KellysEye
Well-Known Member
Bear in mind marinas charge more for catamarans than monohulls because they need a wider berth so other yachts are able to enter.
Ocean Yachts
- Thread starter Power2Sail
- Start date
CAPTAIN FANTASTIC
Well-Known Member
Have a look at the Island Packet yachts; high quality and high price.
Monique
Well-Known Member
An Amel Santorin or Super Maramu must be on your list. They were designed to go RTW with a retired couple as sole crew. (yes, partner and I qualify as "olde" farts). We are now in Fiji having started in Turkey....
GL
GL
ip485
Well-Known Member
Please can I chip in with another strong recommendation for an Island Packet. (I know, of course I would).
However, I really do believe the larger models (and the smaller, but maybe ideally less so given your plans) have an awful lot to offer.
First of, people complain about speed, or lack of, but at the 50 foot level, it just isnt true. We steam along at around 7 knots in any reasonable wind and the same under motor.
The boat is very sea kindly, very comfortable to live on board permanently, well made and now, surprisingly good value.
I find increasingly as I have go to know mine, there is very very little not to like.
However, I really do believe the larger models (and the smaller, but maybe ideally less so given your plans) have an awful lot to offer.
First of, people complain about speed, or lack of, but at the 50 foot level, it just isnt true. We steam along at around 7 knots in any reasonable wind and the same under motor.
The boat is very sea kindly, very comfortable to live on board permanently, well made and now, surprisingly good value.
I find increasingly as I have go to know mine, there is very very little not to like.
rotrax
Well-Known Member
+1!
We had an IP 350 for almost seven seasons and now have an SP Cruiser.
The performance under both sail and motor of both vessels has always been as expected-we never thought our heavy long keelers with lots of tools and cruising kit would be able to match the lightweight flyers.
Both are really good alongside or on the hook, important when living aboard for 5 months at a time.
The build quality on both of ours is far better than we expected and the sea kindlyness found when making longish-for us-passages is much appreciated.
An IP, especially in the larger sizes would certainly be worth a look.
They are cheaper in the US and often in the Caribean.
dunedin
Well-Known Member
Probably cheaper but massively slower, than the X-yacht Xc45 or a reasonably modern Halberg Rassy, both of which are a great balance of ocean cruiser and great sailing ability
ip485
Well-Known Member
Not as much as you might think.
Blue water with two aboard is about sure and steady. The IPs will grind out the miles with the crew in comfort - as a result they may get there a few hours later than if Xc-45 is being worked hard, but thats about it. Most of the time I set full sails and we carry that downwind well up into the 30+ knots. She just goes, minimium effort, comfort making passages. Many a times, especailly downwind we are their before most yachts in the 45 foot range, especially if it blows up a bit.
Blue water with two aboard is about sure and steady. The IPs will grind out the miles with the crew in comfort - as a result they may get there a few hours later than if Xc-45 is being worked hard, but thats about it. Most of the time I set full sails and we carry that downwind well up into the 30+ knots. She just goes, minimium effort, comfort making passages. Many a times, especailly downwind we are their before most yachts in the 45 foot range, especially if it blows up a bit.
dunedin
Well-Known Member
Not my experience. And most boats can carry full sail downwind in 30 knots - but if can carry that upwind simply means under canvassed and will sit and slat the sails in lower wind speeds.
ARC Results tend to give a a good indication of typical laden cruising boats actual archived speeds on a typical largely downwind blue water sail. Worth a look by the OP for the sorts of boats typically going moderate blue water.
ip485
Well-Known Member
Dunedin - I know we will beg to disagree and there is much wisdom in all you say, but, from experience, blue water is about lots of down wind sailing, comfortable living (on passage, but just as importantly, in harbour which is where you spend most of your time), motoring ability (the stats tells us that many spend 50% of their time under motor), and not just about getting their first. However, and I know its the top end of their range, but if you actually. look at where the 485 has finished in many ocean races (for cruisers) it isnt too dusty either.
However, horse for courses, I am very happy with the 485, having sailed lots of other yachts as well, and spent most of my life on "proper" racers.
However, horse for courses, I am very happy with the 485, having sailed lots of other yachts as well, and spent most of my life on "proper" racers.
ashtead
Well-Known Member
Not an owner but I'm sure IP are lovely yachts for sailing purposes but not so handy in marinas maybe as some of the other models mentioned. I think a Southerly with a lifting keel or other lifter might be more useful for the OP but thats entirrely dependent on plans. Im sure with practice berthing an IP becomes simpler but for the unitiated might be more of a challenge . That said one visited our marina recently having been acquired in the Med and looked a substantial yacht and plenty of space for all the cruisng kit I suspect one accumulates.
ip485
Well-Known Member
Ashtead - may more than you would think. We draw 5 foot 3 inches which is surprisingly little for a 55 foot, 23 ton yacht and means there arent many places we cant get. With a bow thruster they can manouever just as well as a fin keel. in fact it is usually most modern fin keels that cant get in (or out). To be fair of course we cant compete with a Southerly, but only by a few inches over a couple of feet.
