OK - one for the DIY 'rs - Mast Chainplate addition

Can you lift the mast foot, and put it in or on something that isn't so critical of sideways loading? (Not quickly I suspect)
Can you make a foot mounting that articulates, so not 'twist' critical? ( Deck plate that hinges sideways)
Can the plates be fitted to the cockpit coaming?
 
fisherman said:
Can you lift the mast foot, and put it in or on something that isn't so critical of sideways loading? (Not quickly I suspect)
Can you make a foot mounting that articulates, so not 'twist' critical? ( Deck plate that hinges sideways)
Can the plates be fitted to the cockpit coaming?
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Sorry ... not with you ??

I have a daft Blade fitting instead of decent tabernacle. But cannot change as boom / cleats etc. on mast are too low to allow sufficient height for tabernacle sides.

The best place for plates are cabin sides ..... cockpit is too far back.
 
fisherman said:
So the blade is rigid, pin through, and if the mast falls sideways it will strain or break something? Is it two on the mast one on the deck or vice versa?
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While back - I posted pics of the mast foot snapped where it was frozen .... but it also happens if mast goes to side ....

N8E3Xmgl.jpg


repaired..

5QePNQZl.jpg


Yes .. its just a bolt through it pivots on with no side support at all ....

Weather seems to be better tomorrow ... I may trot on down the garden and measure up / take a few photies ....
 
fisherman said:
As is obvious this is way outside my skill set....
...could you have a tabernacle with the cleats etc bolted to the outside of it?
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Interesting thought .... but still doesn't get round my boom gooseneck is fixed quite low with reefing handle shaft through mast.

I looked seriously at a tabernacle swap ... but the sides would be too short to really benefit.... and anyway - even with a tabernacle - I have seen bent masts ... they still need guiding as they lower / raise.
 
If a tabernacle were to be really useful in holding mast central it would have to have cheeks that extended aft from the mast baseso providing side support to the mast while both vertical and near horizontal. ie a great big 1/4 circle shape. I think peopel who rely on tabernacle side members to hold mast central have just been lucky as the dimension of the side members (cheeks) are usually similar to mast dimension so at mast near horizontal have no real support. Any Nigel is no where near ready to replace mast pivot base with tabernacle.
One poster seem to suggest mast sideways swing be tolerated. by base design. Well yes it is good if base can tolerate some swing but swing is in itself terrifying as the more the mast swings the more the boat heels so the more the mast swings.
Just how tightly themast needs to be kept central is an interesting question. Hence my previous comments re tolerance of stay pivot point versus mast pivot point. 5 degrees or so of swing should be tolerable. (my use of small pin in a big hole helps here) Accuracy of stay pivot is desirable but given that many of us use just human power to hold mast central perhaps not so important.
The idea I think of a bar replacing pivot pin which extends out to gunwhale to take temporary stays is interesting however i suspect it will be a pain top set up and remove. Easier of course to locate ends with temporary stays which will still be needed to support the bar. I imagine the bar being bendable.
Hope the weather improves Nigel along with your back problems. ol'will
 
Tabernacle side cheeks ? Whether they extended aft or fwd makes no difference in fact. The pivot of a Tabernacle is near top of the side cheeks, with bottom of mast swinging UP as the mast lowers. This means that both parts of mast from pivot become unsupported by side cheeks.

OK - the horizontal bar idea .... the blade mount has a number of holes along its blade - so you can choose which to use for mast ... setting it more fwd or aft as desired. At present I have mine at the most fwd hole - in fact a mistake made when raising mast last time ... its too far fwd now. I should have set it one hole back.
Anyway - I have two holes aft of mast on the blade ... so the bar may not be exactly centred to pivot - but is only a couple of cm's different. The question is length of bar .... and to also secure ends to stop bar bending up / aft etc.
So lets put that idea aside and return to the toerail chainplates.

Simple geometry says that if we raise the pivot point of the cap shroud to that of the mast pivot - that no matter what angle of mast - the measurements remain same and mast is held from swinging to side. If we do not raise the cap shroud pivot point - as mast lowers - the cap shrouds slack and mast swings.
I thought of a bar to fix to cap shroud chainplate - then V pendants to maintain it vertical and in line with mast base. The cap shroud could then be clipped to the top of the bar maintaining the pivot point level with mast pivot.

