Oi, Mr R Y A!

[Guest]

My International Cert of Competence has come up for renewal. But since I first took it out, I have taken my Yachtmasters ticket, and isnt that embossed on its cover "certificate of competence"? Thinking that maybe I didnt need the International version any longer, I checked up - only to find that the Yachtmaster ticket, touted by the RYA as the Internationally recognised gold standard isnt - recognised , that is.

So what use is my Yachtmaster? It isnt needed in the UK, it isnt recognised abroad ,and I dont even need it to teach evening classes.

But filling in the form for ICC renewal rubbed salt into the wound. The cost was £29 - for a rubber stamp on a pre printed form. Of course, you get it free if you are a member of the RYA, which costs (you guessed it) £28. Isnt that a coincidence.

It seems to me that I am being taken advantage of by the very organisation that I expect to look after my interests. So Mr RYA
1/ what use is the Yachtmasters ticket (not the training, the Ticket)?
2/ Why is it not put into a form that is acceptable to foreigners?
3/ Why does it cost £29 to issue when normally inefficient government departments can issue similar docs (Radio license, SSSI) for less?
4/ Is it really coincidence that it cost £1 more than membership, and arrives in the same envelope as a membership form? Does it really cost more to make out an ICC than to make out a membership card and provide all the RYA's services.?

Does anyone think that I will get answers?

 

[Guest]

You will get an answer

because the esteemed YM editorial staff are like pit bulls on such issues. Watergate will pale in the annals of investigative history as the challenging questions are demanded of the RYA ... well, we hope so!

Of course if you joined the RYA you would get your ICC, sail numbers AND access to the RYA Visa card so maybe the £28 is worth it

 

[BarryH]

Re: Old School and Antiques

That is basically what the RYA boils down to. I know it sounds bad, but from my experiences, my membership fees have been a total waste of money, on the surface I have gained nothing by being a member....well on of the nice ladies at the boat show said "...it does allow you to wear the house flag, its only £11.99 for one".

I dont think I'll be renewing next year!! Unless someone knows better.

 

[jtwebb]

Re: Old School and Antiques

There is always the cheaper insurance. I have tried others but stay with the RYA insurers. Anyhow, you might not agree with all they do and many do not. Unfortunately, one should support them and certainly not complain if they charge non members more. Perhaps some would prefer some nice government department? They would at least insist on qualifications for all those people who buy large power boats and presume they behave the same as their cars. My day was made when I saw a nice Fairline 68 hit the Brambles at full speed, that got rid of one load of wash.

J Webb

 

[rich]

i have been boating for 35years, do i need to pay £400 to take a test,for a useless bit of paper!

rich

 

[LadyInBed]

Re: ICC

Surly the only time you need an ICC is when you take a boat inland onto the canals, trail sail or hire a motorboat /sailboat in France.
My Diver Cox endorsement was sufficient to get me a ‘motorboat’ ICC (not sailing boat). Which was all I needed when I took my Motor Sailer to the Med via the canals, as by then, the mast was down, so I was a motorboat.

 

[walter]

Howard I totally agree with you, I too took the yachtmaster exam years ago only to find out its a worthless piece of paper and all you need is the ICC, they give those away to anybody especially if you book a holiday on a boat with certain companies. So in my book the yachtmaster ticket is totally devalued, If they issued Day Skipper Practical , Coastal Skipper and Yachtmaster Practical certificates and printed a page in several languages that would be of far more value than any ICC and make it worthwhile going for the tickets.

 

[longjohnsilver]

Re: Old School and Antiques

Have been an RYA member for years, but a little upset at hearing someone take pleasure in anothers misfortune. Agree that there are uninformed and inconsiderate powerboat users, but same applies to many yotties also. Would be far better if we all got on, but suppose that is unrealistic.

 

[walter]

One point you made that i missed, is it fact you dont need to be a yachtmaster to teach evening classes now ???

 

[claymore]

I taught RYA shorebased courses at evening class in 1981 - 84 before I'd completed my practical. The recommendation from the RYA to our school was that I undertook my practical asap.

 

[BarryD]

Re: Old School and Antiques

Re: Fairline 68 running aground at speed - I suppose that you laugh at the famine pictures in the Sunday comics as well? Pretty poor statement jtwebb even if you meant it in jest.