The mast and cutter rig has some advantages. The IP was designed to get under the waterway bridges in the States, so when many fin keelers would be a few feet too high, the IP will squeeze beneath.
Needless to say if you are unlucky enough to hit anything or go aground, fully or otherwise, the long and fully encapsulated keel is highly likely to survive, and keel bolts are not something we know about.
There are some advantages getting into those tropical lagoons and under those bridges in so many waterways, in what is, after all a pretty reasonable sized yacht.
You are aslo correct they do have the volume. I have a Genset, full sized washing machine dryer, diving compressor, room for a couple of bikes (not folded) in the rear lazarette and full sized chest fridge and freezer, with 300 gallons of diesel and 350 gallons of water, not to mention all the locker space under the floor. You would get 24 cases of wine in the main bilge without a second thought if you really wanted to, and I can sit in the engine room and polish the metalwork.
There are some advantages which sailors may not realise with so few long keelers around (relatively) these days.
The mast and cutter rig has some advantages. The IP was designed to get under the waterway bridges in the States, so when many fin keelers would be a few feet too high, the IP will squeeze beneath.
Needless to say if you are unlucky enough to hit anything or go aground, fully or otherwise, the long and fully encapsulated keel is highly likely to survive, and keel bolts are not something we know about.
There are some advantages getting into those tropical lagoons and under those bridges in so many waterways, in what is, after all a pretty reasonable sized yacht.
You are aslo correct they do have the volume. I have a Genset, full sized washing machine dryer, diving compressor, room for a couple of bikes (not folded) in the rear lazarette and full sized chest fridge and freezer, with 300 gallons of diesel and 350 gallons of water, not to mention all the locker space under the floor. You would get 24 cases of wine in the main bilge without a second thought if you really wanted to, and I can sit in the engine room and polish the metalwork.
There are some advantages which sailors may not realise with so few long keelers around (relatively) these days.
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Monique
Well-Known Member
For all you IP owners... you all drank the "CoolAid" ... a bit like me for Amel.
I considered an IP before buying an Amel SM. I also have 2 mates who own IP's and their main conversation when they meet is "how slow they can go"...
Teasing says he!
I considered an IP before buying an Amel SM. I also have 2 mates who own IP's and their main conversation when they meet is "how slow they can go"...
Teasing says he!
rotrax
Well-Known Member
Point taken, but to be fair, if any of us wished to travel fast on water we certainly would not have chosed sail power...........................
chrisclaydon
Active Member
I'd strongly recommend you go down the catamaran route. Most people cruising the tropics do. Monohulls are rapidly becoming as rare in the tropics as big cats are in Europe, for good reasons.
You can get a lot more cat for your money if you go for a less well known brand (but professionally designed and built) or one-off custom. Also look at buying one overseas because there are bargains to be had when good boats are stuck in odd places.
For known brands, Catana and Outremer are both excellent. For a one-off or less well known brand you can find really high quality boats by designers like Alexander Verheus and Morelli and Melvin, mostly (but not all) professionally built to high standards. Schionning and Crowther have some nice designs too but the quality depends who built them.
Lagoon and Leopard are mass produced to a price for the charter market when new. Used ones are overpriced just because they are a known and familiar brand. Most are tired ex-charter boats. Most of them have too many cabins and too many heads. You want the "owners layout". Watch out for repaired hurricane damage when buying ex-charter in the caribbean. Private yachts generally get out of the caribbean in hurricane season but charter boats don't.
For a mid-size cat and perhaps more in your price range look at the Manta. It has some really nice features like the big comfortable seat with a view running across the stern arch.
If you insist on a monohull then you can't do better than the Bestevaer, really top quality bulletproof alloy yachts from the Netherlands.
Make sure to view lots of boats and browse ALL the boat porn on sites like yachtworld.com. If buying cats you really have to look worldwide because most of them sail away from Europe and never come back, the second-hand market good throughout the tropics and in Australia/NZ.
You can get a lot more cat for your money if you go for a less well known brand (but professionally designed and built) or one-off custom. Also look at buying one overseas because there are bargains to be had when good boats are stuck in odd places.
For known brands, Catana and Outremer are both excellent. For a one-off or less well known brand you can find really high quality boats by designers like Alexander Verheus and Morelli and Melvin, mostly (but not all) professionally built to high standards. Schionning and Crowther have some nice designs too but the quality depends who built them.
Lagoon and Leopard are mass produced to a price for the charter market when new. Used ones are overpriced just because they are a known and familiar brand. Most are tired ex-charter boats. Most of them have too many cabins and too many heads. You want the "owners layout". Watch out for repaired hurricane damage when buying ex-charter in the caribbean. Private yachts generally get out of the caribbean in hurricane season but charter boats don't.
For a mid-size cat and perhaps more in your price range look at the Manta. It has some really nice features like the big comfortable seat with a view running across the stern arch.
If you insist on a monohull then you can't do better than the Bestevaer, really top quality bulletproof alloy yachts from the Netherlands.
Make sure to view lots of boats and browse ALL the boat porn on sites like yachtworld.com. If buying cats you really have to look worldwide because most of them sail away from Europe and never come back, the second-hand market good throughout the tropics and in Australia/NZ.
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