Outboard won't start!

Re: Outboard won\'t start!

Don't try anymore until you've stuck the leg in a dustbin full of water. The impellor may have stuck to the housing anyway after 5 years, but at least get some water into the system. Pulling the cord with the leg submerged will prime it.
 
Re: Outboard won\'t start!

I would exprct to find a basic setting, ie number of turns off the seat, in the workshop manual but even then it is a question of adusting it until the engine runs correctly.

It is the adjustment for the slow running mixture, although some models have had ajustments for the high speed mixture as well.

Pull the knob off and you should find a screw driver slot in the end of a splined shaft. Warm the engine up and twiddle with that until you get the engine idling smoothly then refit the knob with the pointer at the mid point in its range. If you are not happy you can always try again until you are.
 
Re: More on the carb setting

It seems similar to the Honda then one and a half turns they're saying for the slow running. Important to get the motor up to operating temperature as well.

(Reading it again and looking at the casing I see that it's a fuel adjustment, not an air bleed. As you screw it down it starts to spit back (weak mixture). Not that it makes a lot of difference to your adjustments, you're looking for smooth idling.)
 
Re: Outboard won\'t start!

Still no joy, then /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

The fact that the engine is totally "dead" suggests ignition problems to me - can you confirm that you get a spark *at the plug* if you take it out of the engine & lay it against the head & turn the engine over?

Even if timing was 180 deg out, I would have expected coughs, bangs and blow-backs if the spark was OK. If you want to confirm the carb: turn off the fuel, and drain the float bowl; Add about a teaspoon of fuel/oil mixture directly into the air intake, open the throttle (no choke & leave the fuel turned off) and turn the engine over smartly a few times. It *will* fire like this if the ignition side is OK.

Other things to try: Take out the plugs and put them in a low oven (bottom door of a Rayburn works well!), fit them & try to start the engine while they are still hot.

I don't know the engine in question, but the ignition pick-up is commonly mounted on a plate that fits over the crank-shaft before the flywheel is fitted - is it possible that this plate has been fitted wrongly (e.g) 180 deg out? The carbs are usually fairly simple - if the float chamber needle valve can be unscrewed (the brass housing, not the needle itself - you have still got the needle, haven't you?! Depending on the design, it can fall out when you take the float away), check that there isn't a lump of crud under it that either restricts fuel supply, or prevents the needle sealing properly - can easily happen if anything gets into the fuel pipe while things are dismantled. Main jet is almost certainly central in the base of the carb - blow through & hold up to the light to ensure it's clear. I beg to differ with VicS now: /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif I would only use air, or nylon bristles to clean out jets, not wire.

Any chance that there is something restricting the exhaust? This can kill a 2 stroke stone dead.

Any earth leads, or similar on the ignition module or "points" that you've missed? (Sorry to cast aspertions...)

Popping noise you hear when turning over without the plugs in is normal for 2 strokes.

I made the comment about the flywheel key, because I have vague recollections that there is a reasonably common small engine out there where this *isn't* the case - a real "gotcha" for even experienced mechanics feeling their way. (Everything I've dismantled has had a woodruff key.)

The daft thing is, that once you get it started, it will probably be fine!

Edit: Last thought - is there an interlock that stops you starting the engine in gear? Is it adjusted correctly? - sorry, I don't know this specific engine.

Andy
 
Re: Outboard won\'t start!

[ QUOTE ]
Other things to try: Take out the plugs and put them in a low oven (bottom door of a Rayburn works well!), fit them & try to start the engine while they are still hot.


[/ QUOTE ] Ah Ha! I suggested this on another thread as I use this trick on my lawnmower. Others scoffed. It works as well if you put the electrode end of the plug in the flame of a gas ring. Remember to hold the plug in some pliers!
 
Re: Outboard won\'t start!

By 'eck you're quick!

Yep, have juggled too-hot-to-hold spark plugs on more than one occasion!

Andy
 
Re: Outboard won\'t start!

[ QUOTE ]
I beg to differ with VicS now: I would only use air, or nylon bristles to clean out jets, not wire.

