outboard wont start

[mtb]

QUOTE ( mtb please give documented evidence of quickstart causing fire.i have never heard of such a case and would be interested to hear exactly how it occured! )

because
it will ignite usually not at the correct point !!! two strokes it'll back fire through the carb four strokes through open valves

Now then mate
I got the bits of paper for marine engineering
mechanics
machine re laths mills grinding
welding all types
lectured in a uni re marine craft fitting
worked most of my life on boats cars trucks building plant
What have you done ?

So before you think oh I can take a pop at this bloke he Aint stood in front of me
DO ONE

Mick

 

[sailorman]

pollygonnobio
/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[ShipsWoofy]

[ QUOTE ]
What have you done ?

[/ QUOTE ] That's dangerous terratory on this forum, there is an amazing wealth of skills, professions and experiences from people who write here.

Well done on your CV, but he only asked, in a civilised way, for some proof of your statement about fires.

Which I note you have not managed to provide in your second abrupt post to this thread.

I am genuinely interested to know what is wrong with easy start my a*$£. Please be civil and educate us, you seem to know all about it.

 

[mtb]

ok so dont take my word for it
do a search on the net look for, easy start or ether

I had already said why not to use it !!!
I have watched it being used as a youngster seeing flames coming back through air intakes
and also seen the effects re damaged engines which I've had to repair

I dont think I was being abrupt but over the years on here, I've offered advice which has only come from years of working re engineering mechanics its not rocket science especially now because the internet makes every one an instant engineer but when people simply spout off it makes me think why bother

mick

 

[Allan]

As I said, it is only a theory. What I am talking about is sometimes called carbon build-up or coking. It is normally said to be caused by oil passing the rings and may be cleaned off by the solvents in easy start products.
Allan

 

[Thistle]

Change the plug. Plugs with invisible hairline cracks along the inner insulator can appear to spark OK when out but the spark will track along the crack (and not ignite the fuel) when under compression.

(Just don't ask how I know! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif)

 

[Rum_Pirate]

[ QUOTE ]
Got a good spark. Good compression, New fuel. and cleaned out the carb - What else can I do ?????

[/ QUOTE ] How big an engine?

Electric/key start?

Then my thought was ''Have you connected the kill switch?'', but you have a good spark.

While you may have cleaned out the carb did you remine the needle valve (tighten up finger tight noting number of turns to help with replacement) clean out and replace to the same position.

Is the engine in gear? Sometimes neutral is hard to locate.

Have you flooded the engine?

Is the fuel reaching the carb?

Is the fuel line bulb firm?

Are the plugs wet with fuel after trying to start for a while?

Replace the plug(s). Try starting.

Then swap the 'powerpack(s)' with another engine at try starting. They might not be providing enough oumph!

Is it a Mercrap engine? If so get rid of it.

 

[steve28]

Have you had the ignition plate off under the flywheel ?, if so it could be something there. I had a woodruff key shear on a 2.5 hp engine. gave the impression of good spark but wouldnt start because the cam that drives the points is in the wrong place.

 

[oldharry]

Re Easy Start 'addiction: I acquired a boat with a BMC 1.5. which had clearly had Easy Start used on it (there were several empty tins lying around the fuel locker) Cold starting without it would take anything up to 5 minutes cranking. Even hot it would take 30 seconds or more before it would fire.

I assumed the worst. Poor compression, worn bores etc etc. As I hated the way the poor thing struggled and leapt around when given its dose of dope, I installed an extra battery, and cranked and cranked and cranked it until finally it would gasp into life. By about half way through the season, it was cold starting after only about 2 minutes cranking time, and hot starting had similarly improved. By the end of the season it was down to about 1 minute cold start, and near normal hot.

Nevertheless I stripped it the following winter. Very little bore wear, rings gapping well within limits, bores in good shape with barely measureable ovality. I ground the valve seats to bright metal, though they didnt really need it and were all sealing fine, and reassembled it all after cleaning everything up

Cold starting still needed about 20 - 30 seconds, while hot starting was 'on the button'. So what had the 'Easy Start' done to it that made it so hard to start?