BUT - I am concerned about the bend or kink that could be put into the cap shroud at that point, it is 1x19 - not the most agreeable wire to bend so !
Therefore we are back to use of extra stays of correct length to do the job and allow cap shrouds to slack of naturally.

I don't even need to obtain stainless wire etc. Rope would be fine and allow a certain amount of 'stretch' if overtight.

So far my plan seems to be evolving into a length of metal pipe .... slot cut into bottom to allow a pin to go through pipe and U shroud fastening ..... short stud bar through top of pipe for threaded rings to be fitted to take the pendants which then attach to the fwd and aft baby stays (inners for those who prefer)U fastenings - keeping pipe fixed vertical. The temp stay also being fastened to the top of pipe. The pipe can be alloy pipe from local DIY shop .... nothing special really as the pendants will take the major strain ...
Simple and cheap.

Once weather improves ... will need to place a long straight edge across cabin top to measure height needed etc.

The cabin side extra plates still gets me wondering .... wasn't it the Centaur or Pageant that had a stay to either side of cabin ?? I know many had the fwd baby stay - and a lot of people removed that as it caused lock-ups when tacking.
 
If the mast really can't be suitably controlled in descent, then in the end a U/J of some sort for the mast mounting, pin through for for/aft, hinge for side to side?? Lot of weight on the fitting when the rig is tensioned. Same as using smaller bolts as you said earlier. Hence my suggestion of lifting the mast and placing the foot in something, in its most rudimentary, like a bucket. A spare fully articulating mounting just ahead of the regular one, to shift the foot to. As I said, these are rough and ready fisherman type options, not pretty.
The existing fitting can't do what it looks like it's supposed to do, stop the mast falling sideways. It's a poor pice of engineering.
 
fisherman said:
If the mast really can't be suitably controlled in descent, then in the end a U/J of some sort for the mast mounting, pin through for for/aft, hinge for side to side?? Lot of weight on the fitting when the rig is tensioned. Same as using smaller bolts as you said earlier. Hence my suggestion of lifting the mast and placing the foot in something, in its most rudimentary, like a bucket. A spare fully articulating mounting just ahead of the regular one, to shift the foot to. As I said, these are rough and ready fisherman type options, not pretty.
The existing fitting can't do what it looks like it's supposed to do, stop the mast falling sideways. It's a poor pice of engineering.
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I like the post ... has me smiling and I am not trying to be rude.

The mast is ***** heavy for its size ... to carry it comfortably - 2 strong or 3 average people because of the furling gear as well. There is no way anyone could 'lift and move foot' while vertical - it would take crane or derrick.

I totally agree that whoever designed the Blade system must have had a stinking hangover and wanted to punish the world.

Here's the thread I had a while back when the mast foot snapped :

Looking for replacement mast foot

I know some like the mount - but I have always disliked it - but cannot change it due to mast measurements at lower level.
 
Hi Nigel I like the idea of poles at gunwhale stayed fore and aft to take a temporary side stay to stabilise mast when traversing down.
The problem with additional chain plates to the cabin side is the height required above cabin side which would be just a nuisance except when needed.
The most common arrangement around here is for the pipe on chain plate to be part of the normal cap shroud load path. ie turnscrews above pole. If you wnet this way would require you shorten cap shrouds. (by about 50cms ) ol'will
 
William_H said:
Hi Nigel I like the idea of poles at gunwhale stayed fore and aft to take a temporary side stay to stabilise mast when traversing down.
The problem with additional chain plates to the cabin side is the height required above cabin side which would be just a nuisance except when needed.
The most common arrangement around here is for the pipe on chain plate to be part of the normal cap shroud load path. ie turnscrews above pole. If you wnet this way would require you shorten cap shrouds. (by about 50cms ) ol'will
Click to expand...

I thought about modifying Cap Shrouds - but TBH ... its easier to just get two bits of pipe ... some pendants and set up an extra temp stay each side. I have a stormsl halyard that is unused - just sits there via a block on mast front. I can use that to run stays up ... basically a line with 'eye' halfway along ... stormsl halyard made fast the eye ... haul it up ... make off lower ends of line to the pipes.

You have to remember that we don't have the same facilities over here as in UK / other areas. Our local yacht service closed due to lack of biz.
 
OK ... braved the wind and freezing rain out there ....

Measured the height from U fixing on Toerail to level with mast pivot = ~17" .... so allowing for hole in 'pipe' - an item 18" long is needed ....

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I know ... boat is scruffy ..... so would you be left out in all that sh** !!
 
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