[/ QUOTE ] The carb jets can get pretty solidly blocked so compressed air will not always blow them clean hence the suggestion to use wire. Blowing through by mouth is not a reliable indication that the jets are competely clear nor is holding them up to the light. I am pretty certain that I said <u>copper</u> wire, because copper is unlikely to damage the brass jets but I agree definitely not steel wire. Sometimes one needs something a bit longer than bristles so Nylon monofilament fishing line perhaps but personally for very occasional use I'll stick with copper wire (I've got some big reels of fuse wire that I need to find uses for!)

Several of the other things you mention have already been covered. Like you I would put my money on an ignition problem but John is quite convinced it is a fuel problem hence the suggestion that he does a carb clean. I would not like to persuade him not to do so then have to eat humble pie later on!

He has not done anything major to the carb up 'til now but he has removed all the ignition bits from under the flywheel hence the likelihood that the problem lies there. Quite early on he said he was getting a spark so, provided it is a good spark, the timing is the most likely thing but I have not had to do anything to that on my similar engine so I do not know what the pitfalls are. I have not had to clean the carb either but then nor I have not had to "unseize" it.

I am not totally convinced about the teaspoonfull of fuel in the air intake idea but something similar has already been suggested so I guess is that it is worth a try but I would put more faith in the cautious use of Easy Start. If the ignition is OK then it will definietly fire with no risk of not getting quite the right mixture or of fouling the plugs. Lack of lubrication should not be an issue for a few revolutions as every thing has hopefully been well oiled during reassembly.

Johnathon,

I think you did say that the reed valves are Ok and that you have not fitted them back to front. Are you sure as the engine will not go if they are are not seating or if they have been fitted arse about face.
 
Re: Outboard won\'t start!

Got the manual delivered yesterday, so hopefully will help in disassembling parts.

Re reed valves. I am quite sure, at the minute anyhow, that they have gone back in the right way around. The little 'flaps' are facing into the crankshaft through the gasket.

Only after reading some of the manual last night I am also beginning to doubt the ignition side of things. I am sure that I have put it all back together properly and I am getting a spark off the plugs, so if theres a spark then the ignition is working, yes?

Well, I am going to check all the wires/leads as you suggested and failing all that I will look at the carb/float valve a little closer.

Thanks guys.... as always, I'll keep you informed as I progress.

Oh, I'm coming up to SIBS on Thursday... anybody care to take a look /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: Outboard won\'t start!

If you have a spark which is arriving at the right time + fuel present in the combustion chamber something should happen.
That,s why I asked if the engine had been totally silent since the"rebuild"
If the spark don,t arrive when it should + fuel is present then nowt will happen.
Pilot jet settings will not affect the engine to the extent that She will not fire.
Rule of thumb---Srew the pilot jet adjusting screw "just home" then back off a turn and a half. Set there is fine untill you are in a position to" fine tune"
Idle ajustement is a combination of the pilot jet and idle screw.
All the above is achieved once you,ve got the "mother" running!
Yes the flaps face in.
Keep us posted!
 
Re: Outboard won\'t start!

[ QUOTE ]
..I am getting a spark off the plugs, so if theres a spark then the ignition is working, yes?

[/ QUOTE ]

Timing may not be right, but fundamentally, yes, it's working. Only thing is, I would have expected *something* if you were getting a spark + fuel in the cylinder, even if it was only an occasional back-fire.

I know VicS is dubious about the "teaspoon of petrol" trick, but it does work. If the carb is at fault, you either have too little fuel, or too much. If you drain the carb, let the engine dry out, clean and dry out the plugs and then add a small amount of petrol "up the intake", you will quickly go through the range of too much to too little petrol as you turn the engine over. Somewhere, it should show signs of life - just for a few revolutions.

Probably you need to digest the manual, and work through what you've done.

All comments intended to provoke thoughts as to what might be wrong, not to try and assert mechanical superiority /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

[ QUOTE ]
Oh, I'm coming up to SIBS on Thursday... anybody care to take a look /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

If you're still around on Saturday.... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Andy
 
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