I dont know. But I never used it again, and the engine always started and ran perfectly until it was sunk in the 1990 Hurricane

 

[johnneale]

good news that, - about easystart. I also have an ancient BMS 1.5 which is getting better to start over the years. Now only requires about 20 secs of heat/intermittant cranking to repair the damage done by previous applications of the evil stuff.
Ref the crappy outboard - thanks for all the good advice and have checked/tested/pulled and sworn at the bloody thing long enough - 1 last go tomorrow and it goes in the bin. It did fire up momentarily on easystart though -

My son thinks putting acetone in diesel works well (he does have an old van) - any comments !!!!

 

[Lakesailor]

It's the plug. get a new one. if it starts for a moment on easystart it's running on a sort of compression ignition. Then packs up when the fuel takes over.

 

[ShipsWoofy]

[ QUOTE ]
It's the plug. get a new one. if it starts for a moment on easystart it's running on a sort of compression ignition. Then packs up when the fuel takes over.

[/ QUOTE ]*sigh*

I have been where the OP is, trying to get too complicated, on ickle outboards it is always the plug and for some reason I always try to convince myself it is more serious. Maybe because car plugs are so reliable, we can't beleive six months is good going on an single pot outboard.

Only last month I had a dilemma with my suzi, decided it must need the mixture checked, but oh, I changed the plug and it is now running better than it did when new.

I changed the plug in my 2ST merc about 3 times a season due to non-starting. Each time the engine roared into life.

 

[Drascomber]

Have a look at the fuel pump diaphragm.

 

[ShipsWoofy]

[ QUOTE ]

Have a look at the fuel pump diaphragm.

[/ QUOTE ]Me or the OP?

Isn't that a bit drastic, before he has exhausted other more obvious faults.

 

[graham]

I had an old 8 hp Yamaha 2 stroke not starting despite what appeared to be a healthy spark. Messed around for ages until in desperation changed the points. (Filing them isnt recommended as it removes the hard surface exposing the softer metal underneath).Started like a new engine. I did cartwheels around the shed in celebration /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif.

PS I am not an outboard engineer but I am a practical boat owner so feel entitled to add my tuppence worth..

 

[graham]

[ QUOTE ]
I changed the plug in my 2ST merc about 3 times a season due to non-starting.

[/ QUOTE ]

If it works for you Im not knocking it but

I have had a variety of outboard engines 2 stroke and 4 stroke ranging from ancient and knackered to brand new .I allways carry a spare plug and usually change it once a year .Ive never had one fail yet.

 

[Cliveshep]

If you're finally that fed up with it put it in my bin! I'll happily come and get it.

If you've got a good spark you can discount coils etc, if the plug is wet (with fuel that is of course,) change the plug, and while you are at it check the lead and if a suppressor cap is fitted check or change that too.

Did you blow out your jets with an air-line, and are you quite sure that the jetways are clear? I've got a Yammie 20 that persistantly refused to go, abuse finally got it to go screaming full chat only. Cause was corrosion in the carb jetways. Solution was "$hit or bust" as they say, I picked out all the little balls that are used to seal the jetways, re-drilled them all out (they were blocked with corrosian salts), replaced the balls with bits of lead hammered in with a small ball pein hammer to seak the drillings, blew out, refitted jets and then stuck it back on the engine.

It now starts after one pull full throttle and full choke, then one pull half throttle no choke which makes it burst into life howling, closing down the throttle to a fast idle and jiggling with the choke to keep it going for a minute or so results in an engine that once warmed up behaves impeccably and one that will happily tick over for ages without choking itself to death. Once warm restarts are first pull. The engine is probably 25 years old BTW and bought for £150 on e-bay and after a respray and new decals looks good and drives our 4m inflatable tender like the proverbial off a shovel!!

 

[Lakesailor]

I'll point out that the OP (johnneale) posted in a new thread on the 27th Feb Here that he had started the thing with a new plug.

 

[Cliveshep]

It's my age Phil, everything slows down a bit!

 

[Lakesailor]

Might have been better to report back on this thread. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif