pole for cruising chute and genny

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niccapotamus

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before I flog our spinnaker pole - sadler 32 sized so about 3m long - coz it is bloody big and heavy

here's a question - we've got a brand new cruising chute and I was thinking about swapping the big heavy pole for a lighter whisker pole to pole out the spinny or help pole out the cruising chute if it needs it

is that a good idea or will i break the whisker pole and therefore should stick with the b great lump of aluminium ~(which means that it'll probalby never get used)

ta
 
At the risk of stating the obvious but, FWIW...

I have a similar situation on my boat (Centurion 32). Initially I had balked at the weight of the spi pole. However, I found that by clipping the topping lift to the pole before I released it from the deck I could take the weight on the topping lift and would thus be able to maneuvre the pole relatively easily.

Normally I sail solo and I still manage to use the asymmetric quite regularly.
 
niccapotamus said:
before I flog our spinnaker pole - sadler 32 sized so about 3m long - coz it is bloody big and heavy

here's a question - we've got a brand new cruising chute and I was thinking about swapping the big heavy pole for a lighter whisker pole to pole out the spinny or help pole out the cruising chute if it needs it

is that a good idea or will i break the whisker pole and therefore should stick with the b great lump of aluminium ~(which means that it'll probalby never get used)

ta
Click to expand...

Compression loads on a spinny are high hence the weight of the poles compared to a whisker pole. However if you only use it in light airs as a cruiser rather than a racer you may get away with it. Whats the worst that can happen. Watch out for squalls. If you want to use it in heavier winds use the heavier pole with more crew and the uphaul to take the weight. I connect my uphaul to the centre of the pole so it takes all the weight so although it is a heavy pole its not a strain and the wife and I are not in the first flush of youth.

Steve
 
It is usually said that a whisker pole for a cruising chute should be 1.5 times the length of a spinnaker pole to the 'J' measurement. Same applies with a big overlapping genoa, although mine works reasonably well with the standard pole.

If it's of any use I have a spare one-piece windsurfer mast that is available for conversion to a whisker pole. Not sure where you are and it isn't something I could post!
 
vyv_cox said:
It is usually said that a whisker pole for a cruising chute should be 1.5 times the length of a spinnaker pole to the 'J' measurement. Same applies with a big overlapping genoa, although mine works reasonably well with the standard pole.

If it's of any use I have a spare one-piece windsurfer mast that is available for conversion to a whisker pole. Not sure where you are and it isn't something I could post!
Click to expand...

Hi Vyv - thanks - helpful as always - I've messaged you :)
 
A wind surfer mast is ideal for a whisker pole. Just buy some end fittings and attach plus an attachment for topping lift.
In polling out a jib it seems to me that a longer pole needs to be stronger a shorter pole will not hold the jib out so far when running but need not be so strong and can be used when reaching. Obviously you need a much longer pole for a cruising chute but if it is only used in light airs wind surfer mast should be OK. If you do break it no great loss.
Don't let your spin pole go until you have had some experience with the light weight pole. olewill
 
I modified an extending window cleaning pole (3 sections) for use as a whisker pole on my nic 26. It was OK for ghosting but I had a length of shock cord that I attached to the clew of the sail to hold it down. The first time I deployed it, it bent and had to be replaced. I don't need anything like it for the parasail so it's reverted to it's design function at home again.
 
We have a light whisker pole for our 10 M boat with roughly a 30M2 foresail. So much easier to pick up one handed and clip to sail and mast, rarely do I have to rig any lines to it. Typically running back up the river on a gentle afternoon breeze we are the boat that has both sails drawing when others are barely stemming the tide or turning on diesels. Because it is simple and easy we use it a lot. One mishap in 10 years. We were doing a club race, beating with the jib rolled almost to nothing we turned the windward mark close to another boat and goosewinged with full jib, distracted by things happening around us we gybed in a squall and bent the pole on the forestay. Our fault not the pole. Anyway it was much cheaper to put the ends on a new piece of tube than a replacement full weight pole would have been.
Light pole is a really useful thing, fine for the cruising chute too. Go get one.
 
vyv_cox said:
If it's of any use I have a spare one-piece windsurfer mast that is available for conversion to a whisker pole. Not sure where you are and it isn't something I could post!
Click to expand...
That's what I have used. I bought two large piston ends from Force4. If you use the bottom end of the pole, you need to cut some sleeves from the remainder of the pole to bring the ID down to the size of the piston ends.
 
lw395 said:
What is the attraction of poling out a cruising chute?
Click to expand...