Qualification / consistent training level is needed not just for power boaters but also for yotties to ensure that all water users operate at a minimum standard of capability. It doesn''t reall matter if you are in a power boat or yatch - if you've no brains, then you've no brains. Don't most yatchs have those horrible, horrible, nasty, lumps of metal called engines in them?

Havoc, fire, confusion, and mis-trust, yes my work here is done...

Barry D

 

[billskip]

Reuch..but i agree BarryD..NM

Bill
www.aegeansailing.co.uk

 

[Chris_Stannard]

Like you I am a Yacht Master. some time ago the Yachting Monthly produced a page which said that the Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate is acceptable Worldwide as proof of Competence. It then had a translation in 8 other languages which include French and Dutch. It included the advice to cut the page out and keep it with your certificate which I did.

Perhaps Yachting Monthly would care to comment aas to whether or not this is still valid, and perhaps it is time to re-issue it. If this is not the case someone should tell us.

If this is not acceptable in France I would like to know, but i did not have any problems in Holland

Chris Stannard

 

[JohnR]

Re: Old School and Antiques

Yea but you can get the same cheaper insurance through supporting the RNLI

 

[dave_gibsea]

Re: Old School and Antiques

Have to agree. It's not nice to take pleasure in others misfortune. I've been sailing since I was 6, raced dinghies all my life, cruised extensivly, chartered. I've been a member of the RYA on an' off for years and can honestly say it's been little use and poor if nill value for money. On the subject of competence I'd say the greatest problem is poorly maintained boats, both motor and sail. The worst thing is when the life boat is called out to a sailing yacht because of engine failure!!! - a more frequent event than we might like to think.

 

[Guest]

Re: Old School and Antiques

In answer to Walter, the RYA line seems to be that the ticket is required, but if you dont have it - well OK! The long term training officer at our club is retiring, and his successor has not got the Yachtmaster ticket. I am told that the RYA has agreed this .

 

[BarryH]

Re: Old School and Antiques

The underlying consensuss (Spelling?) seems to be that training should be needed/taken by those who use the many types of boats. Cant argue with that, I've been using boats for years both sail and power and I'm still learning things. But you dont need to join an organisation for that. Lets face it if you want to learn to drive you dont have to join the RAC. OK the RYA has been or have appointed themselves as the moderators for the various schemes and their content. But you dont go to the RYA to get the training, you go to a sailing or powerboat school. They have a biased view IMHO as you pay them not the RYA for the training, yet you learn to drive, the driving school teach you but you go to the D.O.T for the test! How many of us would really have passed if the same system was used for say,... day skipper or power boat certs.........Makes you think.......Then maybe the fast gin palace would'nt have gone aground, because that was only caused by bad seamanship!!!!! Go on, tell me otherwise.

 

[jtwebb]

I accept the point about others misfortune but he came to no harm it seems as we monitored the radio traffic for some time and could have got there in about 30 mins. However, many power boats appear to deliberately target smaller boats. One Cowes firework night one managed to roll our 32 ft gunwales in as he went past at very high speed about one boat length away. There have been too many other incidents as well including my wife being forced out of the channel near Port Solent as there were several 'keeping to the left', damaged moorings, picking up anchor buoys to moor to etc. We have seen a small power boat break down in the path of a freighter. He had ignored a recall on the engine, had no radio, no lifejackets and had just bought it as it seemed a good idea. It is predominately power boats who do such things as that is where they tend to start. I think it arises because anyone can go and buy a boat, of any type, and use it without any idea of what to do. I feel basic training should be required.

J Webb

 

[Col]

<He had ignored a recall on the engine, had no radio, no lifejackets and had just bought it as it seemed a good idea.>

I suppose there has never been a yotty that has done the same!

( funnily enough that lifeboat program featured 2 yotties who had done just that, One in a very rough sea ! Both had to be towed by RNLI)

 

[billskip]

A raggi (english man chartering) had an engine problem outside aegina harbour..dead flat sea favourable light breeze.. not more than couple hundred meters off.. depth,ground,sea ideal for anchor..could have swim, towed boat in with dinghy etc etc...but he sent out a maday.. when the agistri ferry towed him in he got a lot of stick......then what can be said about the 40ft searay going at full chat over the same streach of water..hits a dinghy with man+3kids fishing man killed andkids saved...

Bill
www.aegeansailing.co.uk