in some areas this is even more the case.

What is odd is that I know a few places were it is almost impossible to find a good marine engine engineer for example. When you do they are up to their necks in work, literally for weeks in advance. If I were a young man wanting to go into business I would look no further than marine engines. It seems to me the rates are excellent, on the whole you are inside and if you offer a half decent service you will have as much work as you could wish. It seems strange that some many in the business are well into middle age or older - who will replace them in years to come I wonder.

 

[sailaboutvic]

I've found good and bad over the years and when you find a good one - in other words they give good advice, will do the short term cheap job or the long term expensive one and explain your options, they will do it on time and with a good cost - then I've tended to stick with them.

In the last few years I would put Peter Leonard of Denton Island, Newhaven into that category, and for 3 years would have put Danese of Brindisi, Italy as the same. But did have some electrical work done and having met their off-yard electrician I can see why I should get everything but electrical fixing done there - nothing too wrong at all but just not tested so I had to finish off the jobs myself later in the season. So two good ones.

Now bad ones - I find it hard to know where to start. Most of the UK ones are out of business now but in Croatia and Greece I've found them almost universally useless if you are time poor and want to have a meeting with a boatyard person before flying home and hope that anything will be done ready for your return for your next week's sailing in perhaps a month. And even worse if you give them a stack of work which they agree to do over the Winter - after 4 months away there will be nothing done despite the flurry of emails near the beginning full of competence and optimism. I have learnt that we mostly have to do what we can ourselves and leave the rest for a decade until we retire and can watch them work.

Well I have to agree with RupertW , I have never met so many unprofessional unskilled guys selling their little skills they have has top craftsman and engineers as in Greece and to top that up charging silly money , and are sorry to say some are brits .
Lucky for us we can do most of the work ourself but now and then we all need a little help .
Here two cases four years ago I wanted to replace the selfs in the front berth with lockers ,
It's a straight forward job marine ply facing with three cut out on each side and using the cut out for doors , just you would see in most boats , the first British guy wanted 1300 euros the second 1600 euros both couldn't tell me when they could start the job or when they would finish , the price didn't include vanish, in the end I made a Patton out of 2ply , brought a sheet of marine ply for 65euro and took the sheet to a local woodwork shop with the Patton and he cut them out for 50 euros a very professional job the cutout fit better then the once which Dufour fitted add on latches, hinges, vanish and a few other bits and the job was done for less then 250 euros .
The second job was just last year as some may have read I fitted a new windless but it kept blowing the breaker after trying all sort of stuff I give in and got a another Brit so call marine engineer after testing or so I thought he told me the problem was a brake in the cables and needed replacing , as most of the boat needed to be taken to bits to get the cable out that run from the battery to the windless he wasn't keen to do the job , so he charge me 70 euros for testing the wiring .thats find at less now I know what the problem was,and I rather take my own boat to bits carefully .
oh dear there goes another flying pig.
Almost a ful day to get the cable out and then putting them back in , just to find out when I took it to get a new one the guy in the shop retested it and inform me there nothing wrong with it and I was wasting my money replacing it .
It ended up being a fauit with the new windless.
Last story a well known SS guy in nidri , yes I bet you all you LB know who I talking about we wanted a slit bend in our Bimini SS he said it be cheaper for him to make a new Bimini frame then to bend the three SS we have , in the end we manage to do it over a lorry wheel . Done get me wrong the guy is well known for his good SS work and his high prices come to that let alone in his delay doing jobs , but I for one wouldn't put any work his way after what I felt he tried to rip us off .

 

[tudorsailor]

What is needed is something like Trip Advisor combined with mybuilder.com

Anyone willing to start a new website?

TS

 

[itchenseadog]

Having spent a lifetime in the marine industry, I still find it strange that whilst people are happy to pay upwards of £100 per hour to have their £30k car serviced, those same people complain at being asked to spend £20 to £25 per hour to have servicing work carried out on their floating £250k pride and joy. It has to be realised that boatyards with waterside premises often have to pay extortionate rents and business rates before all the other overheads such as insurance, wages etc. It was only that I enjoyed my career that I stayed in the industry, I certainly didnt do it for the money ! What would be the minimum hourly rate that forum members would get out of bed for?

 

[sailaboutvic]

Having spent a lifetime in the marine industry, I still find it strange that whilst people are happy to pay upwards of £100 per hour to have their £30k car serviced, those same people complain at being asked to spend £20 to £25 per hour to have servicing work carried out on their floating £250k pride and joy. It has to be realised that boatyards with waterside premises often have to pay extortionate rents and business rates before all the other overheads such as insurance, wages etc. It was only that I enjoyed my career that I stayed in the industry, I certainly didnt do it for the money ! What would be the minimum hourly rate that forum members would get out of bed for?

Not at all sure where your getting your £20/25ph from .
I don't think more people would moan if ,A they got a good job done .B at a fair price,
When I brought my new boat in 2009 Volvo had to service it after 20 hour ( I think it was ) any way what ever I ended up with a £250 invoice part of that was for three and a half hour labour , so what did they do ?
Change filter and oil, change the cooler. Change fuel filter and bleed the engine , Check the impeller, check engine mounts , check belt , check gearbox oil. Check The sea water strain wasn't cleared as they couldn't get the top off and didn't want to break it, and stamp the paper work , only after I complete did they reduce the invoice and give me a few spare parts .
now not sure about you but I can easily do the same work in a couple of hours and stopping for a brake and a chat .

 

[chrishelen]

Just want to add my little story, not much but my own fault I suppose. I usually get my stuff off AV supplies, they are very good usually. I bought some engine mount stud's over the phone. £5.50 each plus £9.50 pp. No problems but they are sell exactly the same ones on eBay same price but free pp. I did check eBay but didn't look at who was supplying them. My fault. But still left a bad taste.

 

[Bobc]

What is needed is something like Trip Advisor combined with mybuilder.com

Anyone willing to start a new website?

TS

It's already been done (last year).

www.Boataid.co.uk