Poling it out from the tack and using the pole as a sort of (athwartships) adjustable bowsprit extends its use when the wind is well abaft the beam.

IMHO, when short of crew - especially solo, as in my case - it is easier to handle and control than a symmetric spinnaker.
 
PuffTheMagicDragon said:
Poling it out from the tack and using the pole as a sort of (athwartships) adjustable bowsprit extends its use when the wind is well abaft the beam.

IMHO, when short of crew - especially solo, as in my case - it is easier to handle and control than a symmetric spinnaker.
Click to expand...

Doesn't that need a very strong pole?
 
thanks folks :)

I think I'll keep the old spinny pole for the moment and dig it out from the garage floor and stick it back on the boat whilst keeping an eye out for a suitable bit of windsurfer :)
 
lw395 said:
What is the attraction of poling out a cruising chute?
Click to expand...

Uricanejack said:
I thought the whole point of a cruising chute was it's easy to use because there is no pole.
Click to expand...

I've heard this before, but as someone hoping to use both types, I don't see what there is to misunderstand...

...on a symmetric spinnaker, the pole (itself needing adjustment) secures what is the sail's tack, while the clew needs its own adjustment...

...but an asymmetric's tack is fixed - only the clew needs adjustment. The pole can just push it further out than it goes unaided.

I can't see why it isn't obvious that it's easier to pole out an asymmetric's clew, than to handle both bottom corners of a symmetric.

I'm setting-up my spinnakers (not for simultaneous use!), hoping to enjoy both. But even having managed that, I suspect after close-reaching with my rather flat asymmetric, I'll be tempted just to pole its clew out opposite the main to go deep downwind, even if it's not as big as the symmetric. However overstated the difficulty of the symmetric may be, poling out the asymm's clew must be easier?

EDIT: It's also possible that I didn't understand what Puff the MD, was saying. :o G'night chaps. :moon:
 
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lw395 said:
What is the attraction of poling out a cruising chute?
Click to expand...

With a cruising chute ( we are not talking racing asymetrics here just ordinary cruising folk) one cannot normally head dead down wind because the chute is normally flown the same side as the main. The main thus covers the chute killing the wind. Therefore, one has to head off at an angle to the wind to make it effective. In heavier wind this has the same effect as a normal spinnaker used for reaching in that it causes the boat to heal more. This limits its use in higher winds. When the boat is on a broad reach & a gust hits the boat is more liable to heal & broach.
With a conventional spinnaker one can sail dead down wind - or almost so- & provided one adjusts the sheets to reduce rolling & has a sail that is cut for such a situation then one can sail the boat in heavier wind.
With a cruising chute it can sometimes be set to windward in lighter winds ( or at least mine can) but in bigger seas where it is harder to maintain a good line to the wind it will keep collapsing. I also have to play with the foot to let it ride to leeward quite a lot which makes it unstable.
If the clew can be held out to windward this can be reduced. The pole may not need up haul or down haul as the shape of the sail & the sheeting angle should hold the pole in the correct line. Therefore, bending moment is much reduced over a pole that is attached at mid point.
Quite often a light pole such as a carbon fibre sailboard mast may be adapted to hold the clew well to windward . The foot can be adjusted so that it is not too high to keep the sail stable ( Depending on theluff curve)
Thus one can then sail down wind much easier.

Well that is my theory but others will disagree , of course
 
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