Plumb vertical bow

gertha said:
A boat or Yacht should be an object of beauty, flat up and down at the front and flat up and down at the back with maximum volume down stairs may be some peoples idea of beauty; however I prefer a bit of shape at the front and also the rear to have a pleasant shape, volume down stairs is low on my list, prefer a nice tight accommodation.
Simon
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+1
The Javelin30 is one of the most beautiful yachts ever built; if not THE most beautiful.
OK, I'm biased :p
 
doug748 said:
I feel all warm and fuzzy, when everyone agrees.

There is less justification for the extremes, like ladies frocks not too short not too long.
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In the 60s and 70s when I drove 48ft "artics" one of the greatest thrills was looking down into open-top cars with a long-leggedly lass in a pelmet skirt sitting sexily in the passenger seat of said car.
Preferably also with only a tiny bit of material around her fenders!
Phhhhwwwwoaaaahhhh :encouragement:
 
Robert Wilson said:
+1
The Javelin30 is one of the most beautiful yachts ever built; if not THE most beautiful.
OK, I'm biased :p
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Rubbish. The Mystere from the same designer was far more beautiful from the stern. The Javelin, like the Sadler 32, was too pinched to look good to my eyes.

There used to be an old adage to the effect that anyone could design an effective boat/ship's bow but only the great designers could get the stern right.
 
johnalison said:
Rubbish. The Mystere from the same designer was far more beautiful from the stern. The Javelin, like the Sadler 32, was too pinched to look good to my eyes.

There used to be an old adage to the effect that anyone could design an effective boat/ship's bow but only the great designers could get the stern right.
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Have you any pics? I remain unconvinced until proof be provided ;)
 
Robert Wilson said:
In the 60s and 70s when I drove 48ft "artics" one of the greatest thrills was looking down into open-top cars with a long-leggedly lass in a pelmet skirt sitting sexily in the passenger seat of said car.
Preferably also with only a tiny bit of material around her fenders!
Phhhhwwwwoaaaahhhh :encouragement:
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If I might borrow a bit:



"Have you any pics? I remain unconvinced until proof be provided" :eek-new:
 
Robert Wilson said:
In the 60s and 70s when I drove 48ft "artics" one of the greatest thrills was looking down into open-top cars with a long-leggedly lass in a pelmet skirt sitting sexily in the passenger seat of said car.
Preferably also with only a tiny bit of material around her fenders!
Phhhhwwwwoaaaahhhh :encouragement:
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I might let you borrow my Morgan so that you could try to attract passengers like that.

However, I should warn you that most of the admirers (of the car, not the driver) are of a certain age and usually say something like "we had one of those when young" or "always fancied one of those".
 
I think it's easier to draw a beautiful boat if you don't have so many accommodation constraints (e.g. Thomas's Link 30 / Mystery 30). The clever designs are the ones where the boat is a good looker but still has a good interior (and manages to avoid the AWB blandness). Some J boats pull this off quite well. The Sigma 33 also does imo.
 
Robert Wilson said:
Have you any pics? I remain unconvinced until proof be provided ;)
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Most of my pics were not very good, and she looked better in the water, but this might give you an idea. Waiting to be hauled out at Dan Webb & Feasey's:

n351%20copy.jpg
 
How do you mean "pinched"? At the bow?
Otherwise the sterns look almost identical to my in-educated eye. But there again, beauty IS in the eye of the beholder!

I think seeing Khamsin on the hard when I bought her it was her bow profiles that sold her to me. Beautiful, sleek, imposing, powerful etc etc............
As I said above, I'm biased ;)
 
I'm obviously in a minority on here in that I think some of the current plumb or even reverse stem designs look great (but then again, I've always been a bit of a fan of Dreadnoughts....)

The Pogo 36 or the RM 1070 would be right at the top of my list if I were in funds to buy a new boat. One of the things that I like about these designs is that form follows function.

That is not to say that I don't like the timeless elegance of an S&S Swan or a Contessa 32. I do.

But I don't particularly want to own such a boat.
 
Frogmogman said:
I'm obviously in a minority on here in that I think some of the current plumb or even reverse stem designs look great (but then again, I've always been a bit of a fan of Dreadnoughts....)

