Phone as GPS

[webcraft]

remember to switch off the phone part of your phone to avoid it draining your battery too quickly in the vain attempt to find the masts.

Didn't know you could actually do this. You can switch off mobile data, but surely it will still look for a network?

Re. Other comments - there will be two fixed GPS/plotter units on the boat, I'm not nuts enough to base my nav strategy on one fragile device, it's as a backup in the event of lightening or similar catastrophic leccy failure. In fact here will be at least two phones, plus the Bluetooth GPS unit for my iPad if I can find it. And two large battery banks for recharging. One phone will have Memory Map on it, but this will only be used as a backup inshore.

I am pretty certain mast triangulation is unnecessary for a GPS position with most phones. Waiting five minutes for a noon position would not be an issue - that's pretty rapid compared to working out a sextant sight.

- W

 

[Daydream believer]

.
Making lists as part of planning a long voyage,
Any comments?

- W

How long is the trip & how far offshore?
If it is only coastal do you actually need a GPS?
Too often people rely on such items forgetting that there are other options to electronics.
& as a total thread drift--- how is the repair of the steering oar going????

 

[MoodySabre]

My iPhone 4 kept its GPS position all the way from Holland. To read the lat and long look at the compass utility on the phone.

 

[lw395]

Normally it's the coastal bits where you need to know exactly where you are. Two days out of the Azores, it's not critical if your DR is 10 miles out. Sailing through Cherbourg breakwater without seeing either side because the fog is that thick, that's when you need a GPS or two, and need to know it's on the right grid. It wouldn't be a great time to find out your UK phone is using OSGB lat'n'long, because that's what the basestations are on.
The last HH GPS I bought was under a hundred quid. It's waterproof. It is simple to use. It never has software updates or android hissy fits. It just does what it does.
Buying another one would seem like poor value, if I really trusted my phone, but having recently changed phone, I'm not sure I'm there yet. SWMBO's phone has crashed with updates before now.

 

[solent clown]

you can set up most car tom toms to just give you long lat position etc if you have an old one laying about as a spare. Cheaper than buying a dedicated gps if you have one laying about

 

[jac]

you'll need a bit of software to turn it into a lat and long, but yes, they all have gps these days.

but how long do phone batteries last? when you chat to your wife / mother or the SNP for hours?

a cheap hand held with a pack of batteries is a more reliable option.

P.S. If you are worried about that small a safety investment, then I will finally accept that you are scottish (if not yorkshire).

On the IPhone the compass App has an option to display Lat and Long so no additional software required for that. Given the cost of navionics though I might be inclined to invest in that if planning on using the phone as a backup to a fixed device.

Of course in an ideal world you would have a device that worked on Galileo / Glonass as well in case of issues with the "standard" GPS network.

 

[prv]

Didn't know you could actually do this. You can switch off mobile data, but surely it will still look for a network?

You never fly anywhere, then?

Of course in an ideal world you would have a device that worked on Galileo / Glonass as well in case of issues with the "standard" GPS network.

Like a smartphone, for example?

(They all do GLONASS because they can't be sold in Russia if they don't.)

Pete

 

[Muddy32]

I do hope you have a paper chart to plot the position on, and maybe even dare I suggest a cheap sextant with tables- but that is definite thread drift!!
The joy of a HH is that it takes ordinary batteries, and you can navigate on a "go to" set up. I have used a HH, [with a back up as well as sextant] for lots of out of sight of land trips, both offshore and ocean stuff. Only wish my IT skills were up to importing the French charts bought, onto my CPn and memory map plotter.

 

[jac]

Like a smartphone, for example?

(They all do GLONASS because they can't be sold in Russia if they don't.)

Pete

well I've learned something today then - everyday is a school day as they say.

 

[Bilgediver]

You can now get battery packs with solar panel built in and with WiFi and data turned of the batteries last longer. I have had two Samsung phones both of which worked quite happily with Navionics around the USA and Canada and the relevant chart cost around £10.

 

[Spyro]

The app. "jack of tools" will give you lat and long amongst a host of other gadgets.

 

[wotayottie]

Used my mobile to follow where we were on a cruise ship all the way from India through the red sea and the med to southampton. No issue with needing triangulating cell masts - thats old hat nowadays. My android phone gives options under settings>location to chose between using masts, blue tooth, cell systems or just GPS.

That isnt the issue. The screen of a phone is useless for plotting so you need an app to change phone location into lat and long and then a good old fashioned paper chart to plot it on. Without the latter, the phone is as much use for navigating properly as a frying pan.

 

[Hoolie]

Without the latter, the phone is as much use for navigating properly as a frying pan.

Not sure how you'd do that unless you fill the frying pan with water and use it as visual horizon with a sextant

 

[Bi111ion]

I have had a series of Samsung Galaxy Sn phones from 3 to 7. From series 4 at least the GPS included Glonass as well as GPS, and was quite a lot more accurate than any other device I had on board. The S7 and the S4 active are waterproof, the S7 without the need for a bung in the charging socket.

I believe there are still some cheap naff phones and tablets without proper GPS (that need a cell tower) but even when I have had cheap Chinese Android phones they do have proper GPS.

That said SIRF IV based GS devices are really cheap, so for example I have a separate serial GPS puck driving the NMEA for my VHS and MF/HF radios. I also have an old school hand held GPS in the grab bag. Point is it takes AAA batteries and a bunch of them in there too, but I am sure you can think of charging methods for android phones the would suit a grab bag! The old one is also really rugged.

 

[webcraft]

That isnt the issue. The screen of a phone is useless for plotting so you need an app to change phone location into lat and long and then a good old fashioned paper chart to plot it on. Without the latter, the phone is as much use for navigating properly as a frying pan.

I just want a position to plot on a paper chart. Plotters are an unnecessary and largely useless extravagance offshore - excerpt for displaying AIS data, of course.

There are several free apps to show Lat and long.

- W

 

[greeny]

I have an old handheld Gps that was originally meant for walking/hiking. I'm pretty sure it's a Garmin. It reads out in lat/long and runs off AA standard batteries or re-chargeables. Surely you can get one of these second hand off ebay for not a lot of money. It must be 15yrs old now and still going strong. Works well as a back up for me and usually lives in the "grab bag" just in case.

 

[Zing]

With 2 plotters you’ve got redundancy. There’s a mega slim chance of both breaking from component failures. The most likely thing to knock them both out will be a lightning strike. If that happens it is pot luck what else gets taken out, but it is not unusual for all electronics to be destroyed by the EMP. So if that happens, your phone is dead too. You will then need a paper chart and a compass, which you certainly have. There’s every chance that will get you home. If you want more precision then also get a plastic sextant, a good manual and a mechanical timepiece (probably lightning proof).

 

[jac]

With 2 plotters you’ve got redundancy. There’s a mega slim chance of both breaking from component failures. The most likely thing to knock them both out will be a lightning strike. If that happens it is pot luck what else gets taken out, but it is not unusual for all electronics to be destroyed by the EMP. So if that happens, your phone is dead too. You will then need a paper chart and a compass, which you certainly have. There’s every chance that will get you home. If you want more precision then also get a plastic sextant, a good manual and a mechanical timepiece (probably lightning proof).

I thought that the lightning would only destroy those electrical items that were in close proximity to something that was plugged in or something that was powered up ( even if not connected to the boat) Those items that were off should survive unless there is a route for the discharge to get into them - i.e. they were plugged in.

of course the best way to protect anything in lightning is via a faraday cage and an oven is supposed to make an excellent one.

Is there any data to indicate how much risk small hand held devices are at during a lightning strike and what precautions DO work,

 

[Zing]

I thought that the lightning would only destroy those electrical items that were in close proximity to something that was plugged in or something that was powered up ( even if not connected to the boat) Those items that were off should survive unless there is a route for the discharge to get into them - i.e. they were plugged in.

of course the best way to protect anything in lightning is via a faraday cage and an oven is supposed to make an excellent one.

Is there any data to indicate how much risk small hand held devices are at during a lightning strike and what precautions DO work,

Being concerned about this issue in the past I researched to see if you could protect them with a faraday cage. There's a ton of accounts of people who have had their whole boat's gadget collection wiped out and not even by a direct strike. All electronics and many electrical components destroyed whether plugged in or not and even accounts of failed oven protection. The conclusion I came to was it might help, but with a big strike that it was probably not going to help. I have a steel box inside a metal safe where I will place my back up nav (Iphone with InavX charts). The double skin works better apparently. Better something than nothing.

There are some very expensive lighting protection cut off devices available that you can buy, but I thought they were not cost effective, plus they don't protect from the EMP.

 

[Spyro]

I have an old handheld Gps that was originally meant for walking/hiking. I'm pretty sure it's a Garmin. It reads out in lat/long and runs off AA standard batteries or re-chargeables. Surely you can get one of these second hand off ebay for not a lot of money. It must be 15yrs old now and still going strong. Works well as a back up for me and usually lives in the "grab bag" just in case.

Got one of those but it eats batteries. Phone batteries last longer now especially if you aren't talking on them.