The Pogo 36 or the RM 1070 would be right at the top of my list if I were in funds to buy a new boat. One of the things that I like about these designs is that form follows function.

That is not to say that I don't like the timeless elegance of an S&S Swan or a Contessa 32. I do.

But I don't particularly want to own such a boat.
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Motored past an RM 1070 on the Helford the other week and was very taken with her in the flesh; like you I had a fondness for Dreadnoughts in my youth, so the fact that this particular example had a hull which was more or less Battleship grey didn't hurt either!
 
It seems to me that a plumb bow does not make the waterline length longer, but rather makes the length on deck shorter. This then allows the owner to pay less in berthing fees. The trouble is that the bow roller is then extended out to the true front of the boat, where it sticks over the pontoon, ensnaring passers-by [1].

I believe that the plumb bows on traditional craft are for much the same reason, but they at least had the courtesy to reef their bowsprits out of the way.

If marinas charged by total length including such fittings [2] then the incentive for plumb bows would be less, though perhaps the fashion would continue.

[1] He says from experience
[2] I understand that some do this already.

PS I did not intend to come across so curmudgeonly, I just think they have come about because of false logic.
 
TLouth7 said:
It seems to me that a plumb bow does not make the waterline length longer, but rather makes the length on deck shorter. This then allows the owner to pay less in berthing fees. The trouble is that the bow roller is then extended out to the true front of the boat, where it sticks over the pontoon, ensnaring passers-by [1].

I believe that the plumb bows on traditional craft are for much the same reason, but they at least had the courtesy to reef their bowsprits out of the way.

If marinas charged by total length including such fittings [2] then the incentive for plumb bows would be less, though perhaps the fashion would continue.

[1] He says from experience
[2] I understand that some do this already.

PS I did not intend to come across so curmudgeonly, I just think they have come about because of false logic.
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My berth charges are based on the actual length, including the stem head fitting - but I berth stern to. Extended stem head /bow rollers are not unique to plumb bowed yachts, but have become common with the fashion of stowing large self launching anchors on the bow roller.
 
Tranona said:
My berth charges are based on the actual length, including the stem head fitting - but I berth stern to. Extended stem head /bow rollers are not unique to plumb bowed yachts, but have become common with the fashion of stowing large self launching anchors on the bow roller.
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Although some people report that they give their boat measurements to their marina, my experience is like yours, as a result of our marina's measurement policy. This seems logical to me, when the space to be provided depends of the full length.

I think you are being a bit perverse in describing current anchor/bow design as a fashion. With average boat sizes now in the 10-12 metre range, the modern wife will nowadays mutiny if asked to pull such an anchor as is required onto the deck or roller. The 25lb CQR on our old boat was within my wife's ability and a friend got his spouse raising their 35lb version. Our 45lb anchor is sort of self-stowing, but easily manageable by my wife with a winch. I have occasionally seen men on the foredeck but this aberration should be discouraged.

If you are looking for beauty with a plumb bow, the finest-looking boats ever are the Colchester smacks.
 
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I have never understood the 'reserve boyancy' claim for raked bows. I have read it means that the further the bow submerges, the more boyancy comes into play.

If so why keep it in reserve? The plumb bow has the boyancy 'active' at all times.

A raked bow does indeed make anchor handling easier: which is why many plumb bows have a stainless steel strip attached.

MD
 
mobeydick said:
I have never understood the 'reserve boyancy' claim for raked bows. I have read it means that the further the bow submerges, the more boyancy comes into play.

If so why keep it in reserve? The plumb bow has the boyancy 'active' at all times.

A raked bow does indeed make anchor handling easier: which is why many plumb bows have a stainless steel strip attached.

MD
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It's not just the rake but the flare which changes the buoyancy characteristics. With broadly parallel sides the displaced water will increase in a linear way as the bow is immersed, but with flare it will increase much faster.
 
Function in the days of working sail, unhindered by style or rating rules, seemed to suggest straight bows are the practical option.
Style is a matter of taste. Presumably those that hanker after 70s style boats also hanker after an Austin Allegro and wear flares to match :)
 
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